The Interupting Rebutter, The Final Word, and The Jury Rig

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  • MyKey_ 2010-06-10 09:05
    Apparently, my inability to influence past decisions limited my employment opportunities at this new company.


    Otherwise he could have prevented his interviewer from being hired afterwards.

    Addendum (2010-06-10 10:13):
    D'oh! I'm no longer able to change this comment to "frist".
  • DOA 2010-06-10 09:10
    Haven't I read these here before?
  • MyKey_ 2010-06-10 09:14
    DOA:
    Haven't I read these here before?

    Yes, at least in the forums: http://forums.thedailywtf.com/forums/p/14007/208120.aspx
  • muhaha the mad scientist 2010-06-10 09:17
    they seriously use Ook! ?
    Oh my god, at least use brainfuck!
  • joeyadams 2010-06-10 09:18
    DOA:
    Haven't I read these here before?


    It's from the sidebar: http://forums.thedailywtf.com/forums/p/14007/208179.aspx

    Addendum (2010-06-10 09:25):
    On a sidenote, Akismet blocked this post as spam until I appended meaningless repetitive text. Remember, Ralphie, if your nose starts bleeding it means you're picking it too much... or not enough.
  • Bryan The K 2010-06-10 09:26
    The real WTF is he's a Patriots fan, right?

    CAPTCHA: jumentum. Never JUMp to momENTUM

  • ray10k 2010-06-10 09:27
    muhaha the mad scientist:
    they seriously use Ook! ?
    Oh my god, at least use brainfuck!


    there was more than one GOOD reason to run. They also mentioned MUMPS and C-pound. neither are a good sign.
  • snoofle 2010-06-10 09:44
    I've run into hostile interviewers (like the first one) a few times over the years. For me, it's a major red flag and pretty much kills it right there. At that point, since my time has already been wasted, and there's no way I'd ever want to work with/near/around/in-the-same-building-with a jerk like that, I usually stop them dead in their tracks with something like:

    "It was another company with different managers who thought that their way was the only correct way. Since I'm flexible, I went along with management-mandated foolish decisions and watched them pay for their arrogance.

    You appear to be equally adamant that your way is the only correct way.

    Good luck with that."

    and then I simply leave without another word.

  • Some Wonk 2010-06-10 09:58
    "We have a lot of great stuff down the pipes."

    Clearly, the manager is alluding to their upcoming online urine test. After all, the internet is nothing but a series of tubes.
  • HopelessIntern 2010-06-10 10:01
    Some Wonk:
    "We have a lot of great stuff down the pipes."

    Clearly, the manager is alluding to their upcoming online urine test. After all, the internet is nothing but a series of tubes.


    Or the manager wants to piss all over the internet. Little does he know, everyone already does that.
  • PITA 2010-06-10 10:03
    Post a comment. If you don't, then you can fuck off.
  • Anon 2010-06-10 10:16
    To give the first interviewer the benefit of the doubt, I think he might have been challenging the interviewee to compare and contrast the various technologies that could have been used. It seem a relevant question to me and the "that happened before my time" answer is a missed opportunity by the interviewee.


    "JBoss?!" the interviewer jumped in, "why didn't they use Tomcat, if they were going to use Java?"

    "I'm not sure,"


    Buzzz, wrong answer. Sure it was a decision made some time ago and of course you can't retroactively change those decisions, but the right answer was to say something along the lines of "well with JBoss you can do x which you can't do in Tomcat...." (or vice versa). You don't have to agree that one is better than the other, but you should understand what the relative strengths and weaknesses are.

  • Anonymous 2010-06-10 10:17
    joeyadams:
    DOA:
    Haven't I read these here before?

    It's from the sidebar: http://forums.thedailywtf.com/forums/p/14007/208179.aspx

    Addendum (2010-06-10 09:25):
    On a sidenote, Akismet blocked this post as spam until I appended meaningless repetitive text. Remember, Ralphie, if your nose starts bleeding it means you're picking it too much... or not enough.

    This is typical of Akismet, the damn thing is so twitchy that it's flagged a link to the same domain as the originating page. Shows you just how poor Akismet really is; I've had false positives in the past in which there were no links at all! I guess it's better than the spam but I'm sure there are far better solutions out there than Akismet. I've also heard that the developers can be vindictive dicks if you piss them off.
  • mrs_helm 2010-06-10 10:17
    "Apparently, my inability to influence past decisions limited my employment opportunities at this new company."
    Actually, it would appear to have been an asset at this new company. You should have exercised it during the interview.
  • Pete 2010-06-10 10:17
    Good old C-Pound my favourite language.

    I don't even know where that comes from I could understand C-Hash or C-Number. Is it called that in America? I'm from the UK so pound is £.
  • Anonymous 2010-06-10 10:27
    HopelessIntern:
    Some Wonk:
    "We have a lot of great stuff down the pipes."

    Clearly, the manager is alluding to their upcoming online urine test. After all, the internet is nothing but a series of tubes.


    Or the manager wants to piss all over the internet. Little does he know, everyone already does that.

    You can piss on the internet as long you don't take a dump on it. The internet is not a dump truck.
  • HopelessIntern 2010-06-10 10:29
    Pete:
    Good old C-Pound my favourite language.

    I don't even know where that comes from I could understand C-Hash or C-Number. Is it called that in America? I'm from the UK so pound is £.

    Yeah in the states, the # symbol is called a pound. Still, it is no excuse. C-pound is just as wrong as C-hash or C-number, any competent IT-related professional should know it is C-sharp (it makes sense too, its musical notation).
  • Mister Zimbu 2010-06-10 10:29
    Pete:
    Good old C-Pound my favourite language.

    I don't even know where that comes from I could understand C-Hash or C-Number. Is it called that in America? I'm from the UK so pound is £.


    Yes, it's called the pound symbol in America.

    Honestly, I haven't the slightest clue as to why- we don't even use it to abbreviate the word "pound" in any context that I'm aware of. Unfortunately, it was named before my time.
  • Mike D. 2010-06-10 10:30
    Pete:
    Good old C-Pound my favourite language.

    I don't even know where that comes from I could understand C-Hash or C-Number. Is it called that in America? I'm from the UK so pound is £.

    Way back, in the mists of time, the "#" symbol was used as a suffix to represent pounds-mass (lb, as opposed to pounds-force, lbf, or pounds-currency, £). So "50#" would mean 50 pounds.

    Thing is, I think I've seen it used like that three times since I learned it around 1980. You're not missing anything.
  • Tyler 2010-06-10 10:33
    Mike D.:
    Pete:
    Good old C-Pound my favourite language.

    I don't even know where that comes from I could understand C-Hash or C-Number. Is it called that in America? I'm from the UK so pound is £.

    Way back, in the mists of time, the "#" symbol was used as a suffix to represent pounds-mass (lb, as opposed to pounds-force, lbf, or pounds-currency, £). So "50#" would mean 50 pounds.

    Thing is, I think I've seen it used like that three times since I learned it around 1980. You're not missing anything.


    It's still used frequently in grocery stores in my area (Los Angeles). You'll see a sign under the potatoes reading something like "Potatoes 5# bag $x.xx".
  • Ken 2010-06-10 10:34
    This sounds like an interview for a frontend dev. They highly skilled in their area of expertise but I don't expect them to know every nuance of how a tomcat server works vs a Jboss server. I'd expect them to know what those are and that they aren't the same thing. The questions were outside of their field of expertise and they shouldn't be expected to have control or even knowledge of decisions that shouldn't affect their work.

    It sounds like you want backend devs who know a bit of front end development instead of having frontend devs that know a little backend. I wonder how crappy and wtf laden your frontend is.
  • Anonymous 2010-06-10 10:35
    Mike D.:
    Pete:
    Good old C-Pound my favourite language.

    I don't even know where that comes from I could understand C-Hash or C-Number. Is it called that in America? I'm from the UK so pound is £.

    Way back, in the mists of time, the "#" symbol was used as a suffix to represent pounds-mass (lb, as opposed to pounds-force, lbf, or pounds-currency, £). So "50#" would mean 50 pounds.

    Thing is, I think I've seen it used like that three times since I learned it around 1980. You're not missing anything.

    What annoys me most about this confusion is that the hash symbol (or "pound", if you will) is actually different to the sharp symbol anyway. Hash = #, sharp = ♯.
  • Septic Tank 2010-06-10 10:36
    Pete:
    Good old C-Pound my favourite language.

    I don't even know where that comes from I could understand C-Hash or C-Number. Is it called that in America? I'm from the UK so pound is £.


    Yeah, it's a septic thing. (Septic Tank)

    I work for a septic company and they say press 1 then pound while I'm on teleconference with them. They mean hash.

    I say tom-art-o you say tom-ate-o.
  • highphilosopher 2010-06-10 10:40
    Pete:
    Good old C-Pound my favourite language.

