Comment On The Angry MD

After a few weeks of searching, Steven M's job prospects were looking pretty grim. [expand full text]
« PrevPage 1 | Page 2 | Page 3 | Page 4Next »

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:07 • by Ello (unregistered)
Sorry, I don't get it.
I read it twice, but really i can't get the point of the story.

It was just a "strange" interview, nothing more, or wasn't it?

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:12 • by Tim Ward (unregistered)
392695 in reply to 392694
Well, the interviewer hadn't read the CV before walking into the interview room, but so what else is new?

It's hardly rare to be given a CV completely out of the blue and be told "you're interviewing this guy now, he's waiting for you in such-and-such a room".

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:13 • by SlainVeteran (unregistered)
He didn't realise there was a second side to the CV which is why he was asking about all the meaningless jobs which were presumably at the beginning of Steve's career.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:14 • by Pricey (unregistered)
This is why people tell you to fit your CV onto a single side of paper...

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:15 • by Edgar (unregistered)
392698 in reply to 392696
This is why you should aim to keep CV on a single page and list only the relevant experience to the job you're applying.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:16 • by Simon Peyote Joints (unregistered)
What kind of person puts "inventorying network switches" on a CV for a software company?

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:16 • by Howie Feltersnatch (unregistered)
Badly written anecdote is badly written.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:16 • by Rob (unregistered)
Soooooooooooo... the MD had never heard of double-sided printouts before that day? THAT'S the point?

Wow.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:17 • by Nappy (unregistered)
That's probably why Linked in starts with your current job, not the one summer tomato picking you did.

No we picked them by hand.
No we walked with a cart to the isle to manually dump them in a bigger cart.
...
...
No i'm sure there was no computer in the sorting machine
[turns page]
Yes i was chief architect at [redacted company]

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:20 • by Arkady (unregistered)
392703 in reply to 392697
In the UK we're told our CV should be approximately two sides - the one sided resumé is an American thing.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:23 • by Herwig (unregistered)
Where's pt. 2?

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:24 • by Jack (unregistered)
392705 in reply to 392703
Arkady:
In the UK we're told our CV should be approximately two sides - the one sided resumé is an American thing.
Are you also told to list all the old irrelevant crap in exhaustive detail on the first page and save the goodies for dessert?

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:25 • by Freddie (unregistered)
I'm thinking there must be more to this story but the back side of my monitor is blank...

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:25 • by Anketam
From my observations one or two pages does not matter. What does matter is that you put the most important stuff first and work your way to the least important. If the least imporant goes onto a second page that is fine. The interviewer will stop reading the resume once they lose interest.

I was under the impression from the story that the guy put his degree information on the second page (I put my degree information on the second page since I view it as less important). And the MD had some prejudice against people without degrees, but in this case only to realize the guy actually did have a degree.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:26 • by Cbuttius
I had problems in April 2010 when I had just had 3 WTF jobs in a row pretty much within a year, and wanted to shift the focus to the 3.5 years or so before but every interviewer seemed determined to talk about my most recent jobs.

I failed to get any of the jobs at that time which was a very trying time for me.

Steve handled his interview well, attributing the positive to every job. I learnt to do that. I did highlight the 3rd of the WTF jobs on the work I had done on switching the Windows build from static to using DLLs which essentially cut down the link time enormously so you didn't have to wait 30-45 minutes every time you made a 1-line change. This had an impact on improving the "performance" of every developer in the team who was otherwise wasting time waiting for changes to build.

It may have been a tiresome task to do, and maybe not exactly what I wanted to be working on doing there, but it was 1. An idea I had come up with myself (pro-active) and 2. Had a very positive impact.

Subsequent to changing my own personal attitude towards this job, my success rate went up enormously.

It is very important to have a good attitude towards doing work which is good for the business but not what you particulary enjoy doing. You are there for the benefit of the business, not to seek your own interests.

The MD would have known that and may well have been asking these questions for exactly these reasons.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:26 • by Herwig (unregistered)
392709 in reply to 392703
höhö,... that's why you have to put "inventorying network switches" on your CV's in Britain? - what a N(ice)RWTF!

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:27 • by Anthony (unregistered)
My CV is 3 to 4 pages (as time goes on, it grows).

The first page contains a summary of pertinent information. The bottom of it through the third page is a detail of each related job I have had (I leave off less relevant tasks), what I did there, what my responsibilities were and what I achieved.

Then, the final page contains "ancillary" information. Such as professional groups I belong to open source projects I participate in, certs, talks that I've done, etc. Stuff that's icing on the cake, but isn't the meat of what I'm trying to get across...

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:43 • by A Mike (unregistered)
It seems to me that the MD had spent the first half of the interview looking at the back-side of the resume, where Steven had rightly listed all the crap jobs he'd had in order to fill it out to the full two pages. He then flipped it over and saw all the things Steven had listed first.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:47 • by I'm just a number (unregistered)
It was later that he found out that "MD" actually stood for "Manic Depressive".

The end.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:47 • by anonymous (unregistered)
392713 in reply to 392704
Herwig:
Where's pt. 2?

