Comment On Classic WTF: Bunker Buster

Finally a story I can identify with. Actually loled at this one. I almost feel like situations like this injure me though, cause me physical anguish to acknowledge their existence. *shudder*

“Whomever”

“descended down”

Merry Christmas.

$5000 for a server? That's outrageous, we can't be spending that kind of money! Now get me my solid gold phone with a direct line to the president, I need to fly out to Russia to pick up a baseball and I hear he has a plane I can use.

Mikoangelo:

“Whomever”

“descended down”

This being a "Classic WTF", your first criticism has already been raised, and has clearly been given the consideration it is due. Your second appears to be new, but Alex sprinkling his articles with an inessential array of redundant adverbs is less so.

moz:

Mikoangelo:

“Whomever”

“descended down”

This being a "Classic WTF", your first criticism has already been raised, and has clearly been given the consideration it is due. Your second appears to be new, but Alex sprinkling his articles with an inessential array of redundant adverbs is less so.

You're right, my bad.

My third point still stands, though.

Uhh, what's wrong with "descended down"? "down" is a preposition telling you where the descending happens. It's really common for verbs in many languages to have an adverbial prefix as well as a preposition (it's especially common in German). It's a kind of agreement pattern and also can provide clarification and additional precision. Of course, most grammar NAZIs would rather see language be reduced to a set of logical propositions written in the most minimalist and orthogonal syntax possible. How...worthless.

I hate you all, grammer nazis... this page could be filled with topcod3r's comments, followed by a similar length debate on trolls.

But it's filled with nitpicking of spelling and sentence structure.

You're all a bunch of fucking nerds. If I ever meet one of you in a dark alley, I will stab you in the face with this gun.

Is this so uncommon? I worked at a place that saved £5000 by buying two old Solaris boxes to run some obscure authentication software for their web servers (the vendor convinced the MD of such wisdom).

The servers were built and taken to the server farm... which only had blade racks.

Two bulky Solaris towers that took up 4 blade spaces each. 2 servers for the rental cost of 8. £5000 didn't pay for a single year for 1 server...

Got to laugh.

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

Uhh, what's wrong with "descended down"? "down" is a preposition telling you where the descending happens. It's really common for verbs in many languages to have an adverbial prefix as well as a preposition (it's especially common in German). It's a kind of agreement pattern and also can provide clarification and additional precision. Of course, most grammar NAZIs would rather see language be reduced to a set of logical propositions written in the most minimalist and orthogonal syntax possible. How...worthless.

Don't confuse grammar nazis and style nazis.
You should pay attention to grammar nazis, otherwise you find yourself being either unintelligible or saying something other than you intended.

Style nazis, on the other hand should be ignored at will, unless you know they prefer the same style rules you do.
English is more flexible than the style nazis would have you believe (as you noted)

What's with all the republished articles? I want to read new stuff!

Ah, government IT. Only academic IT seems to be worse. The problems are similar: the pay is too low, the managers care too little about infrastructure, and generally speaking nobody has the slightest idea of what they are doing. Well, as long as it is nothing too important...

Semaj:

I hate you all, grammer nazis... this page could be filled with topcod3r's comments, followed by a similar length debate on trolls.

But it's filled with nitpicking of spelling and sentence structure.

You're all a bunch of fucking nerds. If I ever meet one of you in a dark alley, I will stab you in the face with this gun.

So.. making fun of people for writing fucked up stuff in Java or C++ is not nerdy, but making fun of people for writing fucked up stuff in English is nerdy. Gotcha.

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

Uhh, what's wrong with "descended down"?

let me guess, you are one of those guys that writes if(foo == true) and calls .ToString() on strings, right?

Shmork:

Ah, government IT. Only academic IT seems to be worse. The problems are similar: the pay is too low, the managers care too little about infrastructure, and generally speaking nobody has the slightest idea of what they are doing. Well, as long as it is nothing too important...

