Comment On Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

Back in August of 2006, I published Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking. Among other things, the article described what the experience was like for visitors to Marlboro.com: If you were using something other than Internet Explorer, you likely experienced a familiar sight: a blank page as a result of the site being coded for IE only. In and of it self, that's not too big of a deal, even for #20 on the Fortune 500 List, Altria. [expand full text]
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Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 09:36 • by Math Penguin (unregistered)
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As a web designer, things like this make me cringe.

Seriously, what possible logic goes into something like this?

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 09:36 • by Yep (unregistered)
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2nd?!

All I gotta say is: Wow.

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 09:37 • by DonkeyRyan
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<meta name="description" content="You can't see me.">

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 09:41 • by durnurd
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It may be a generated page that automatically redirects to the right place based on server variables....

Although since the link still has "MAR2006" in it, that's questionable.

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 09:41 • by Sam B (unregistered)
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<meta http-equiv="Refresh" content="1; url=http://the/concept/of/this/tag/eludes/smokers" />

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 09:43 • by Toy (unregistered)
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Pure all-around incompetence.

I am pretty sure the guy who coded this already knew that he was improvising while he was writing this.

Thus:
I'm going to become rich and famous after I invent a device that allows you to stab non-google-familiarized coders in the face over the internet (TM: bash.org)

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 09:44 • by Senitor Khan (unregistered)
209678 in reply to 209674
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Content? Microsoft Visual Studio .NET 7.1

For... a refresh? GOD NO!

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 09:45 • by secundum (unregistered)
209679 in reply to 209667
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<quote>now has a teases the user via setTimeout, making the user's anticipation and excitement grow for a full second until they're redirected</quote>

No they are not. It waits a second before displaying the "Your browser does not support javascript" message.

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 09:48 • by d000hg (unregistered)
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I want more follow-ups from classic WTFs. Where IS Paula for instance?

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 09:49 • by Andy L. (unregistered)
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"it's almost accessible to users with JavaScript."

You probably meant "without JavaScript" there?

Ed: Fixed!

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 10:00 • by matthewr81
209684 in reply to 209667
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<meta> tags were removed; now how will search engines circa 1996 know how to index the content?


Maybe this will be the first site that Cuil will be able to properly index, it sounds almost as messed up as it.

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 10:01 • by Gnonthgol
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TRWTF is Alex visiting Marlboro.com

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 10:02 • by Where theres smoke (unregistered)
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Look, some lowly programmer is doing his very best to protect children from smoking ads, without the evil corporate bosses getting wise to his work. Now you've gone and blown his cover. Nice work, jackass.

Anyway, we warned the MSIE users of the dangers of their browser (and Javascript) now it can actually kill them by enticing them to smoke. Is it any wonder Firefox market share is growing?

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 10:02 • by Smash King
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Gotta love a website that unintentionally blocks out some of their customers because of their browser. It's almost as if they wanted to promote IE more than their own products. Are they in any way affiliated with Microsoft?

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 10:21 • by PSWorx
209691 in reply to 209687
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Where theres smoke:
Look, some lowly programmer is doing his very best to protect children from smoking ads, without the evil corporate bosses getting wise to his work. Now you've gone and blown his cover. Nice work, jackass.

Anyway, we warned the MSIE users of the dangers of their browser (and Javascript) now it can actually kill them by enticing them to smoke. Is it any wonder Firefox market share is growing?


Post nominated for blue color!

Smash King:
It's almost as if they wanted to promote IE more than their own products. Are they in any way affiliated with Microsoft?


Not really. If they were, they would do the redirect using Silverlight and a proprietary COM component.

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 10:23 • by snoofle
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So... what, exactly, does Marlboro put in the cigarettes that they give to their web developers?

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 10:47 • by Steve (unregistered)
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TRWTF's are:

1.) Hosting with ASP.Net, and coding with .jsp
(Real Developers will also spot TRWTF is for using .Net or IIS in the first place)

2.) Using JavaScript to redirect

3.) "updating" the website to XHTML only to keep deprecated crap like: language="javascript" in.

4.) Using JavaScript to un-hide the hidden content if the user doesn't have JavaScript enabled... then add insult to injury by not making any physical call to the check() function.

5.) Having a domain "Marlboro.com", then not actually using it for anything but a re-direct.

6.) Not showing the super cool cowboy enjoying a soothing relaxing smoke.