    I don't even know where that comes from I could understand C-Hash or C-Number. Is it called that in America? I'm from the UK so pound is £.


    Yeah, that's our American leaking through so...

    C-Pound == C#
    C-Hash == I can see the baggie of weed sticking out of your pocket
    C-Number == Can I call you later follow up question.
    C-Sharp == Programming Language, or musical Note. I think it should be noted that in music, a sharp note is a half step above the natural tone. I think this is the reason Microsoft chose this name was to infer that they were a half step above the competition. What actually happened is that when tuning an instrument, if you stretch a string for instance too tight, it produces a sound that's sharp or slightly out of tune. I think this metaphor better describes the Sharp family of Microsoft programming languages.
  • Steve 2010-06-10 10:40
    Anonymous:
    What annoys me most about this confusion is that the hash symbol (or "pound", if you will) is actually different to the sharp symbol anyway. Hash = #, sharp = ♯.

    If you silly yanks need a mnemonic, just remember that "hash = horizontal, sharp = sloped". The lines on the hash symbol must be perfectly horizontal, whereas the lines on the sharp symbol must be sloped. That's not so hard, is it?
  • mace 2010-06-10 10:42
    Exactly why does a drug testing company need over a dozen different programming languages? That doesn't sound like using "the right tool to solve the right problem".
  • Bellinghman 2010-06-10 10:45
    Anonymous:
    What annoys me most about this confusion is that the hash symbol (or "pound", if you will) is actually different to the sharp symbol anyway. Hash = #, sharp = ♯.
    Blame Microsoft for naming a language using a non-ASCII character that isn't on most keyboards, but that looks very similar to an ASCII one that is. Anyone who didn't expect confusion from that just wasn't thinking.
  • iToad 2010-06-10 10:45
    Pete:
    Good old C-Pound my favourite language.

    I don't even know where that comes from I could understand C-Hash or C-Number. Is it called that in America? I'm from the UK so pound is £.


    Is this the same language as C£ ?
  • Incourced 2010-06-10 10:47
    The Interupting Rebutter may have been carrying out a very low level bit of industrial espionage.

    CV comes in from a competitor or other interesting company. Invite them in, then ask them loads of business and not programming type questions.
  • name 2010-06-10 10:50
    Anonymous:
    Mike D.:
    Pete:
    Good old C-Pound my favourite language.

    I don't even know where that comes from I could understand C-Hash or C-Number. Is it called that in America? I'm from the UK so pound is £.

    Way back, in the mists of time, the "#" symbol was used as a suffix to represent pounds-mass (lb, as opposed to pounds-force, lbf, or pounds-currency, £). So "50#" would mean 50 pounds.

    Thing is, I think I've seen it used like that three times since I learned it around 1980. You're not missing anything.

    What annoys me most about this confusion is that the hash symbol (or "pound", if you will) is actually different to the sharp symbol anyway. Hash = #, sharp = ♯.


    We type # because it's a lot easier than some alt code or what-have-you trying to get the sharp sign. It does NOT mean you should pronounce it C-pound or C-number, etc., since it is known that it should be C-sharp.

    If you look at icons for the C# language, they use the correctly slanted sharp symbol (try looking in the "About Microsoft Visual Studio" dialog for C# or the icon on the Class item in C# items). QED.
  • will 2010-06-10 10:51
    Mister Zimbu:
    Pete:
    Good old C-Pound my favourite language.

    I don't even know where that comes from I could understand C-Hash or C-Number. Is it called that in America? I'm from the UK so pound is £.


    Yes, it's called the pound symbol in America.

    Honestly, I haven't the slightest clue as to why- we don't even use it to abbreviate the word "pound" in any context that I'm aware of. Unfortunately, it was named before my time.


    If were a geek you would know the correct name is Octothorpe.

    The name of pound is old tech when it was an international symbol for package weight.
  • Iain Collins 2010-06-10 10:53
    Pound is also used in the UK for the weight of goods in places like grocers although kilo is more common these days (although weight in lbs can be displayed for an item, a metric unit must also be displayed due to EU regulations).

    This has come to be somewhat of an archaic use (I'm 30 and was still only used fairly rarely in supermarkets and grocers when I was still at school). The reason for this is likely that until relatively recently it was illegal to displaying weight in anything but metric units, but this was challenged and now non-metric values may be provided as supplementary indicators - though as almost everyone stopped using it in the 1990's (when EU regulations came in to force) only a few die hard imperial fans continue to use it.

    On UK Apple keyboards shift-3 is £, and opt-3 is # (because the are both "pound"). The # symbol is not marked on the keyboard however, so it's really funning watching people writing to write shell scripts for the first time on mac.
  • Anon 2010-06-10 11:02
    Ken:
    This sounds like an interview for a frontend dev. They highly skilled in their area of expertise but I don't expect them to know every nuance of how a tomcat server works vs a Jboss server. I'd expect them to know what those are and that they aren't the same thing. The questions were outside of their field of expertise and they shouldn't be expected to have control or even knowledge of decisions that shouldn't affect their work.

    It sounds like you want backend devs who know a bit of front end development instead of having frontend devs that know a little backend. I wonder how crappy and wtf laden your frontend is.


    They don't need to know about the ins and outs of the backend if they are a frontend developer, but I'd expect more than a fucking shrug and "I don't know" when asked a question about it. If they can't demonstrate even the slightest interest in anything outside their own narrow area of expertise then they aren't likely to be very valuable employee. On the bright side, they'll probably be easy to replace.
  • Herby 2010-06-10 11:05
    HopelessIntern:
    Pete:
    Good old C-Pound my favourite language.

    I don't even know where that comes from I could understand C-Hash or C-Number. Is it called that in America? I'm from the UK so pound is £.

    Yeah in the states, the # symbol is called a pound. Still, it is no excuse. C-pound is just as wrong as C-hash or C-number, any competent IT-related professional should know it is C-sharp (it makes sense too, its musical notation).

    Back when I was doing telephone work, there was great confusion on what to call the '#' character. One in our staff said "you know like the tic-tac-toe game". Of course the dumb droid on the other end of the phone then knew what we were talking about. As for languages, Microsoft should have chosen the equivalent: 'D-flat' as a language. Would have made more sense!
  • Doodle 2010-06-10 11:13
    I'd settle for C++++.
  • frits 2010-06-10 11:14
    Huckster:
    A few days later I was, in fact, offered a job--to which I replied "Fuck off!"
  • gho5t 2010-06-10 11:19
    He was a front-end developer...
  • Tyler 2010-06-10 11:21
    Herby:
    As for languages, Microsoft should have chosen the equivalent: 'D-flat' as a language. Would have made more sense!


    Then you'd have to deal with people who had ten years of experience in "dee bee".
  • Skilldrick 2010-06-10 11:21
    Exactly! I'm at least 10 times more productive in brainfuck than Ook!
  • Slicerwizard 2010-06-10 11:25
    Mister Zimbu:
    Yes, it's called the pound symbol in America.

    Honestly, I haven't the slightest clue as to why- we don't even use it to abbreviate the word "pound" in any context that I'm aware of. Unfortunately, it was named before my time.

    Your inability to influence past decisions is lame in the extreme. You can fuck off.
  • r2k 2010-06-10 11:27
    C+=2 is one fewer character and equivalent!
  • @Deprecated 2010-06-10 11:35
    Bellinghman:
    Anonymous:
    What annoys me most about this confusion is that the hash symbol (or "pound", if you will) is actually different to the sharp symbol anyway. Hash = #, sharp = ♯.
    Blame Microsoft for naming a language using a non-ASCII character that isn't on most keyboards, but that looks very similar to an ASCII one that is. Anyone who didn't expect confusion from that just wasn't thinking.


    Hey, they also gave us .net. Y'know, just to make search engines cater to them, and understand "dot net" means "Microsoft .net"
  • AnOldRelic 2010-06-10 11:40
    Anonymous:
    What annoys me most about this confusion is that the hash symbol (or "pound", if you will) is actually different to the sharp symbol anyway. Hash = #, sharp = ♯.

    While correct, look at how C# is actually illustrated on the C# icons. They use the ♯ symbol, and as such, it's C-Sharp. It's often represented as a # as one can more easily type it by hitting shift-3 on an American-English QWERTY keyboard, as opposed to doing an alt-numpad code.
  • AnOldRelic 2010-06-10 11:41
    AnOldRelic:
    Anonymous:
    What annoys me most about this confusion is that the hash symbol (or "pound", if you will) is actually different to the sharp symbol anyway. Hash = #, sharp = ♯.

    While correct, look at how C# is actually illustrated on the C# icons. They use the ♯ symbol, and as such, it's C-Sharp. It's often represented as a # as one can more easily type it by hitting shift-3 on an American-English QWERTY keyboard, as opposed to doing an alt-numpad code.