Those things come and go in phases, a bit like the seasons or, more appropriately given the timescales involved, Milankovitch Cycles. Essentially, after they've neglected things badly for many years you get a catastrophic failure that forces the problem in the faces of all the senior administrators (possibly involving the cause of major loss of face to bigwig academics) and money flows into infrastructure for a while. And some other part of the university suffers, perhaps building maintenance and replacement.

University internal management is a dirty dirty business. If you're even tangentially involved, you've got to remember to not take it personally so you don't get stressed out.

The real wtf is that this has been posted already.

Gee, and I thought that the "Classic WTF" was a clue for that ...

slimey_limey:

What's with all the republished articles? I want to read new stuff!

Hey, even Alex and his posse deserve days off once in a while.

Semaj:

I hate you all, grammer nazis... this page could be filled with topcod3r's comments, followed by a similar length debate on trolls.

But it's filled with nitpicking of spelling and sentence structure.

You're all a bunch of fucking nerds. If I ever meet one of you in a dark alley, I will stab you in the face with this gun.

As a "stakeholder" in the whole kill-the-grammar-Nazi's project, I urge you to architect a different solution. Let's face it, at the end of the day, its only you're backstory that counts.

I will never understand why companies want to make it hard to maintain their datacenter by locating it in some remote area. The best thing that has happened to hosting is broadband and DynDNS.

I remember when I first upgraded from using AOL to RoadRunner (back in 2000, before most of you or anyone else probably even knew what RoadRunner was). I started hosting the main web server at home, so when my boss needed me to do something during off-hours, I could respond more quickly.

At first I couldn't figure out how to keep the IP address from changing, and causing the name not to be resolved, but then I learned about DynDNS, and problem solved.

I never took the time to calculate how many 9s I had, but during the best year, I would guess at least five 9s. Let's just say there have been no complaints.

campkev:

Semaj:

I hate you all, grammer nazis... this page could be filled with topcod3r's comments, followed by a similar length debate on trolls.

But it's filled with nitpicking of spelling and sentence structure.

You're all a bunch of fucking nerds. If I ever meet one of you in a dark alley, I will stab you in the face with this gun.

So.. making fun of people for writing fucked up stuff in Java or C++ is not nerdy, but making fun of people for writing fucked up stuff in English is nerdy. Gotcha.

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

Uhh, what's wrong with "descended down"?

let me guess, you are one of those guys that writes if(foo == true) and calls .ToString() on strings, right?

No. But that's a computer language and it has very rigid rules about that kind of stuff. Even so, one might still use "if(foo == true)" because it could clarify for the human reader (i.e., it's not that foo is something (e.g., 1, a valid pointer, whatever) but that it is, specifically, true -- more useful perhaps in weakly and dynamically typed languages).

But with English, things actually aren't entirely redundant as they might seem at first blush, and even if they are, it serves a useful purpose (subject-verb agreement is technically entirely redundant, and yet everyone complains when people don't use it!). In our example, you can use other prepositions with "descend" and, like I said, almost all verbs of motion, even if they have the direction or nature built-in to the stem, take a prepositional phrase that either repeats that direction, or modifies it in some way (in the case of "I descended down the stairs", "I descended the stairs" doesn't quite make sense because you aren't really descending the stairs, but rather the building that contains them by way of the stairs. So it's answering the question "How did I descend?" and the answer is "down the stairs" -- but that's just one example). Most people who think they see redundancy, or unnecessary words or synonyms are not paying attention to nuance, connotation or what the fucking sentence is actually saying. Again, as I said above, some people think that English is a language to express strict, minimalist statements of logical fact. It is not. These extra frills and redundancies (apparent or real) serve a purpose and enhance the language, rather than detract from it (oh, should I have said "detract it" because the "from" is redundant?).

I actually know the exact place this article refers to. Several large companies in the area actually host servers there and all valuable data is stored on them.

And hey, that particular area is really growing up. It's not as far out in the woods and this article makes it seem.

