Comment On Apple, Simple and Elegant

Hmm, yes or no...

Hey, does the MAC come with a dictionary or do we take the sentence to Hawkeye Piece (so that he can have it shortened by Wednesday)?

Fist!

(no. Not that fist. This is shaking one at MAC)

Hmm. I have no problem understanding this dialog box.

As a PC supporter, I actually appreciate the verboseness of that message. Windows has a lot of annoyances caused by copying and overwriting files.

P.S. Yes I understand the absence of Yes/No is the WTF.

Of course, the real WTF is the use of "Keanu Reeves" and "suave" within the same sentence.

I felt like having a bash at making this a better phrased dialogue...

"Some items already exist in the destination folder with the same names but differing case. Do you want to overwrite them?"

Yes | No

Those ads are the smuggest ever. I know that's not a word, shutup.

I guess that the reason for this dialog is that File.txt and file.txt can be different on darwin. Hmmm. Except that they can't:

.touch File.txt
.touch file.txt
.ls *.txt
File.txt
.

So. I don't know. Never mind, nothing to see here.

Odd. When I try to reproduce that error message on MacOS 10.4.5, I get a totally different dialog box: "An item named "foo" already exists in this location. Do you want to replace it with the one you are moving?" Options are: "Don't Replace", "Stop", and "Replace". There is also a checkbox labeled "Apply to all".

gilleain:

I guess that the reason for this dialog is that File.txt and file.txt can be different on darwin. Hmmm. Except that they can't:

.touch File.txt
.touch file.txt
.ls *.txt
File.txt

ls shows both files for me. However this is probably because I selected "HFS+ Journaled (Case-Sensitive)" when I repartitioned my hard drive before reinstalling MacOS X 10.4. By default, I believe MacOS X uses a non-case-senstive variant of HFS+ file system.

pinkduck:

I felt like having a bash at making this a better phrased dialogue...

"Some items already exist in the destination folder with the same names but differing case. Do you want to overwrite them?"

Yes | No | Maybe | File not found

Fixed.

gkdada:

Hey, does the MAC come with a dictionary

Yep. Ever since MacOS X 10.0 or NeXTstep 1.0 (from which MacOS X is based). Works system-wide (using contextual menus) and has a pretty nice Dictionary app too.

Pitty MacOS X doesn't ship with the complete works of Shakespeare, as NeXTstep did back in the 1980s.

You are now coming to a sad realization about Macs, cancel or allow?

sir digby chicken caesar?

keanu reeves?

( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QACSo5xk3dE )

wtf?

You are now coming to a sad realization about Macs, cancel or allow?

Don't be silly. There's only one button:

OK.

Judah:

You are now coming to a sad realization about Macs, cancel or allow?

I don't think I could have said it better.

| yes | no | maybe |

captcha: digdug

The Real WTF™ is that you used "Keanu Reeves-esqe" as a compliment.

jaserlet:

ls shows both files for me. However this is probably because I selected "HFS+ Journaled (Case-Sensitive)" when I repartitioned my hard drive before reinstalling MacOS X 10.4. By default, I believe MacOS X uses a non-case-senstive variant of HFS+ file system.

Ah yes . . . macs are so much easier to use than PCs. Lovely.

Captcha: Doom? Perhaps . . .

Even if it were a yes-no-question, it would still be wrong. Look at the word "continue". File managers should warn you about potential problems before any action has taken place, not halfway the procedure.

What the fuck?

Anonymous:

pinkduck:

I felt like having a bash at making this a better phrased dialogue...

"Some items already exist in the destination folder with the same names but differing case. Do you want to overwrite them?"

Yes | No | Maybe | File not found

Fixed.

In that context, FileNotFound might actually make sense - not as an action of course, but still...

I think this is an acceptable extension to the one button mouse interface.

Anonymous:

pinkduck:

I felt like having a bash at making this a better phrased dialogue...

"Some items already exist in the destination folder with the same names but differing case. Do you want to overwrite them?"

Yes | No | Maybe | File not found

Fixed.

And don't forget, the return type HAS to be a boolean yet still allow all four of those values plus a fifth for the programmer to drink whenever he encounters one of these.

After much soul searching, I finally got my first Mac last week. I opened WTF today, saw that dialog and have been attempting to press that OK button for 30 minutes now but, no joy.

I thought Macs were supposed to be easy to use <snarls>

KattMan:

Anonymous:

pinkduck:

I felt like having a bash at making this a better phrased dialogue...

"Some items already exist in the destination folder with the same names but differing case. Do you want to overwrite them?"