    Augh, I was beaten to the punch.
  • PITA 2010-06-10 11:50
    Pete:
    Good old C-Pound my favourite language.

    I don't even know where that comes from I could understand C-Hash or C-Number. Is it called that in America? I'm from the UK so pound is £.
    The '#' closely resembles the symbol used in music notation indicating a sharp note.

    "The sharp sign (♯) is often confused with the number (hash) sign (#). The key difference is that the number sign has compulsory true horizontal strokes while the sharp sign cannot have them. Instead, the sharp sign has two slanted parallel lines which rise from left-to-right. Both signs may have true-vertical lines; however, these are compulsory in the sharp, but optional in the number sign (#) depending on typeface or handwriting style." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sharp_(music)
  • blunder 2010-06-10 11:53
    I can't believe you're really having the C-Pound conversation.

    http://thedailywtf.com/articles/Classic-WTF-5-years-Cpound-experience.aspx

    It was just an in-joke, as with the MUMPS mention.

    What is it with programmers and parsing things literally?
  • Me 2010-06-10 11:56
    Anon:


    "JBoss?!" the interviewer jumped in, "why didn't they use Tomcat, if they were going to use Java?"

    "I'm not sure,"


    Buzzz, wrong answer. Sure it was a decision made some time ago and of course you can't retroactively change those decisions, but the right answer was to say something along the lines of "well with JBoss you can do x which you can't do in Tomcat...." (or vice versa). You don't have to agree that one is better than the other, but you should understand what the relative strengths and weaknesses are.



    The interviewer didn't ask about the relative merits of JBoss and Tomcat -- he asked what were the deciding factors in a decision that the interviewee had no part in. For all he knows, it was because the CEO's brother-in-law told him about JBoss during a holiday dinner.

    Don't be line Mr Anon here. If you want the interviewee to compare X and Y, ask "What are the relative merits of X and Y?" -- don't ask "Why did somebody you may not even know choose X?"

  • Anonymous 2010-06-10 12:07
    blunder:
    I can't believe you're really having the C-Pound conversation.

    http://thedailywtf.com/articles/Classic-WTF-5-years-Cpound-experience.aspx

    It was just an in-joke, as with the MUMPS mention.

    What is it with programmers and parsing things literally?

    We know that RHuckster knows the proper name because we've all read his forum posts and he's a smart guy, so it was meant jokingly in his submission. But seriously, people do call it C-Pound. I've heard Americans call it that many times and believe me, they weren't trying to be funny. It is not just and in-joke and it does warrant discussion. If you don't want to get involved then you're better off not posting anything since your comment has added nothing to the discussion.
  • Pounder 2010-06-10 12:10
    One thing I kind of like about C-pound is that the pound sign could be seen as a pair of plus signs overlaid on top of each other. So it's like C-plus-plus but expresses the same thing with less verbosity. Shame the language is nothing like that.
  • Plz Send Me The Code 2010-06-10 12:23
    I don't get the 'pipes' faux pas.
  • Anon 2010-06-10 12:43
    Me:
    Anon:


    "JBoss?!" the interviewer jumped in, "why didn't they use Tomcat, if they were going to use Java?"

    "I'm not sure,"


    Buzzz, wrong answer. Sure it was a decision made some time ago and of course you can't retroactively change those decisions, but the right answer was to say something along the lines of "well with JBoss you can do x which you can't do in Tomcat...." (or vice versa). You don't have to agree that one is better than the other, but you should understand what the relative strengths and weaknesses are.



    The interviewer didn't ask about the relative merits of JBoss and Tomcat -- he asked what were the deciding factors in a decision that the interviewee had no part in. For all he knows, it was because the CEO's brother-in-law told him about JBoss during a holiday dinner.

    Don't be line Mr Anon here. If you want the interviewee to compare X and Y, ask "What are the relative merits of X and Y?" -- don't ask "Why did somebody you may not even know choose X?"



    I never said it was the best or most direct way to ask the question. What I said is the interviewee missed an opportunity.
    It doesn't matter if the CEO's brother-in-law told the CEO that was what they needed, it doesn't matter if you know the real reason or not. You SHOULD be able to talk somewhat intelligently about it. His answer only demonstrated that he does not know even ONE DAMN THING about JBoss and Tomcat. And that's weak.
    I'm not surprised they didn't hire him.
  • luis.espinal 2010-06-10 12:45
    A few days later I was, in fact, offered a job, but I turned it down. Not because of the f-bomb, but because of the commute.


    Meh, you should have told them it was because of the f-bomb that you turned them down (just to put some hit on the interviewer.) :P
  • Ralph's Urine Test 2010-06-10 12:45
    ===
    The IRS decides to audit Ralph, and summons him to the IRS office.

    The IRS auditor is not surprised when Ralph shows up with his attorney.

    The auditor says, "Well, sir, you have an extravagant lifestyle and no full-time employment, which you explain by saying that you win money gambling. I'm not sure the IRS finds that believable."

    "I'm a great gambler, and I can prove it," says Ralph. "How about a demonstration?"

    The auditor thinks for a moment and says, "Okay. Go ahead."

    Ralph says, "I'll bet you a thousand dollars that I can bite my own eye."

    The auditor thinks a moment, and says, "It's a bet."

    Ralph removes his glass eye and bites it. The auditor's jaw drops.

    Ralph says, "Now, I'll bet you two thousand dollars that I can bite my other eye."

    Now, the auditor can tell Ralph isn't blind, so he takes the bet.

    Ralph removes his dentures and bites his good eye.
    - - -
    The stunned auditor now realizes he has wagered and lost three grand, with Ralph's attorney as a witness. He starts to get nervous.

    "Want to go double or nothing?" Ralph asks. "I'll bet you six thousand dollars that I can stand on one side of your desk and pee into your wastebasket on the other side, and never get a drop anywhere in between."

    The auditor, twice burned, is cautious now, but he looks carefully and decides there's no way this guy could possibly manage that stunt, so he agrees again.

    Ralph stands beside the desk and unzips his pants, but although he strains mightily, he can't make the stream reach the wastebasket, so he pretty much pees all over the auditor's desk.

    The auditor leaps with joy, realizing that he has just turned a major loss into a huge win.
    - - -
    But Ralph's attorney moans and puts his head in his hands.

    "Are you okay?" the auditor asks.

    "Not really," says the attorney. "This morning, when Ralph told me he'd been summoned for an audit, he bet me twenty-five thousand dollars that he could come in here and piss all over your desk and that you'd be happy about it."
    ===
  • Larry 2010-06-10 12:46
    the only problem was that the commute was an hour-and-a-half each way, and that's only on a good traffic day.
    So, three miles in Los Angeles, was it?
  • Blah 2010-06-10 13:01
    highphilosopher:
    Pete:
    Good old C-Pound my favourite language.

    I don't even know where that comes from I could understand C-Hash or C-Number. Is it called that in America? I'm from the UK so pound is £.


    Yeah, that's our American leaking through so...

    C-Pound == C#
    C-Hash == I can see the baggie of weed sticking out of your pocket
    C-Number == Can I call you later follow up question.
    C-Sharp == Programming Language, or musical Note. I think it should be noted that in music, a sharp note is a half step above the natural tone. I think this is the reason Microsoft chose this name was to infer that they were a half step above the competition. What actually happened is that when tuning an instrument, if you stretch a string for instance too tight, it produces a sound that's sharp or slightly out of tune. I think this metaphor better describes the Sharp family of Microsoft programming languages.


    I was under the impression that it was (C++)++, which would be C++++, and if you arrange the plus signs in two rows, C#.
  • Johnny 2010-06-10 13:07
    Blah:
    I was under the impression that it was (C++)++, which would be C++++, and if you arrange the plus signs in two rows, C#.

    Have you ever actually called it "C plus plus plus plus" in front of another programmer? Did they laugh their ass off? That's even better than "C pound"!
  • cconroy 2010-06-10 13:25
    Septic Tank:
    I say tom-art-o you say tom-ate-o.


    WhoTF says "tom-art-o"?
  • Raedwald 2010-06-10 13:25
    [quote user="will"][quote user="Mister Zimbu"]
    The name of pound is old tech when it was an international symbol for package weight.[/quote]

    Would you believe it, # is a symbol for quantity in Linear-B.
  • frits 2010-06-10 13:46
    cconroy:
    Septic Tank:
    I say tom-art-o you say tom-ate-o.


    WhoTF says "tom-art-o"?


    That spelling makes sense if Septic Tank has a non-rhotic accent.
  • Accent Opaque 2010-06-10 13:55
    Mister Zimbu:
    Yes, it's called the pound symbol in America.

    Honestly, I haven't the slightest clue as to why- we don't even use it to abbreviate the word "pound" in any context that I'm aware of. Unfortunately, it was named before my time.