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

These extra frills and redundancies (apparent or real) serve a purpose and enhance the language, rather than detract from it (oh, should I have said "detract it" because the "from" is redundant?).

no, because then you are subtracting english from english...which means it's not a language so why are we using these letters but that means it is a language so we couldn't've detracted it....My head hurts thinking about it.

"Descended down" is a pleonasm.

Can you guess how long I've waited for a reason to use that word?

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

campkev:

Semaj:

I hate you all, grammer nazis... this page could be filled with topcod3r's comments, followed by a similar length debate on trolls.

But it's filled with nitpicking of spelling and sentence structure.

You're all a bunch of fucking nerds. If I ever meet one of you in a dark alley, I will stab you in the face with this gun.

So.. making fun of people for writing fucked up stuff in Java or C++ is not nerdy, but making fun of people for writing fucked up stuff in English is nerdy. Gotcha.

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

Uhh, what's wrong with "descended down"?

let me guess, you are one of those guys that writes if(foo == true) and calls .ToString() on strings, right?

No. But that's a computer language and it has very rigid rules about that kind of stuff. Even so, one might still use "if(foo == true)" because it could clarify for the human reader (i.e., it's not that foo is something (e.g., 1, a valid pointer, whatever) but that it is, specifically, true -- more useful perhaps in weakly and dynamically typed languages).

But with English, things actually aren't entirely redundant as they might seem at first blush, and even if they are, it serves a useful purpose (subject-verb agreement is technically entirely redundant, and yet everyone complains when people don't use it!). In our example, you can use other prepositions with "descend" and, like I said, almost all verbs of motion, even if they have the direction or nature built-in to the stem, take a prepositional phrase that either repeats that direction, or modifies it in some way (in the case of "I descended down the stairs", "I descended the stairs" doesn't quite make sense because you aren't really descending the stairs, but rather the building that contains them by way of the stairs. So it's answering the question "How did I descend?" and the answer is "down the stairs" -- but that's just one example). Most people who think they see redundancy, or unnecessary words or synonyms are not paying attention to nuance, connotation or what the fucking sentence is actually saying. Again, as I said above, some people think that English is a language to express strict, minimalist statements of logical fact. It is not. These extra frills and redundancies (apparent or real) serve a purpose and enhance the language, rather than detract from it (oh, should I have said "detract it" because the "from" is redundant?).

shut. up.
You're not funny, nor clever, nor right.
Facts that make you belong on this site, that's for sure.

From the description of the facility, it sounds like he's talking about the Westlin Bunker

Since it went into private hands it now has a nice office building at the surface, but the real action remains underground, including the jail cells. There's lots of pictures at the link above.

Truly, natural language ≠ computer language.
Also computer language ∉ natural language ∧ natural language ∉ computer language

doesitmatter?thoughtso.:

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

campkev:

Semaj:

I hate you all, grammer nazis... this page could be filled with topcod3r's comments, followed by a similar length debate on trolls.

But it's filled with nitpicking of spelling and sentence structure.

You're all a bunch of fucking nerds. If I ever meet one of you in a dark alley, I will stab you in the face with this gun.

So.. making fun of people for writing fucked up stuff in Java or C++ is not nerdy, but making fun of people for writing fucked up stuff in English is nerdy. Gotcha.

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

Uhh, what's wrong with "descended down"?

let me guess, you are one of those guys that writes if(foo == true) and calls .ToString() on strings, right?

No. But that's a computer language and it has very rigid rules about that kind of stuff. Even so, one might still use "if(foo == true)" because it could clarify for the human reader (i.e., it's not that foo is something (e.g., 1, a valid pointer, whatever) but that it is, specifically, true -- more useful perhaps in weakly and dynamically typed languages).