Yes | No | Maybe | File not found

Fixed.

And don't forget, the return type HAS to be a boolean yet still allow all four of those values plus a fifth for the programmer to drink whenever he encounters one of these.

There's just no way to kill those jokes, is there?

This is probably triggered by trying to copy files from a case insensitive file system (e.g. HFS+) to a case sensitive one (e.g ext3.)

still loving the joke:

KattMan:

Anonymous:

pinkduck:

I felt like having a bash at making this a better phrased dialogue...

"Some items already exist in the destination folder with the same names but differing case. Do you want to overwrite them?"

Yes | No | Maybe | File not found

Fixed.

And don't forget, the return type HAS to be a boolean yet still allow all four of those values plus a fifth for the programmer to drink whenever he encounters one of these.

There's just no way to kill those jokes, is there?

Especially when oracle actually has a specification for tri-state booleans with four states:
http://www.oracle.com/technology/products/jdev/esdk/api1013/oracle/ide/util/TriStateBoolean.html

KattMan:

still loving the joke:

KattMan:

Anonymous:

pinkduck:

I felt like having a bash at making this a better phrased dialogue...

"Some items already exist in the destination folder with the same names but differing case. Do you want to overwrite them?"

Yes | No | Maybe | File not found

Fixed.

And don't forget, the return type HAS to be a boolean yet still allow all four of those values plus a fifth for the programmer to drink whenever he encounters one of these.

There's just no way to kill those jokes, is there?

Especially when oracle actually has a specification for tri-state booleans with four states:
http://www.oracle.com/technology/products/jdev/esdk/api1013/oracle/ide/util/TriStateBoolean.html

Oh. My. Dear. Lord.

those ads always make me want to buy a PC becuase John Hodgman is so awesome and the Mac guy is so irritatingly smug.

anne:

the Mac guy is so irritatingly smug.

Congratulations, you just described 90% of Mac users.
Odd how a lot of them generally can't seem to handle tasks through which their hand is not held, when working with a computer.

A thought...
If that four-state tri-bool was stored in a table and was null, does that mean it's a penta-bool?
Do we have a winner?

You might want to reconsider what you store your data with, if that's so.

snoofle:

KattMan:

still loving the joke:

KattMan:

Anonymous:

pinkduck:

I felt like having a bash at making this a better phrased dialogue...

"Some items already exist in the destination folder with the same names but differing case. Do you want to overwrite them?"

Yes | No | Maybe | File not found

Fixed.

And don't forget, the return type HAS to be a boolean yet still allow all four of those values plus a fifth for the programmer to drink whenever he encounters one of these.

There's just no way to kill those jokes, is there?

Especially when oracle actually has a specification for tri-state booleans with four states:
http://www.oracle.com/technology/products/jdev/esdk/api1013/oracle/ide/util/TriStateBoolean.html

Oh. My. Dear. Lord.

Indeed.

Opie:

A thought...
If that four-state tri-bool was stored in a table and was null, does that mean it's a penta-bool?
Do we have a winner?

You might want to reconsider what you store your data with, if that's so.

No, the fourth state of the tri-bool is for the non-initialized value. This is what I thought most people wanted the third state in a boolean for.

I still need a fifth to drink after that one though.

4-state logic can be achieved with 2 bits and can be accomplished with standard logical operators and no WTFs whatsoever.
Who the bloody hell at Oracle allowed someone to create that?

That actually upsets me and raises questions in my mind about what is going on under the hood in Oracle.

jaserlet:

gkdada:

Hey, does the MAC come with a dictionary

Yep. Ever since MacOS X 10.0 or NeXTstep 1.0 (from which MacOS X is based). Works system-wide (using contextual menus) and has a pretty nice Dictionary app too.

Pitty MacOS X doesn't ship with the complete works of Shakespeare, as NeXTstep did back in the 1980s.

Pitty? Guess the dictionary doesn't work by default, eh?

CAPTCHA: yummy. Mac users are yummy.

HORRIBLY worded error message, but a necessary one. MacOS has both case-insensitive (FAT32, HFS, case-insensitive HFS+) and case-sensitive (case-sensitive HFS+, UFS) filing systems. Most users will never see a case-sensitive filing system, though (case-insensitive HFS+ is the default), so it should be hoped than anyone who actually sees this error message has decided they need a case-sensitive one, and more or less knows what they're doing.

(How does Windows handle this, actually? I know none of the default filing systems are case-sensitive, but it's possible to add support for UFS and ext3 at least, IIRC; isn't there also a case-sensitive version of NTFS?)