7.) Not following the Daily WTF, and thus realizing your code is posted, and you look like a tool!

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 10:49 • by krupa (unregistered)
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Even when I was smoking Marlboro cigarettes I wouldn't have spent so much energy trying to view their website. It's like creating a user account on a toilet-paper manufacturer's site.

"But if I submit enough Squares, I can redeem them for Quilted Northern branded merchandise!"

not xhtml either

2008-08-01 10:51 • by MC (unregistered)
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They declare the namespace to be xhtml but the code is not xhtml complaint. The script tags don't have the required "type" attribute, for one. They only have the language attribute.

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 10:51 • by Charles400 (unregistered)
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WARNING: The Surgeon General has determined that using Microsoft Internet Explorer maybe hazardous to your health.

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 10:56 • by DOA
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What I don't understand is the whole point of the Marlboro website. Or any other tobacco company site. Who the hell has absolutely nowhere else to go and visits this sites?

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 11:04 • by Massimo (unregistered)
209713 in reply to 209692
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snoofle:
So... what, exactly, does Marlboro put in the cigarettes that they give to their web developers?


Blue color.
Now.

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 11:12 • by m0ffx (unregistered)
209716 in reply to 209710
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DOA:
What I don't understand is the whole point of the Marlboro website. Or any other tobacco company site. Who the hell has absolutely nowhere else to go and visits this sites?

Well, whoever submitted this WTF, for one.

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 11:13 • by Brent H. (unregistered)
209718 in reply to 209674
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Sam B:
<meta http-equiv="Refresh" content="1; url=http://the/concept/of/this/tag/eludes/smokers" />


Or how about response.redirect("http://go/someplace/else")?

I think that's what is implied by the edit at the end of the article. IMHO, the real WTF is that they aren't redirecting with server code.

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 11:13 • by Epynom (unregistered)
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ummm...

Response.Redirect( someURL); ?

If you're running .Net, Use it!

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 11:13 • by a real programmer (unregistered)
209720 in reply to 209705
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Steve:
TRWTF's are:

3.) "updating" the website to XHTML only to keep deprecated crap like: language="javascript" in.


Oh get real, when exactly did it become a crime to not force your customers to use the latest resource hogging browser of your choice?

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 11:17 • by Jon (unregistered)
209722 in reply to 209688
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Smash King:
Gotta love a website that unintentionally blocks out some of their customers because of their browser. It's almost as if they wanted to promote IE more than their own products. Are they in any way affiliated with Microsoft?


Evil begets evil ...

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 11:20 • by Rick (unregistered)
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So, what does the loc function do? It appears to set an unused variable, and call it good.....

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 11:21 • by 301 Fan (unregistered)
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Why use a simple 301 when clunky js will work just as well, except when it doesn't?

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 11:26 • by brunascle (unregistered)
209725 in reply to 209723
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Rick:
So, what does the loc function do? It appears to set an unused variable, and call it good.....


it set's window.location, which will redirect the browser. the default scope is the window object, so you can access its functions and properties without typing window.

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 11:27 • by Rick (unregistered)
209728 in reply to 209725
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brunascle:
Rick:
So, what does the loc function do? It appears to set an unused variable, and call it good.....


it set's window.location, which will redirect the browser. the default scope is the window object, so you can access its functions and properties without typing window.


Ahh... lack of JS knowledge fail....

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 11:49 • by Izzy (unregistered)
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The one second delay is so you'll have time to light up.

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 11:59 • by my name is missing (unregistered)
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This is an official Your Brain On Tobacco site.

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 12:10 • by danixdefcon5
209737 in reply to 209719
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Brent H.:

Or how about response.redirect("http://go/someplace/else")?

Epynom:
Response.Redirect( someURL); ?
We have the solution for both Java and .NET platforms here!

TRWTF is that .Net Capitalizes The Methods When They Should Be lowercase. Classes Are Capitalized, methods are not. ;)

Anyway, either the <meta> refresh tag or response.redirect methods are way more effective than any kind of JS redirect. Why use JS at all???

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 12:10 • by Maurits
209738 in reply to 209735
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Technically, the "Refresh" header is non-standard, as is its <meta http-equiv> equivalent.
</pedant>

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 12:14 • by Don't help them, they're evil (unregistered)
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Well all the hip kids today are using Firefox... ...and we're not allowed to advertise to kids...