But with English, things actually aren't entirely redundant as they might seem at first blush, and even if they are, it serves a useful purpose (subject-verb agreement is technically entirely redundant, and yet everyone complains when people don't use it!). In our example, you can use other prepositions with "descend" and, like I said, almost all verbs of motion, even if they have the direction or nature built-in to the stem, take a prepositional phrase that either repeats that direction, or modifies it in some way (in the case of "I descended down the stairs", "I descended the stairs" doesn't quite make sense because you aren't really descending the stairs, but rather the building that contains them by way of the stairs. So it's answering the question "How did I descend?" and the answer is "down the stairs" -- but that's just one example). Most people who think they see redundancy, or unnecessary words or synonyms are not paying attention to nuance, connotation or what the fucking sentence is actually saying. Again, as I said above, some people think that English is a language to express strict, minimalist statements of logical fact. It is not. These extra frills and redundancies (apparent or real) serve a purpose and enhance the language, rather than detract from it (oh, should I have said "detract it" because the "from" is redundant?).

shut. up.
You're not funny, nor clever, nor right.
Facts that make you belong on this site, that's for sure.

doesitmatter?thoughtso.:

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

campkev:

Semaj:

I hate you all, grammer nazis... this page could be filled with topcod3r's comments, followed by a similar length debate on trolls.

But it's filled with nitpicking of spelling and sentence structure.

You're all a bunch of fucking nerds. If I ever meet one of you in a dark alley, I will stab you in the face with this gun.

So.. making fun of people for writing fucked up stuff in Java or C++ is not nerdy, but making fun of people for writing fucked up stuff in English is nerdy. Gotcha.

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

Uhh, what's wrong with "descended down"?

let me guess, you are one of those guys that writes if(foo == true) and calls .ToString() on strings, right?

No. But that's a computer language and it has very rigid rules about that kind of stuff. Even so, one might still use "if(foo == true)" because it could clarify for the human reader (i.e., it's not that foo is something (e.g., 1, a valid pointer, whatever) but that it is, specifically, true -- more useful perhaps in weakly and dynamically typed languages).

But with English, things actually aren't entirely redundant as they might seem at first blush, and even if they are, it serves a useful purpose (subject-verb agreement is technically entirely redundant, and yet everyone complains when people don't use it!). In our example, you can use other prepositions with "descend" and, like I said, almost all verbs of motion, even if they have the direction or nature built-in to the stem, take a prepositional phrase that either repeats that direction, or modifies it in some way (in the case of "I descended down the stairs", "I descended the stairs" doesn't quite make sense because you aren't really descending the stairs, but rather the building that contains them by way of the stairs. So it's answering the question "How did I descend?" and the answer is "down the stairs" -- but that's just one example). Most people who think they see redundancy, or unnecessary words or synonyms are not paying attention to nuance, connotation or what the fucking sentence is actually saying. Again, as I said above, some people think that English is a language to express strict, minimalist statements of logical fact. It is not. These extra frills and redundancies (apparent or real) serve a purpose and enhance the language, rather than detract from it (oh, should I have said "detract it" because the "from" is redundant?).

shut. up.
You're not funny, nor clever, nor right.
Facts that make you belong on this site, that's for sure.

Funny? Clever? You think this is a joke? I'm not here to make stupid jokes about language. I take it very seriously. I studied it in school. I'm not talking out of my ass here; I wrote papers on these kinds of things. I'm sorry you don't like the fact that I am throwing facts and reality into this discussion, when it's more fun to make fun of the way the gracious owner of this site uses language.

Of course, the site had to go slow for me while posting this, so I get the double post of doom. Thanks Alex!

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

doesitmatter?thoughtso.:

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

campkev:

Semaj:

I hate you all, grammer nazis... blah...snore... stab you in the face with this gun.

So.. making fun of people ... is nerdy. Gotcha.

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

Uhh, what's wrong with "descended down"?

let me guess,.... calls .toString() on strings, right?

No... weak ...[self justification].....

But with English, [yawn]....

shut. up.
You're not funny, nor clever, nor right.
Facts that make you belong on this site, that's for sure.

Funny? Clever? You think this is a joke? I'm not here to make stupid jokes about language. I take it very seriously. I studied it in school. I'm not talking out of my ass here; ...

A pity. That would be worth mentioning.