    It's used throughout the paper and printing industries. That paper you put in the copier is probably 20# (twenty-pound) white text. Your fancy brochures are, say, a combination of 80# gloss cover and 100# matte text.
  • ARMed but harmless 2010-06-10 14:06
    mace:
    Exactly why does a drug testing company need over a dozen different programming languages? That doesn't sound like using "the right tool to solve the right problem".

    If you test drugs extensively, you will eventually come up with ideas like connecting an LDAP server to a JavaScript application using a serial port.
  • anonymousse 2010-06-10 14:11
    Yes.
  • anon 2010-06-10 14:12
    Ralph's Urine Test:
    ===
    The IRS decides to audit Ralph, and summons him to the IRS office.

    The IRS auditor is not surprised when Ralph shows up with his attorney.

    The auditor says, "Well, sir, you have an extravagant lifestyle and no full-time employment, which you explain by saying that you win money gambling. I'm not sure the IRS finds that believable."

    "I'm a great gambler, and I can prove it," says Ralph. "How about a demonstration?"

    The auditor thinks for a moment and says, "Okay. Go ahead."

    Ralph says, "I'll bet you a thousand dollars that I can bite my own eye."

    The auditor thinks a moment, and says, "It's a bet."

    Ralph removes his glass eye and bites it. The auditor's jaw drops.

    Ralph says, "Now, I'll bet you two thousand dollars that I can bite my other eye."

    Now, the auditor can tell Ralph isn't blind, so he takes the bet.

    Ralph removes his dentures and bites his good eye.
    - - -
    The stunned auditor now realizes he has wagered and lost three grand, with Ralph's attorney as a witness. He starts to get nervous.

    "Want to go double or nothing?" Ralph asks. "I'll bet you six thousand dollars that I can stand on one side of your desk and pee into your wastebasket on the other side, and never get a drop anywhere in between."

    The auditor, twice burned, is cautious now, but he looks carefully and decides there's no way this guy could possibly manage that stunt, so he agrees again.

    Ralph stands beside the desk and unzips his pants, but although he strains mightily, he can't make the stream reach the wastebasket, so he pretty much pees all over the auditor's desk.

    The auditor leaps with joy, realizing that he has just turned a major loss into a huge win.
    - - -
    But Ralph's attorney moans and puts his head in his hands.

    "Are you okay?" the auditor asks.

    "Not really," says the attorney. "This morning, when Ralph told me he'd been summoned for an audit, he bet me twenty-five thousand dollars that he could come in here and piss all over your desk and that you'd be happy about it."
    ===


    meh. the Quentin Tarantino version in Desperado is 10x better.
  • tiller 2010-06-10 14:17
    Anon:
    To give the first interviewer the benefit of the doubt, I think he might have been challenging the interviewee to compare and contrast the various technologies that could have been used. It seem a relevant question to me and the "that happened before my time" answer is a missed opportunity by the interviewee.


    "JBoss?!" the interviewer jumped in, "why didn't they use Tomcat, if they were going to use Java?"

    "I'm not sure,"


    Buzzz, wrong answer. Sure it was a decision made some time ago and of course you can't retroactively change those decisions, but the right answer was to say something along the lines of "well with JBoss you can do x which you can't do in Tomcat...." (or vice versa). You don't have to agree that one is better than the other, but you should understand what the relative strengths and weaknesses are.



    Not if you are a frontend developer(Meaning graphics, html and maybe javascript).
  • Dan 2010-06-10 14:25
    Anon:

    I never said it was the best or most direct way to ask the question. What I said is the interviewee missed an opportunity.
    It doesn't matter if the CEO's brother-in-law told the CEO that was what they needed, it doesn't matter if you know the real reason or not. You SHOULD be able to talk somewhat intelligently about it. His answer only demonstrated that he does not know even ONE DAMN THING about JBoss and Tomcat. And that's weak.
    I'm not surprised they didn't hire him.


    It's pretty clear from the interview text (as presented) that the interviewer was asking those questions rhetorically, as if he already knew that Python, Tomcat, etc. were hands down the best technology evarr, and they were total blithering idiots for not using it. Had the interviewee come up with actual reasons, the interviewer probably would have called security to escort him out the door to make sure his puny brain didn't get him lost in a heating duct or something on the way out.
  • Ouch! 2010-06-10 14:54
    Dan:
    Anon:

    I never said it was the best or most direct way to ask the question. What I said is the interviewee missed an opportunity.
    It doesn't matter if the CEO's brother-in-law told the CEO that was what they needed, it doesn't matter if you know the real reason or not. You SHOULD be able to talk somewhat intelligently about it. His answer only demonstrated that he does not know even ONE DAMN THING about JBoss and Tomcat. And that's weak.
    I'm not surprised they didn't hire him.


    It's pretty clear from the interview text (as presented) that the interviewer was asking those questions rhetorically, as if he already knew that Python, Tomcat, etc. were hands down the best technology evarr, and they were total blithering idiots for not using it. Had the interviewee come up with actual reasons, the interviewer probably would have called security to escort him out the door to make sure his puny brain didn't get him lost in a heating duct or something on the way out.

    You may not have noticed that our friend Anon is the interviewer from the first story.
  • TheRealMe 2010-06-10 15:01
    Jesus, the hoops some of you want interviewees to jump through. Half of you interviewers/wannabe-interviewers seem to expect mind reading from the job applicants.

    "Ah, but I wanted you to pant and wag your tail THIS way, not THAT way."

    captcha - ideo. For surely ideograms can be used in English when convenient.
  • SQLDave 2010-06-10 15:06
    Anon:
    To give the first interviewer the benefit of the doubt, I think he might have been challenging the interviewee to compare and contrast the various technologies that could have been used. It seem a relevant question to me and the "that happened before my time" answer is a missed opportunity by the interviewee.


    "JBoss?!" the interviewer jumped in, "why didn't they use Tomcat, if they were going to use Java?"

    "I'm not sure,"


    Buzzz, wrong answer. Sure it was a decision made some time ago and of course you can't retroactively change those decisions, but the right answer was to say something along the lines of "well with JBoss you can do x which you can't do in Tomcat...." (or vice versa). You don't have to agree that one is better than the other, but you should understand what the relative strengths and weaknesses are.



    Buzzz, also wrong answer. ASSUMING you could clearly tell the interviewer favors (or favored) Tomcat, then there's a golden butt-smooch opportunity. The right answer is something like "Yeah, I lobbied hard for Tomcat because _____, but they didn't listen. I'd like to say their decision worked well for them, but truth be told they've had a terrible time with JBoss because ____"
  • Anon 2010-06-10 15:09
    tiller:
    Anon:
    To give the first interviewer the benefit of the doubt, I think he might have been challenging the interviewee to compare and contrast the various technologies that could have been used. It seem a relevant question to me and the "that happened before my time" answer is a missed opportunity by the interviewee.


    "JBoss?!" the interviewer jumped in, "why didn't they use Tomcat, if they were going to use Java?"

    "I'm not sure,"


    Buzzz, wrong answer. Sure it was a decision made some time ago and of course you can't retroactively change those decisions, but the right answer was to say something along the lines of "well with JBoss you can do x which you can't do in Tomcat...." (or vice versa). You don't have to agree that one is better than the other, but you should understand what the relative strengths and weaknesses are.



    Not if you are a frontend developer(Meaning graphics, html and maybe javascript).


    Yes, because a frontend developer should be totally clueless about the backend. That's the best kind of frontend developer. Everybody loves to hire one-trick ponies.
  • Anon 2010-06-10 15:12
    SQLDave:
    Anon:
    To give the first interviewer the benefit of the doubt, I think he might have been challenging the interviewee to compare and contrast the various technologies that could have been used. It seem a relevant question to me and the "that happened before my time" answer is a missed opportunity by the interviewee.


    "JBoss?!" the interviewer jumped in, "why didn't they use Tomcat, if they were going to use Java?"

    "I'm not sure,"


    Buzzz, wrong answer. Sure it was a decision made some time ago and of course you can't retroactively change those decisions, but the right answer was to say something along the lines of "well with JBoss you can do x which you can't do in Tomcat...." (or vice versa). You don't have to agree that one is better than the other, but you should understand what the relative strengths and weaknesses are.



    Buzzz, also wrong answer. ASSUMING you could clearly tell the interviewer favors (or favored) Tomcat, then there's a golden butt-smooch opportunity. The right answer is something like "Yeah, I lobbied hard for Tomcat because _____, but they didn't listen. I'd like to say their decision worked well for them, but truth be told they've had a terrible time with JBoss because ____"


    Buzzz, still the wrong answer. You sound like a whinny pussy. Besides, the article stated that all these decisions were made before the interviewee started at their current/last employer, so your statement would be a straight up lie.
  • Anon 2010-06-10 15:15
    TheRealMe:
    Jesus, the hoops some of you want interviewees to jump through. Half of you interviewers/wannabe-interviewers seem to expect mind reading from the job applicants.