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 12:14 • by Also a big geek (unregistered)
209740 in reply to 209692
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snoofle:
So... what, exactly, does Marlboro put in the cigarettes that they give to their web developers?

Pure, lab-grade stupid, that's what.

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 12:22 • by RowanTheOrangUtan (unregistered)
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Why didn't they put the call to check() inside a finally block? They ALWAYS execute.

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 12:33 • by pmv (unregistered)
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This is truly a gem. Clearly Phillip Morris's cousin's brother's son took a class in Bizzaro Web Development. Either that or it was a spy from the Camel Cigarettes people.

CAPTCHA: damnum (damn-um?)

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 12:53 • by CynicalTyler (unregistered)
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Maybe it's because I'm not a smoker and I don't get it, but isn't SmokerSignup.com like... the worst name for a website ever?

"Admit that smoking defines your character and affixes you with an unremovable label! Join our website!"

"Does the pitiful dangled-carrot of potential coupons make you want to self identify as a rotting, cancerous mass? Join our website!"

It would be less insulting if they called it SuperHappyFunTimeCigaretteClub.com

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 12:57 • by Mitch (unregistered)
209749 in reply to 209680
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d000hg:
I want more follow-ups from classic WTFs. Where IS Paula for instance?


Paula? I prefer Irish Girl.

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 12:57 • by Edward Royce (unregistered)
209750 in reply to 209742
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RowanTheOrangUtan:
Why didn't they put the call to check() inside a finally block? They ALWAYS execute.


Oh don't you start that up again.

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 13:15 • by Zylon
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"compromosing"?

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 13:16 • by Francisco (unregistered)
209755 in reply to 209707
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krupa:
Even when I was smoking Marlboro cigarettes I wouldn't have spent so much energy trying to view their website. It's like creating a user account on a toilet-paper manufacturer's site.

"But if I submit enough Squares, I can redeem them for Quilted Northern branded merchandise!"


Over here, i.e. in the UK, there is a toilet paper manufacturer that puts tokens on the wrapping of the product but you can only redeem the tokens on its website.

Ps.
I haven't been to it but noticed it the other.

Pps.
Marvin (Mode:=On)

Just when you thought that life could not get weirder, it does.

Marvin (Mode:=Off)

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 13:32 • by Da' Man (unregistered)
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Well, just enough time to smoke one before this page loads...

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 14:01 • by Aaron (unregistered)
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If you're bored, go let 'em know:

http://www.philipmorrisusa.com/en/cms/contact_us/contact_us.aspx?src=footer_nav

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 14:27 • by Scott (unregistered)
209765 in reply to 209679
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Which is displayed using... Wait for it....

Javascript.

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 14:46 • by Dirge (unregistered)
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I once saw a website generated by MS Word where the pages appeared normal at first, but in which the links on the page (which were "button"-type images of some kind) weren't working for some users.

When I looked a little closer, I discovered that each image had its own client-side image map attached to it to determine where the user had clicked (even though they were individual buttons). The image map called JavaScript functions which performed a redirect just like the code from the Marlboro site.

If I remember correctly, the URL to redirect to was passed from the image map. So the link in the image map would have been something like "javascript:DoRedirect("http://someserver/somepage.asp");".

At least it wasn't a server-side image map, I guess.

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 15:18 • by Lazy_wonko_Not_Logging_in (unregistered)
209767 in reply to 209719
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Epynom:
ummm...

Response.Redirect( someURL); ?

If you're running .Net, Use it!


Response.Redirect sends a 302 response to the browser (Temp Redirect) Google and other search engines will pick up on this and not index the page that you redirect to.
This needs to be a 301 Redirect, which Im not sure you can do in .net without fiddling)

Although I seriously doubt that they follow the JS redirect either...

At least at the moment they will locate and follow the link on the page, unless of course google picks up on the fact that the link is in a display:none block and ignores it?

Re: Follow-up: Redirection with Smoke And ... Smoking

2008-08-01 15:22 • by Lazy_wonko_Not_Logging_in (unregistered)
209768 in reply to 209744
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pmv:
This is truly a gem. Clearly Phillip Morris's cousin's brother's son took a class in Bizzaro Web Development. Either that or it was a spy from the Camel Cigarettes people.

CAPTCHA: damnum (damn-um?)


<annoying>
Wouldn't his cousins brother also be his cousin?
</annoying>

Sorry.
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