Turn the page!

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:48 • by biziclop
The real WTF is that without the comments most people (myself included) don't get the story.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 08:58 • by Captain Obvious (unregistered)
So the twf is that the interviewer wanted to see how he would deal with an angry person?

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 09:00 • by Kris (unregistered)
392717 in reply to 392698
I've done the whole "list only relevant jobs" thing, only to be asked if I was in jail/psychiatric treatment/unemployed in those "missing years". Now it lists every single meaningless job, simply as employer/function/period one-liners.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 09:04 • by ¯\(°_o)/¯ I DUNNO LOL (unregistered)
TRWTF is not knowing the difference between "led" and "lead"?

But what we all want to know is, is it really bigger on the inside?

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 09:04 • by TheSHEEEP (unregistered)
392719 in reply to 392708
Cbuttius:
You are there for the benefit of the business, not to seek your own interests.


Yes, be a good working slave and do whatever is best for your company. Oh. My. God.
With too many people with that attitude, we will soon all get minimum wages

What nonsense! You can pretend stuff like that, to crawl up the bosses a**es, but when I work for a company, I have a look at what I can gain of it. Do I learn something new? Can I improve my skills/knowledge in an area? Is it probably just incredible fun to work with the people? Is the payment good for the kind of work I do?

Obviously, when doing the actual work, one should focus on doing what is objectively the best thing to do, not on what is most fun to do. But that's a matter of professionalism. If you do what you are paid for as good as you can, then that is all a company can ever expect from you. Anything more you should do out of interest/fun or with a certain (monetary?) goal in mind.

Do not sell yourself under value, if you don't absolutely need THAT job to survive.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 09:05 • by Roby McAndrew
I'm struggling to keep my CV down to two pages. The early jobs are now just Company/Job Title/Dates. The more recent a job is, the more detail it gets. Most recent comes first on Page 1. Page 2 becomes dusty history.

I was once shown a 10-page CV. Page one proudly listed his mobile number (when mobiles were rare) and his BMW 320i. On about page 7 we discovered that he was married with two children. How we laughed!

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 09:06 • by TheSHEEEP (unregistered)
392721 in reply to 392717
Kris:
I've done the whole "list only relevant jobs" thing, only to be asked if I was in jail/psychiatric treatment/unemployed in those "missing years".


"Yes, all of that in the exact order!"

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 09:20 • by Jasper (unregistered)
I'm in the Netherlands.

Generally I think it's good to have a CV that's not too long - recruiters aren't going to wade through a 10-page long CV.

The CV that I usually use is 3 pages; it contains my profile, a list of skills and descriptions of projects I've worked on in the past 5 years. But a while ago a recruiter commented that he thought my CV was too short.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 09:29 • by Warpedcow (unregistered)
I've seen lots of 5-8 page resumes, pretty much always from relatives of "Nagesh" if you get my meaning. Very rarely do I encounter a proper 1 page resume, though when I do it's never from a "Nagesh".

The 1 page resume candidates perform a few orders of magnitude better at their interview than the 5-8 page candidates.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 09:37 • by Still Water (unregistered)
392729 in reply to 392703
Yes - please, more people take note of this. Wading through 11 pages of CV detailing every single piece of software that you have ever seen does not make me want to interview you - if you are an expert in 15 different DBMS, 13 programming languages, and 257 different applications, then you are applying for the wrong job...

And no pictures. Thanks.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 09:46 • by David (unregistered)
Sounds like steve might want to put his most relevant work experience near the top of his resume so interviewers see that first instead of having to turn to the second page.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 09:48 • by Andrew (unregistered)
The Real WTF is not putting your work history in reverse chronological order so that the most recent / most relevant stuff is at the top, where the interviewer will see it immediately.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 09:49 • by Anonymous Bob (unregistered)
What's a "CV"? I've heard of a resume, but not a "CV". Is that a British thing?

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 09:51 • by golddog (unregistered)
392733 in reply to 392719
TheSHEEEP:
Cbuttius:
You are there for the benefit of the business, not to seek your own interests.


Yes, be a good working slave and do whatever is best for your company. Oh. My. God.
With too many people with that attitude, we will soon all get minimum wages

What nonsense! You can pretend stuff like that, to crawl up the bosses a**es, but when I work for a company, I have a look at what I can gain of it. Do I learn something new? Can I improve my skills/knowledge in an area? Is it probably just incredible fun to work with the people? Is the payment good for the kind of work I do?

Obviously, when doing the actual work, one should focus on doing what is objectively the best thing to do, not on what is most fun to do. But that's a matter of professionalism. If you do what you are paid for as good as you can, then that is all a company can ever expect from you. Anything more you should do out of interest/fun or with a certain (monetary?) goal in mind.

Do not sell yourself under value, if you don't absolutely need THAT job to survive.