Real-modo:

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

doesitmatter?thoughtso.:

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

campkev:

Semaj:

I hate you all, grammer nazis... blah...snore... stab you in the face with this gun.

So.. making fun of people ... is nerdy. Gotcha.

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

Uhh, what's wrong with "descended down"?

let me guess,.... calls .toString() on strings, right?

No... weak ...[self justification].....

But with English, [yawn]....

shut. up.
You're not funny, nor clever, nor right.
Facts that make you belong on this site, that's for sure.

Funny? Clever? You think this is a joke? I'm not here to make stupid jokes about language. I take it very seriously. I studied it in school. I'm not talking out of my ass here; ...

A pity. That would be worth mentioning.

Great argument...again. I guess people really do get pissed when they are shown to be wrong and instead deflect with pointless personal attacks.

Why do all server admins end up being entirely unstable(especially in government contracts)?

Do they just hire the guy who most resembles J.P. from "Grandma's Boy"?

I can imagine this guy in a black trench coat with neo-glasses. On second thought, if he was that 'hardcore' he might take security a little more seriously.

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

Real-modo:

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

doesitmatter?thoughtso.:

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

campkev:

Semaj:

I hate you all, grammer nazis... blah...snore... stab you in the face with this gun.

So.. making fun of people ... is nerdy. Gotcha.

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

Uhh, what's wrong with "descended down"?

let me guess,.... calls .toString() on strings, right?

No... weak ...[self justification].....

But with English, [yawn]....

shut. up.
You're not funny, nor clever, nor right.
Facts that make you belong on this site, that's for sure.

Funny? Clever? You think this is a joke? I'm not here to make stupid jokes about language. I take it very seriously. I studied it in school. I'm not talking out of my ass here; ...

A pity. That would be worth mentioning.

Great argument...again. I guess people really do get pissed when they are shown to be wrong and instead deflect with pointless personal attacks.

NESTED QUOTES!!!

Mitch:

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

Real-modo:

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

doesitmatter?thoughtso.:

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

campkev:

Semaj:

I hate you all, grammer nazis... blah...snore... stab you in the face with this gun.

So.. making fun of people ... is nerdy. Gotcha.

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

Uhh, what's wrong with "descended down"?

let me guess,.... calls .toString() on strings, right?

No... weak ...[self justification].....

But with English, [yawn]....

shut. up.
You're not funny, nor clever, nor right.
Facts that make you belong on this site, that's for sure.

Funny? Clever? You think this is a joke? I'm not here to make stupid jokes about language. I take it very seriously. I studied it in school. I'm not talking out of my ass here; ...

A pity. That would be worth mentioning.

Great argument...again. I guess people really do get pissed when they are shown to be wrong and instead deflect with pointless personal attacks.

NESTED QUOTES!!!

OH NO! By the way, some languages (C#) require you to write if(foo==true) instead of just if(foo)

tOmcOlins:

Mitch:

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

Real-modo:

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

doesitmatter?thoughtso.:

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

campkev:

Semaj:

I hate you all, grammer nazis... blah...snore... stab you in the face with this gun.

So.. making fun of people ... is nerdy. Gotcha.

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

Uhh, what's wrong with "descended down"?

let me guess,.... calls .toString() on strings, right?

No... weak ...[self justification].....

But with English, [yawn]....

shut. up.
You're not funny, nor clever, nor right.
Facts that make you belong on this site, that's for sure.

Funny? Clever? You think this is a joke? I'm not here to make stupid jokes about language. I take it very seriously. I studied it in school. I'm not talking out of my ass here; ...

A pity. That would be worth mentioning.

Great argument...again. I guess people really do get pissed when they are shown to be wrong and instead deflect with pointless personal attacks.

NESTED QUOTES!!!

OH NO! By the way, some languages (C#) require you to write if(foo==true) instead of just if(foo)

if (foo)

is perfectly valid in C# as long as foo is a bool. I prefer this syntax (and have put into into several coding standards) as it avoids the semantic error created by dropping an equals sign:

if (foo = true)

Semaj:

I hate you all, grammer nazis... this page could be filled with topcod3r's comments, followed by a similar length debate on trolls.