Opie:

anne:

the Mac guy is so irritatingly smug.

Congratulations, you just described 90% of Mac users.
Odd how a lot of them generally can't seem to handle tasks through which their hand is not held, when working with a computer.

All Windows users are, of course, utterly brilliant at using their computers. Yes, indeed.

I'm going to catch a lot of flak for this I know, but the Real WTF is that most filesystems support case-sensitive file names.

It may be verbose but it's also dense. It's one long stream of sentences making it very difficult to ascertain what it's actually saying at a glance.

guesto:

Of course, the real WTF is the use of "Keanu Reeves" and "suave" within the same sentence.

Dude, that's like...woah.

Woah.

Dude.

gkdada:

Hey, does the MAC come with a dictionary or do we take the sentence to Hawkeye Piece (so that he can have it shortened by Wednesday)?

Fist!

(no. Not that fist. This is shaking one at MAC)

Mac, goddammit! "MAC" is your NIC's hardware address! Get with the program!

rsynnott:

(How does Windows handle this, actually? I know none of the default filing systems are case-sensitive, but it's possible to add support for UFS and ext3 at least, IIRC; isn't there also a case-sensitive version of NTFS?)

No idea what happens if it hits this problem, but NTFS is technically always case-sensitive. However, the Windows API provides a case-insensitive view of it. If you access it through the Unix subsystem for instance, it's case-sensitive.

Again no clue as to the mechanics of how the two views interact...

EvanED:

I'm going to catch a lot of flak for this I know, but the Real WTF is that most filesystems support case-sensitive file names.

There's a difference between preserving case and case-insensitivity. Further, although NTFS is technically case-insensitive, you'd be hard-pressed to find a situation in which you can use it as such.

Smug *Mac* User:

gkdada:

Hey, does the MAC come with a dictionary or do we take the sentence to Hawkeye Piece (so that he can have it shortened by Wednesday)?

Fist!

(no. Not that fist. This is shaking one at MAC)

Mac, goddammit! "MAC" is your NIC's hardware address! Get with the program!

He was using it correctly. He hates that Vista controls access to his media.

pinkduck:

I felt like having a bash at making this a better phrased dialogue...

"Some items already exist in the destination folder with the same names but differing case. Do you want to overwrite them?"

Yes | No

Will pressing "No" Still copy them but not care about the fact that there diffrent case or stop copying?

I'm guessing back to the drawing board for you :)

Judah:

You are now coming to a sad realization about Macs, cancel or allow?

Ironic that that's a Vista dialog...

You mean "Worse Than Failure"...

bstorer:

EvanED:

I'm going to catch a lot of flak for this I know, but the Real WTF is that most filesystems support case-sensitive file names.

There's a difference between preserving case and case-insensitivity.

I know. Case-preserving is good. Case-preserving makes sense. Not case-preserving would be really obnoxious.

Case-sensitivity, to me, seems like a dumb idea. (This applies to programming languages as much as filesystems.)

EvanED:

bstorer:

EvanED:

I'm going to catch a lot of flak for this I know, but the Real WTF is that most filesystems support case-sensitive file names.

There's a difference between preserving case and case-insensitivity.

I know. Case-preserving is good. Case-preserving makes sense. Not case-preserving would be really obnoxious.

Case-sensitivity, to me, seems like a dumb idea. (This applies to programming languages as much as filesystems.)

It can occasionally become annoying, yes. Common Lisp is generally case insensitive and as standard does not even preserve case. This becomes annoying when interacting with MySQL; the designers of the most popular Lisp database interaction library assumed that SQL database table names are always case-insensitive (I think it's in the standard, somewhere), while in MySQL they aren't always. Confusion ensues, especially as it is IMPOSSIBLE in the current version of that library (CLSQL) to use the object-relational-model with case sensitive table names (you can use the functional model, but it's a pain in the neck).

I discovered yet another example of Apple being the only answer. I tried to watch the ads like the article suggests, then tried to download QuickTime like the adpage suggests and then finally tried to figure which OS version to choose from Win and OS X when my computer is running Linux. It's nice to know they're supporting all the OS's, BOTH of them, in fact. Good Job, Steve!

Alex:

This is probably triggered by trying to copy files from a case insensitive file system (e.g. HFS+) to a case sensitive one (e.g ext3.)

No, it's probably the opposite. A case insensitive file system will fold all letters to one case, and create conflicts in its directory system. A case sensitive file system will gladly accept more filenames from the other side.

Moving "Hello" from HFS+ to ext3 won't conflict with "hello" or "HELLO". However, try moving both the latter files from ext3 to HFS+!