    "Ah, but I wanted you to pant and wag your tail THIS way, not THAT way."


    Mind read, no. Show some fucking passion for your chosen field and a broad knowledge? Is that asking too much?

  • bozo the pimp 2010-06-10 15:26
    ++C++
  • Gob Bluth 2010-06-10 15:40
    Anon:
    SQLDave:
    Anon:
    To give the first interviewer the benefit of the doubt, I think he might have been challenging the interviewee to compare and contrast the various technologies that could have been used. It seem a relevant question to me and the "that happened before my time" answer is a missed opportunity by the interviewee.


    "JBoss?!" the interviewer jumped in, "why didn't they use Tomcat, if they were going to use Java?"

    "I'm not sure,"


    Buzzz, wrong answer. Sure it was a decision made some time ago and of course you can't retroactively change those decisions, but the right answer was to say something along the lines of "well with JBoss you can do x which you can't do in Tomcat...." (or vice versa). You don't have to agree that one is better than the other, but you should understand what the relative strengths and weaknesses are.



    Buzzz, also wrong answer. ASSUMING you could clearly tell the interviewer favors (or favored) Tomcat, then there's a golden butt-smooch opportunity. The right answer is something like "Yeah, I lobbied hard for Tomcat because _____, but they didn't listen. I'd like to say their decision worked well for them, but truth be told they've had a terrible time with JBoss because ____"


    Buzzz, still the wrong answer. You sound like a whinny pussy. Besides, the article stated that all these decisions were made before the interviewee started at their current/last employer, so your statement would be a straight up lie.


    what next, you challenge him to a fight? give it a rest, "Anon".
  • regeya 2010-06-10 15:44

    Honestly, I haven't the slightest clue as to why- we don't even use it to abbreviate the word "pound" in any context that I'm aware of. Unfortunately, it was named before my time.


    A hash symbol is similar to musical notation to mark a sharp note. If you increment one note up from C in a 12-tone system, the next note is C#.

    So, it's a play on C++.
  • Franz Kafka 2010-06-10 15:44
    SQLDave:
    Anon:
    To give the first interviewer the benefit of the doubt, I think he might have been challenging the interviewee to compare and contrast the various technologies that could have been used. It seem a relevant question to me and the "that happened before my time" answer is a missed opportunity by the interviewee.


    "JBoss?!" the interviewer jumped in, "why didn't they use Tomcat, if they were going to use Java?"

    "I'm not sure,"


    Buzzz, wrong answer. Sure it was a decision made some time ago and of course you can't retroactively change those decisions, but the right answer was to say something along the lines of "well with JBoss you can do x which you can't do in Tomcat...." (or vice versa). You don't have to agree that one is better than the other, but you should understand what the relative strengths and weaknesses are.



    Buzzz, also wrong answer. ASSUMING you could clearly tell the interviewer favors (or favored) Tomcat, then there's a golden butt-smooch opportunity. The right answer is something like "Yeah, I lobbied hard for Tomcat because _____, but they didn't listen. I'd like to say their decision worked well for them, but truth be told they've had a terrible time with JBoss because ____"


    Screw you and the buzzer you're riding. This is a perfect opportunity to decide that you don't want to work with a flaming asshole like the interviewer.
  • RHuckster 2010-06-10 15:53
    Anon:
    TheRealMe:
    Jesus, the hoops some of you want interviewees to jump through. Half of you interviewers/wannabe-interviewers seem to expect mind reading from the job applicants.

    "Ah, but I wanted you to pant and wag your tail THIS way, not THAT way."


    Mind read, no. Show some fucking passion for your chosen field and a broad knowledge? Is that asking too much?



    As the OP of the article, you're right. I should have expressed a greater interest in the back-end, and the fact is, I did indeed have some knowledge of JBoss and the other technologies I was not involved with at my former employer.

    The reason I shrugged was simply because:

    a.) I was not prepared for this kind of question, and it came to me from left field. My first reaction was simply saying, "I don't know." before I started remembering some of the reasons behind choosing it. Had I prepared for the interview by familiarizing myself with technologies I wasn't involved with, I probably would have had a job there. Lord knows how miserable I'd be there if I did.

    b.) As I was saying I wasn't familiar with the details, I started getting a foggy recollection of their reasons behind choosing JBoss, but I didn't have enough details to answer, "Why they chose JBoss and not Tomcat." I knew part of the reasoning behind choosing JBoss over other platforms was that it was scalable compared to other platforms they evaluated, was easily deployable on a Linux platform, and had some abilities to hot deploy new builds of the web services, plus one of the senior developers who was part of the effort to choose JBoss had prior experience of it, which also probably influenced the decision... but before I could even say ANY of those things, he started ranting about how we should have used Python instead of Java.

    Instead of going off on the Python tangent, he could have asked me point-blank: "Do you know anything about JBoss?" and I would have had enough recollected by that time to give somewhat of an answer... of course, using any of the points above probably would have lead to more ranting and demand to defend my arguments on behalf of my colleagues.

    c.) I didn't know anything about Tomcat simply because at the time I was not exposed to it as a web service platform (I had some prior experience working with it as a web server platform, but not using SOAP or REST), thus there was absolutely no way I could answer why they chose NOT to go with Tomcat, thus even if I knew everything there was to know about JBoss from curiously asking about every little nuance about it, I STILL wouldn't be able to adequately answer the question.

    Expecting me to know everything about my company's technologies is like interviewing a podiatrist and asking them what they know about open heart surgery. They might be able to give a very general and foggy answer, but none of it would be useful in his field.
  • Internet Tough Guy 2010-06-10 15:56
    Gob Bluth:
    Anon:
    SQLDave:
    Anon:
    To give the first interviewer the benefit of the doubt, I think he might have been challenging the interviewee to compare and contrast the various technologies that could have been used. It seem a relevant question to me and the "that happened before my time" answer is a missed opportunity by the interviewee.


    "JBoss?!" the interviewer jumped in, "why didn't they use Tomcat, if they were going to use Java?"

    "I'm not sure,"


    Buzzz, wrong answer. Sure it was a decision made some time ago and of course you can't retroactively change those decisions, but the right answer was to say something along the lines of "well with JBoss you can do x which you can't do in Tomcat...." (or vice versa). You don't have to agree that one is better than the other, but you should understand what the relative strengths and weaknesses are.



    Buzzz, also wrong answer. ASSUMING you could clearly tell the interviewer favors (or favored) Tomcat, then there's a golden butt-smooch opportunity. The right answer is something like "Yeah, I lobbied hard for Tomcat because _____, but they didn't listen. I'd like to say their decision worked well for them, but truth be told they've had a terrible time with JBoss because ____"


    Buzzz, still the wrong answer. You sound like a whinny pussy. Besides, the article stated that all these decisions were made before the interviewee started at their current/last employer, so your statement would be a straight up lie.


    what next, you challenge him to a fight? give it a rest, "Anon".


    I'll challenge any one of you fuckers to a fight!
  • Ace 2010-06-10 15:59
    mace:
    Exactly why does a drug testing company need over a dozen different programming languages? That doesn't sound like using "the right tool to solve the right problem".


    You said "tool."

    Captcha: appellatio - shoving an apple down your pants?
  • Yardik 2010-06-10 16:09
    Anon:
    SQLDave:
    Anon:
    To give the first interviewer the benefit of the doubt, I think he might have been challenging the interviewee to compare and contrast the various technologies that could have been used. It seem a relevant question to me and the "that happened before my time" answer is a missed opportunity by the interviewee.


    "JBoss?!" the interviewer jumped in, "why didn't they use Tomcat, if they were going to use Java?"

    "I'm not sure,"


    Buzzz, wrong answer. Sure it was a decision made some time ago and of course you can't retroactively change those decisions, but the right answer was to say something along the lines of "well with JBoss you can do x which you can't do in Tomcat...." (or vice versa). You don't have to agree that one is better than the other, but you should understand what the relative strengths and weaknesses are.



    Buzzz, also wrong answer. ASSUMING you could clearly tell the interviewer favors (or favored) Tomcat, then there's a golden butt-smooch opportunity. The right answer is something like "Yeah, I lobbied hard for Tomcat because _____, but they didn't listen. I'd like to say their decision worked well for them, but truth be told they've had a terrible time with JBoss because ____"


    Buzzz, still the wrong answer. You sound like a whinny pussy. Besides, the article stated that all these decisions were made before the interviewee started at their current/last employer, so your statement would be a straight up lie.


    Buzzz even more wrong answer. Who cares what you look like to anyone but the interviewer? It's a job interview, your job as interviewee is to get the job, by whatever means possible, as long as you believe you can do a good job of it once you're in the door. If that means a little butt smooching.. sweet, pucker up. If you want to be successful in the corporate world sometimes you need to realize it's more important that people *like* you and feel that you fit the org, than your arrogance and pride be demonstrated.