And you don't need THAT job. There's another one out there. It's not worth going to a place you hate every day.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 10:00 • by Chuck (unregistered)
You know, if some of your past jobs have no relevance to the kind of work youre looking for, you CAN leave them off your resume. My resume mentions nothing about my first job at Wendy's, or various construction labor gigs, or even five years of delivering pizza.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 10:02 • by Fool (unregistered)
392737 in reply to 392703
In the US, we just call it a resume. They don't ge to 2 pages unless you have soemthing like 10+ years of experience. At that point it starts to be come more expected.

Truth is, resumes are not that valuable. Talking to someone is.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 10:18 • by Mark (unregistered)
392739 in reply to 392737
Fool:
In the US, we just call it a resume. They don't ge to 2 pages unless you have soemthing like 10+ years of experience. At that point it starts to be come more expected.

Truth is, resumes are not that valuable. Talking to someone is.


Exactly. Resumes have one goal: Get you in to speak with someone. Writing a resume to try and portray the unique snowflake that is "you" with each of your prized bowel movements is a complete waste of time for everyone.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 10:20 • by justanotheradmin
392740 in reply to 392732
Anonymous Bob:
What's a "CV"? I've heard of a resume, but not a "CV". Is that a British thing?


Curriculum Vitae. Latin.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 10:22 • by Someone else (unregistered)
I've recently had to start looking for a job, something I haven't done in 7 years (I've been working in software development for something like 35 years). I truncated my resume at 2 pages and 3 jobs/17 years back. I could have gone on but I don't see than my experience on old iron and obsolete operating systems would apply - unless they were asking about that explicitly. At that point I'd deny any knowledge of those old POS systems.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 10:29 • by blank (unregistered)
there's a bad VB joke in there somewhere..

Error on resume? Next!

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 10:30 • by foo (unregistered)
392744 in reply to 392740
justanotheradmin:
Anonymous Bob:
What's a "CV"? I've heard of a resume, but not a "CV". Is that a British thing?


Curriculum Vitae. Latin.
In contrast to resume which is French.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 10:33 • by Born Texas Proud (unregistered)
392745 in reply to 392717
Kris:
I've done the whole "list only relevant jobs" thing, only to be asked if I was in jail/psychiatric treatment/unemployed in those "missing years". Now it lists every single meaningless job, simply as employer/function/period one-liners.

From you're name, I'm guessing you're female. The interviewer was probably trying to determine whether you made your income from stripping and/or pornography...and it might not have been detrimental to you getting a job.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 10:35 • by JJ Irwin (unregistered)
392746 in reply to 392703
Last I was out looking I was told that for technical positions, especially in fields where consulting is the norm, they're looking for a small novel, otherwise they don't think you've got range of experience.

I'd been working at the same place for god-knows-how-many-years so I was at a distinct disadvantage until I stumbled on a position doing exactly what I'd been doing before.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 10:37 • by Bradley (unregistered)
I don't get it, what was on the back of the resume to make him change his attitude?

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 10:40 • by Nagesh (unregistered)
392749 in reply to 392728
Warpedcow:
I've seen lots of 5-8 page resumes, pretty much always from relatives of "Nagesh" if you get my meaning. Very rarely do I encounter a proper 1 page resume, though when I do it's never from a "Nagesh".

The 1 page resume candidates perform a few orders of magnitude better at their interview than the 5-8 page candidates.

Obviously, Nagesh is being much bettar employee having so manies short-term jobs. Employer only maintein employee that is being substanderd.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 10:54 • by Publius (unregistered)
392750 in reply to 392703
Hahaha, thanks Arkady for helping me make sense of this story.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 11:02 • by Your Name (unregistered)
392753 in reply to 392703
I was told that multipage resume's get pitched when I was in college. Of course back then I had no experience and had to stretch it to fill a page.

I rarely ever see a resume that is less than 2 full pages when interviewing people with at least a few years of experience. I think people do not want to remove irrelevant entries since it looks like they have a huge gap in their work experience if they skip over stuff.

However you don't need to go into exhaustive detail about a job you only worked a few months at, or did nothing related to the position you are trying to take.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 11:10 • by CodeMonKey (unregistered)
392755 in reply to 392747
Bradley:
I don't get it, what was on the back of the resume to make him change his attitude?
It wasn't blank, for sure. Lessons learned: Print the cv/resume simplex, not duplex.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 11:15 • by Cbuttius
392758 in reply to 392721
TheSHEEEP:
Kris:
I've done the whole "list only relevant jobs" thing, only to be asked if I was in jail/psychiatric treatment/unemployed in those "missing years".


"Yes, all of that in the exact order!"


Yes, I was in jail and now I have good "connections" so if I am not offered the role, you may wake up with a severed horse's head in your bed.

Re: The Angry MD

2012-10-18 11:27 • by jaybird (unregistered)
392761 in reply to 392755
CodeMonKey:
Bradley:
I don't get it, what was on the back of the resume to make him change his attitude?
It wasn't blank, for sure. Lessons learned: Print the cv/resume simplex, not duplex.


I would never print a resume double-sided for exactly this reason. Single sided, with a staple (or not, depending on any specific instructions provided by the employer).
« PrevPage 1 | Page 2 | Page 3 | Page 4Next »

Add Comment