    Coming from someone who has been offered every job they have ever interviewed for. It's all about confidence and manipulation. Screw pride, I'd rather make the big bucks.
  • Jaime 2010-06-10 16:14
    Anon:
    TheRealMe:
    Jesus, the hoops some of you want interviewees to jump through. Half of you interviewers/wannabe-interviewers seem to expect mind reading from the job applicants.

    "Ah, but I wanted you to pant and wag your tail THIS way, not THAT way."


    Mind read, no. Show some fucking passion for your chosen field and a broad knowledge? Is that asking too much?

    I'd kill to have an interviewee show the slightest amount of passion for his or her chosen profession. It seems that a lot of people in IT simply read the manuals and bang on the keyboard until it works.
  • Anon 2010-06-10 17:18
    Yardik:
    Anon:
    SQLDave:

    Buzzz, also wrong answer. ASSUMING you could clearly tell the interviewer favors (or favored) Tomcat, then there's a golden butt-smooch opportunity. The right answer is something like "Yeah, I lobbied hard for Tomcat because _____, but they didn't listen. I'd like to say their decision worked well for them, but truth be told they've had a terrible time with JBoss because ____"


    Buzzz, still the wrong answer. You sound like a whinny pussy. Besides, the article stated that all these decisions were made before the interviewee started at their current/last employer, so your statement would be a straight up lie.


    Buzzz even more wrong answer. Who cares what you look like to anyone but the interviewer? It's a job interview, your job as interviewee is to get the job, by whatever means possible, as long as you believe you can do a good job of it once you're in the door. If that means a little butt smooching.. sweet, pucker up. If you want to be successful in the corporate world sometimes you need to realize it's more important that people *like* you and feel that you fit the org, than your arrogance and pride be demonstrated.

    Coming from someone who has been offered every job they have ever interviewed for. It's all about confidence and manipulation. Screw pride, I'd rather make the big bucks.


    I think you misunderstood me. I didn't mean there was a problem with butt kissing, but that you'd sound whinny to the interviewer if you go with the "I told them to use x, but they used y instead, if only they'd listened to me they wouldn't have problem z". Bashing your current/former employer isn't terribly attractive.
    Oh, and of course, getting caught in a lie is a sure fire way to not get the job.
  • Larry 2010-06-10 17:39
    Jaime:
    It seems that a lot of people in IT simply read the manuals and bang on the keyboard until it works.
    There are manuals? Your ideas intrigue me and I'd like to subscribe to your newsletter... as long as I don't have to read anything. Sorry, anything worth my time has a clicky draggy droppy interface with brightly colored cartoons, cute sounds and animations, you know, all the stuff necessary to keep a three year old's attention.
  • Spud 2010-06-10 18:00
    Anon:
    Buzzz, wrong answer. Sure it was a decision made some time ago and of course you can't retroactively change those decisions, but the right answer was to say something along the lines of "well with JBoss you can do x which you can't do in Tomcat...." (or vice versa). You don't have to agree that one is better than the other, but you should understand what the relative strengths and weaknesses are.


    You sir, are an idiot. He already said he was a front-end developer and was not involved in the back-end server decisions. Why should he know or care?
  • SoaperGEM 2010-06-10 18:37
    83 comments and no one has pointed out yet that Alex spelled "interrupting" wrong?
  • fjf 2010-06-10 20:43
    r2k:
    C+=2 is one fewer character and equivalent!
    Nope. "+=2" is pre-increment, "++" is post-increment (and doesn't yield an lvalue, so "C++++" isn't valid).

    You can fuck off now.
  • davedavenotdavemaybedave 2010-06-10 20:52
    2010-06-10 10:53 • by Iain Collins

    until relatively recently it was illegal to displaying weight in anything but metric units, but this was challenged and now non-metric values may be provided as supplementary indicators


    Urban myth, I'm afraid.
  • Listconnt Smalle 2010-06-10 21:03
    Indeed.
  • davedavenotdavemaybedave 2010-06-10 21:15
    As the OP of the article, you're right. I should have expressed a greater interest in the back-end, and the fact is, I did indeed have some knowledge of JBoss and the other technologies I was not involved with at my former employer.


    I think you're right. If the interviewer's a tosser, you don't want to work there. Stipulating that you don't want to work with this bloke, there is another course of action, probably akin, and yet subtly different to just blowing the interview off.

    You will, every now and again, get results with behaviour from the school that says that in this situation you find out who the interviewer reports back to, and raise with them the issue that you were interested in working for their company until you met X, who is an incompetent, bullying arsehole. If the top boss is shocked and appalled by this, and actually does something about it instead of kicking you out on the street, then stick to them like glue.

    Generally, sucking up to bullies doesn't work. Confronting them head-on works far more often than you'd think - although still far less often than not... But you're always better off politely telling someone that what they said was unnecessarily rude than just sitting in silence seething.
  • Dwight S 2010-06-10 22:57
    Internet Tough Guy:

    I'll challenge any one of you fuckers to a fight!
    I will fight you. I bring a Samurai sword and cut your head off. You lose. I win, proving once again I am superior to you.

    You ask for a rematch and bring a Samurai sword. I bring a howitzer, and blow you to bits. You lose. I win again. I celebrate at my farm by drinking champagne made from beets. Ummm, delicious. Would you like some? Oh, that's right, you can't have any because you're DEAD!
  • RogerInHawaii 2010-06-10 23:05
    blunder:

    What is it with programmers and parsing things literally?


    Ummm, because that's what programmers do. Would you prefer that we parse things figuratively?
  • Eternal Density 2010-06-11 04:03
    I've got this weird feeling that I read all these some time last year.

    Also, did they use TubeRodent in addition to C-Pound?
  • Don 2010-06-11 04:42
    Anon:
    To give the first interviewer the benefit of the doubt, I think he might have been challenging the interviewee to compare and contrast the various technologies that could have been used. It seem a relevant question to me and the "that happened before my time" answer is a missed opportunity by the interviewee.


    "JBoss?!" the interviewer jumped in, "why didn't they use Tomcat, if they were going to use Java?"

    "I'm not sure,"


    Buzzz, wrong answer. Sure it was a decision made some time ago and of course you can't retroactively change those decisions, but the right answer was to say something along the lines of "well with JBoss you can do x which you can't do in Tomcat...." (or vice versa). You don't have to agree that one is better than the other, but you should understand what the relative strengths and weaknesses are.


    Yep.. precisely what I was thinking. This is more of a WTF on the interviewee not understanding their own environment than the interviewer being a pr*t
  • Bellinghman 2010-06-11 05:27
    Accent Opaque:
    Mister Zimbu:
    Yes, it's called the pound symbol in America.

    Honestly, I haven't the slightest clue as to why- we don't even use it to abbreviate the word "pound" in any context that I'm aware of. Unfortunately, it was named before my time.

    It's used throughout the paper and printing industries. That paper you put in the copier is probably 20# (twenty-pound) white text. Your fancy brochures are, say, a combination of 80# gloss cover and 100# matte text.
    I suspect this is 'throughout the paper and printing industries in the US'.

    Over here, your standard copier paper is 80 gsm (grams per square meter). Until now, I had never heard of 20# paper.
  • Dan the motherfucking Man 2010-06-11 05:46
    CAPTCHA: Gfyrse

    Go fuck yourself.
  • Johnny 2010-06-11 06:02
    davedavenotdavemaybedave:
    2010-06-10 10:53 • by Iain Collins

    until relatively recently it was illegal to displaying weight in anything but metric units, but this was challenged and now non-metric values may be provided as supplementary indicators


    Urban myth, I'm afraid.

    [Citation Needed]

    I'm not saying your wrong but if you're going to come out with a point blank dismissal then you need to provide some proof. I'm sure you can link us to something relevant to support your assertion. Thanks.
  • Burpy 2010-06-11 06:05
    Herby:
    HopelessIntern:
    Pete:
    Good old C-Pound my favourite language.

    I don't even know where that comes from I could understand C-Hash or C-Number. Is it called that in America? I'm from the UK so pound is £.

    Yeah in the states, the # symbol is called a pound. Still, it is no excuse. C-pound is just as wrong as C-hash or C-number, any competent IT-related professional should know it is C-sharp (it makes sense too, its musical notation).

    Back when I was doing telephone work, there was great confusion on what to call the '#' character. One in our staff said "you know like the tic-tac-toe game". Of course the dumb droid on the other end of the phone then knew what we were talking about. As for languages, Microsoft should have chosen the equivalent: 'D-flat' as a language. Would have made more sense!


    I usually describe myself as a C-tic-tac-toe senior developer when I'm on the phone with HR folks. What's the problem with this?
  • cheap jordans 2010-06-11 06:46
  • Iain Collins 2010-06-11 07:06
    davedavenotdavemaybedave:
    2010-06-10 10:53 • by Iain Collins

    until relatively recently it was illegal to displaying weight in anything but metric units, but this was challenged and now non-metric values may be provided as supplementary indicators


    Urban myth, I'm afraid.


    Okay, strap in everyone .. we are going off topic ... ;-)

    The position you take on it may depend on who you choose to believe (retailers, lawyers, or EU commissioners), and how much documentation you can dig up (naturally the legislation is not defined in a single document readily available for easy review). The long standing confusion is a result of European Union commissioners being deliberately evasive and contradictory on the issue.

    In the first instance, when the regulation enforcing the use of metric came in to force in 2000 (having been agreed up to in principle decades before) the rights to display imperial measurements did not certainly extend beyond last year (2009).

    In 2007 an EU Enterprise and Industry commissioner unhelpfully declared that - while the use of metric was mandatory - there never was and never will be a moratorium on using imperial measurements along side metric values in the UK. The EU also declared that err the deadline for using imperial measurements in addition to metric values was extended to 2010.

    The notion that there never would be a moratorium on using imperial measurements as well was based entirely on the unspoken and facile notion that they always planned to keep extending the deadline for it *indefinitely*, at least until no one cared enough to object strenuously enough (which is modus operandi for unelected EU mandarins).

    However, by then many large vendors had taken the position that the use of imperial values alongside metric ones was /already/ illegal (based on their interpretation of the existing statutes) and that at the very least it wasn't worth risking prosecution over. The European Enterprise and Industry commission where not unhappy about this.

    The commissioners statement that it was not (and never would be be illegal) was only an attempt at a mitigating clarification after the fact, couched in a misleading and evasive manner and delivered only in direct response to a High Court trial which confirmed that legislation covering the sale of imperial measurements alone was legally binding (which everyone did know already, but lots of people we just not very happy about and so chose to take a stand on).

    I am (obviously) not against the adoption of metric, and strongly in favour of European social and economic integration - however I'm also in favour of a Europe that has at least some vague semblance of democracy, where policy is transparent and is set by elected officials (with key decisions to subject to public consultation).

    * Mostly from memory, with some double checking of dates. Stuck in the mind as got a lot of press coverage in things like Private Eye.
  • Anonymous 2010-06-11 07:14
  • Johnny 2010-06-11 07:24
    Iain Collins:
    davedavenotdavemaybedave:
    2010-06-10 10:53 • by Iain Collins

    until relatively recently it was illegal to displaying weight in anything but metric units, but this was challenged and now non-metric values may be provided as supplementary indicators


    Urban myth, I'm afraid.


    <Snipped well crafted and informative response>

    Sorry dave but Iain has crafted a very good response here and you couldn't even provide a citation for your "urban myth" assertion. It's pretty obvious who's got the stronger case here. But hey, thanks for your brusque input.
  • plasmab 2010-06-11 07:29
    The real WTF is that the author wonders why he's not getting offered jobs.
  • Anonymous 2010-06-11 07:31
    Anonymous:
    joeyadams:
    Addendum (2010-06-10 09:25):
    On a sidenote, Akismet blocked this post as spam until I appended meaningless repetitive text. Remember, Ralphie, if your nose starts bleeding it means you're picking it too much... or not enough.

    This is typical of Akismet, the damn thing is so twitchy that it's flagged a link to the same domain as the originating page. Shows you just how poor Akismet really is; I've had false positives in the past in which there were no links at all! I guess it's better than the spam but I'm sure there are far better solutions out there than Akismet. I've also heard that the developers can be vindictive dicks if you piss them off.

    Anonymous:


    I rest me case. I can't believe this actually happened in the same damn post that I mentioned it in earlier. Can we get an "I Hate Akismet Club" going?
  • div 2010-06-11 07:31
    regeya:
    A hash symbol is similar to musical notation to mark a sharp note. If you increment one note up from C in a 12-tone system, the next note is C#.

    So, it's a play on C++.


    Nope. As pointed out earlier, C sharp is a half-tone above C. But C++ is C incremented by one. So it is a clear admission by Microsoft that C# is half a step backwards from C++.
  • greebo 2010-06-11 07:38
    I never heard from that employer again.


    well, that just takes the piss
  • C4I_Officer 2010-06-11 07:47
    I like how guys like Anon just chime in to say "You wouldn't get hired at MY company, with that attitude" or "We don't like people like yourself 'round our neck of the woods!" by justifying the unjustifiable.

    The interviewer was just snapping out of control, and I don't mean he was playing the dozens. At best it could fall into the category of those esoteric Hypothetical Question-type interviews.
  • fjf 2010-06-11 08:06
    Yeah.
  • Bellinghman 2010-06-11 08:53
    Johnny:
    Sorry dave but Iain has crafted a very good response here and you couldn't even provide a citation for your "urban myth" assertion. It's pretty obvious who's got the stronger case here. But hey, thanks for your brusque input.
    In contrast to your summary, the odd thing is that Iain's response appears to me to actually contradict his original statement ("until relatively recently it was illegal to displaying weight in anything but metric units").

    So until we have something that supports the original assertion, Dave is entitled to call it an urban myth. Iain's phrase "based on their interpretation of the existing statutes" indicates that there was a belief that imperial measures were forbidden, but the rest of the post indicates that though there may have been an aspiration that imperial units would be phased out, this phasing out has yet to actually occur.

    (And I certainly have seen dual units displayed all the while.)
  • frits 2010-06-11 09:01
    div:
    regeya:
    A hash symbol is similar to musical notation to mark a sharp note. If you increment one note up from C in a 12-tone system, the next note is C#.

    So, it's a play on C++.


    Nope. As pointed out earlier, C sharp is a half-tone above C. But C++ is C incremented by one. So it is a clear admission by Microsoft that C# is half a step backwards from C++.


    So are you saying that C++ is really D?
  • amischiefr 2010-06-11 09:10
    A few days later I was, in fact, offered a job, but I turned it down. Not because of the f-bomb, but because of the commute.

    And here lies TRWTF. Why on earth did you go to an interview at somewhere you never planned to work at because of the commute? Thanks for wasting their time scumbag.
  • My Little Pony 2010-06-11 09:24
    The problem was that some people *only* showed the imperial measurements. They got into trouble for that.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metric_Martyrs
  • Brendan 2010-06-11 09:44
    Hi,

    mace:
    Exactly why does a drug testing company need over a dozen different programming languages? That doesn't sound like using "the right tool to solve the right problem".


    I think it's time to introduce standardised naming conventions.

    Chocolate biscuit = a biscuit made with chocolate
    Dog biscuit = a biscuit made with dogs
    Urine/blood testing = testing the contents of urine/blood
    Drug testing = so smashed you don't know which language to use

    -Brendan
  • Sterile Needles 2010-06-11 10:09
    frits:
    cconroy:
    Septic Tank:
    I say tom-art-o you say tom-ate-o.


    WhoTF says "tom-art-o"?


    That spelling makes sense if Septic Tank has a non-rhotic accent.


    Correct! cconroy might be surprised to learn that there is life outside of America and it's actually where the English language originated - in Europe, England.

    Isn't it amazing.
  • Kensey 2010-06-11 11:02
    amischiefr:
    A few days later I was, in fact, offered a job, but I turned it down. Not because of the f-bomb, but because of the commute.

    And here lies TRWTF. Why on earth did you go to an interview at somewhere you never planned to work at because of the commute? Thanks for wasting their time scumbag.


    Sometimes you would consider taking a hit if the compensation is right. Just recently I switched jobs and during the interview process, one company really wanted me. The job they had didn't sound quite as interesting as the other one I had just started interviewing for, but it had good points that pretty much balanced that out.

    If they'd come across on the health-insurance issue I'd have gone with them, but not having a real group health plan turned out to be a deal-breaker (their original plan of paying for private insurance for me turned out to be a no-go because my wife was already pregnant at the time and no private plan would cover her pregnancy).

    I don't consider that to be me having "wasted their time", especially as they knew early on that the insurance was a key issue. They were at least understanding of why I decided the way I did.

    Likewise, although my normal commute range is an hour, I will (and have) gone further if the employer is willing to compensate in some way (work-at-home, paying for mass transit, flex time, or just higher pay).
  • McDonald's is hiring 2010-06-11 11:07

    Sorry, but most interviews aren't like your experiences applying for jobs at fast food joints.

    Your job as an interviewee is, among other things, to find out if the job is one you want. Why kiss ass if it's for a job that you are going to hate? Simply to you can put a notch in your belt and say, "I got an offer at a sucky job?"

    And I'd rather hire someone who is going to enjoy their job and take pride in it. Among other things, I know they're not going to jump ship at the next shiny nickle.
  • Commuting 2010-06-11 11:09
    I interviewed at a company where I thought was a good match and it was interesting, but the commute was horrendous (let's just say I fly home every weekend.)

    And you know what, I ended up taking the job because it was a good offer, the company was a great fit and because it was the best offer on the table. Sometimes you might be trepidatious about a commute only to find the other factors make up for it.
  • Kensey 2010-06-11 11:19
    Yardik:
    It's a job interview, your job as interviewee is to get the job, by whatever means possible, as long as you believe you can do a good job of it once you're in the door. If that means a little butt smooching.. sweet, pucker up. If you want to be successful in the corporate world sometimes you need to realize it's more important that people *like* you and feel that you fit the org, than your arrogance and pride be demonstrated.

    Coming from someone who has been offered every job they have ever interviewed for. It's all about confidence and manipulation. Screw pride, I'd rather make the big bucks.


    Speaking as someone who's technical-interviewed a number of candidates for several positions, your claim falls down for the following reasons:

    1) If you puff up that resume and try to fake it in the interview, my colleagues and I are going to catch you out and dump you on the street. (I've seen some really sad cases, guys who were passed to us with good marks from management but within five minutes of technical interview clearly wanted to be doing anything but answering the very basic questions we put to them.)

    2) Assuming you lack the skills but are somehow clever enough to fake us out or kiss enough higher-up ass and get the job, we're still going to figure it out pretty fast. Even if we can't get rid of you ourselves, we can make you wish the company would hurry up and fire you already. Not by overt abuse, just by making sure the limits of your competence are thoroughly explored and well-documented.

    3) If you do have the skills, but you still have to kiss the interviewer's butt to get the job, the organization has issues that will quickly make you just as miserable (if not more so) as scenario 2.

    4) If you have the skills, and butt-kissing is not required, but you do it anyway, any half-bright interviewer is going to detect the brown on your nose and think you're doing it because you don't actually have the chops. No job for you.

    So that's two no-jobs, and two jobs you hate. Personally I'd rather do it my way, where I get the jobs I like and leave when I don't like them any more. I don't get everything I interview for, but I always like what I get.
  • operagost 2010-06-11 15:38
    Herby:
    As for languages, Microsoft should have chosen the equivalent: 'D-flat' as a language. Would have made more sense!

    "So what are you coding that in?"
    "Dee-Bee!"
  • oheso 2010-06-12 00:43
    Jaime:
    It seems that a lot of people in IT simply read the manuals and bang on the keyboard until it works.


    What -- you know a better way?
  • Quirkafleeg 2010-06-12 12:28
    Anon:
    […]
    "JBoss?!" the interviewer jumped in, "why didn't they use Tomcat, if they were going to use Java?"

    "I'm not sure,"
    Buzzz, wrong answer. Sure it was a decision made some time ago and of course you can't retroactively change those decisions, but the right answer was to say something along the lines of "well with JBoss you can do x which you can't do in Tomcat...." (or vice versa).
    That wouldn't be answering the question which was asked, though, or it could be lying (implying that you know why). Or it may actually be why.

    I say answer the question as given, then add something like your “well with JBoss” if it seems necessary.
  • Quirkafleeg 2010-06-12 13:23
    Sterile Needles:
    cconroy might be surprised to learn that there is life outside of America and it's actually where the English language originated - in Europe, England.

    Isn't it amazing.
    What? That Europe is part of England? No, not really…
  • foxyshadis 2010-06-12 18:19
    Commuting:
    I interviewed at a company where I thought was a good match and it was interesting, but the commute was horrendous (let's just say I fly home every weekend.)

    And you know what, I ended up taking the job because it was a good offer, the company was a great fit and because it was the best offer on the table. Sometimes you might be trepidatious about a commute only to find the other factors make up for it.

    Plus you can always move once you decide the job is a keeper - it's not like any home is set in stone, no matter how much you have invested in one. It's just another decision to weigh.

    Best of all, the IRS will allow you to deduct your moving costs over 50 miles (+the distance of your old commute) after your regular deductions. It's a win-win unless you can't bear to leave town.
  • da Doctah 2010-06-13 17:37
    regeya:

    Honestly, I haven't the slightest clue as to why- we don't even use it to abbreviate the word "pound" in any context that I'm aware of. Unfortunately, it was named before my time.


    A hash symbol is similar to musical notation to mark a sharp note. If you increment one note up from C in a 12-tone system, the next note is C#.

    So, it's a play on C++.


    And a half-step up from C# is Cx. (Or C× if you're going to get all typographical on me.) Which in equal tempering is the same as D. Which leads one to wonder why they still haven't come out with PL/2 or Fivetran.

    (Confession: I've seen the double-sharp notation in actual music maybe twice in the last forty years.)
  • Scarlet Manuka 2010-06-13 23:23
    da Doctah:
    (Confession: I've seen the double-sharp notation in actual music maybe twice in the last forty years.)
    I have some sheet music which uses it (more specifically, some flute pieces by Miriam Hyde, if I recall correctly). When you're in a base key with five or six sharps to start with, you tend to get the odd double-sharp cropping up.

    Also, wouldn't it be either PL/J or PL/II?
  • Anonymous 2010-06-14 07:03
    So let me get this right - Aksimet will happily block legitimate posts from legitimate commenters but it can't manage to block genuine spam from genuine spammers. This is absolutely pathetic.
  • luis.espinal 2010-06-14 12:00
    amischiefr:
    A few days later I was, in fact, offered a job, but I turned it down. Not because of the f-bomb, but because of the commute.

    And here lies TRWTF. Why on earth did you go to an interview at somewhere you never planned to work at because of the commute? Thanks for wasting their time scumbag.


    Hmmm, using derogatory 3rd-grade antics for calling someone's alleged lack of professionalism. Fascinating. How does that work for you?

    Rhetorical question aside, you have a very strange notion regarding interviews etiquette. The only time that it is really questionable to walk away from an offer is only after you have accepted it and with just a few days before the start date.

    Everything else is a matter of tact. You and the company are trying to iron out a employee-employer relation based on remuneration, cost and traded benefits.

    It is within the realm of possibilities that you receive an offer with a monetary value below what you need (or want) to drive a certain distance. You can counter offer, or you can decline.

    In principle, there is nothing scumbaggy about it. Welcome to life.
  • EngleBart 2010-06-14 17:10
    Plz Send Me The Code:
    I don't get the 'pipes' faux pas.
    The company person was referring to a production pipeline or queue.

    The interviewee interpretted it as a pun on biological "pipes" (ureter/intestine/colon) which offended the company person.

    Psychic Captcha: genitus. Not exactly what I was talking about, but in the same neighborhood.
  • Mike 2010-06-15 07:27
    Doodle:
    I'd settle for C++++.


    I think they did, not sure if this will come out right but I think the ++++ is basically:

    ++
    ++
  • Cbuttius 2010-06-16 11:40
    Herby:
    HopelessIntern:
    Pete:
    Good old C-Pound my favourite language.

    I don't even know where that comes from I could understand C-Hash or C-Number. Is it called that in America? I'm from the UK so pound is £.

    Yeah in the states, the # symbol is called a pound. Still, it is no excuse. C-pound is just as wrong as C-hash or C-number, any competent IT-related professional should know it is C-sharp (it makes sense too, its musical notation).

    Back when I was doing telephone work, there was great confusion on what to call the '#' character. One in our staff said "you know like the tic-tac-toe game". Of course the dumb droid on the other end of the phone then knew what we were talking about. As for languages, Microsoft should have chosen the equivalent: 'D-flat' as a language. Would have made more sense!


    except that the game is called noughts and crosses here.
  • Jay 2010-06-24 12:19
    da Doctah:
    And a half-step up from C# is Cx. (Or C× if you're going to get all typographical on me.) Which in equal tempering is the same as D. Which leads one to wonder why they still haven't come out with PL/2 or Fivetran.


    When I was in college, we used a Fortran compiler developed at the University of Waterloo that implemented the Fortran IV (as in Roman numeral 4) standard, which they called "WATFOR", as in WATerloo FORtran. Then they made a new version that they called WATFIV. It stood for WATerloo Fortran IV, but it was pretty obvious that FIV was chosen to sound like one more than FOR.
  • Jay 2010-06-24 12:29
    Jaime:
    I'd kill to have an interviewee show the slightest amount of passion for his or her chosen profession. It seems that a lot of people in IT simply read the manuals and bang on the keyboard until it works.


    You've known IT people who read the manuals?
  • EJ 2010-08-19 01:17
    Jay:
    Jaime:
    I'd kill to have an interviewee show the slightest amount of passion for his or her chosen profession. It seems that a lot of people in IT simply read the manuals and bang on the keyboard until it works.


    You've known IT people who read the manuals?


    If all else fails, read the manual.
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  • Poochy.EXE 2010-09-05 07:15
    "Apparently, my inability to influence past decisions limited my employment opportunities at this new company."

    Did this job, by any chance, require prior experience in working with a flux capacitor?
  • C. Abraham 2012-03-04 12:40
    Can I use the 'rebutter' as a person who presents a counter-argument in a debate?