But it's filled with nitpicking of spelling and sentence structure.

You're all a bunch of fucking nerds. If I ever meet one of you in a dark alley, I will stab you in the face with this gun.

This is funnier than the article. Now try this: Flame Warriors

Yes, I am also a grammarian. But I have a cure. It's called "ah, fuckit"

Was anyone else waiting for there to be a gag about carefully entering an ultra-secure underground bunker with a box with a biohazard symbol on it? Cuz I'm a bit disappointed

Holy Shit Captcha: plaga

I guess in this "seven-figure government contract" the last four digits are for the costs and the first three digits for the win...

Vic Tim:

Was anyone else waiting for there to be a gag about carefully entering an ultra-secure underground bunker with a box with a biohazard symbol on it? Cuz I'm a bit disappointed

Holy Shit Captcha: plaga

lol :P

campkev:

Semaj:

I hate you all, grammer nazis... this page could be filled with topcod3r's comments, followed by a similar length debate on trolls.

But it's filled with nitpicking of spelling and sentence structure.

You're all a bunch of fucking nerds. If I ever meet one of you in a dark alley, I will stab you in the face with this gun.

So.. making fun of people for writing fucked up stuff in Java or C++ is not nerdy, but making fun of people for writing fucked up stuff in English is nerdy. Gotcha.

Grammar Anti-NAZI:

Uhh, what's wrong with "descended down"?

let me guess, you are one of those guys that writes if(foo == true) and calls .ToString() on strings, right?

"This was the most unkindest cut of all."
- William Shakespeare

As my eye descended up this thread, I noticed there was quite a grammar war going on.

Yes, and the mome raths outgrabe.

Vic Tim:

Was anyone else waiting for there to be a gag about carefully entering an ultra-secure underground bunker with a box with a biohazard symbol on it? Cuz I'm a bit disappointed

I hadn't really considered it until you mentioned it, however, now that this piece of equipment that is marked as biohazard has entered a government facility, it will have to be disposed of properly. It is just a good thing that it wasn't marked with the radioactivity symbol, or it'd have to be shipped off as low level waste to be stored somewhere for a long time for no apparent reason.

TopCod3r:

I will never understand why companies want to make it hard to maintain their datacenter by locating it in some remote area. The best thing that has happened to hosting is broadband and DynDNS.

I remember when I first upgraded from using AOL to RoadRunner (back in 2000, before most of you or anyone else probably even knew what RoadRunner was). I started hosting the main web server at home, so when my boss needed me to do something during off-hours, I could respond more quickly.

At first I couldn't figure out how to keep the IP address from changing, and causing the name not to be resolved, but then I learned about DynDNS, and problem solved.

I never took the time to calculate how many 9s I had, but during the best year, I would guess at least five 9s. Let's just say there have been no complaints.

I've been wondering about TopCod3r. I don't know if he's an idiot, troll or both. Something like JeffK come to life, or someone imitating JeffK.

If he is the real deal, i wonder how many WTFs have been left in his wake.

This would have been funnier if he had been tossed into a holding cell.

Then again, we would never have heard about it.

I'm thinking of President Dave from Fallout 3...

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Republic_of_Dave

Not-Too-Deep Thinker:

Why do all server admins end up being entirely unstable(especially in government contracts)?

Do they just hire the guy who most resembles J.P. from "Grandma's Boy"?

I can imagine this guy in a black trench coat with neo-glasses. On second thought, if he was that 'hardcore' he might take security a little more seriously.

He does. The consumer grade boxes sitting on the floor with default passwords are the decoy network. That protects his actual servers from being attacked by hackers and lets his management think they actually know what's going on and have control.

The real servers respond only to SSH after a 5 step port knock sequence, authenticated by a 32 character Unicode passphrase that he memorized.

Semaj:

You're all a bunch of fucking nerds. If I ever meet one of you in a dark alley, I will stab you in the face with this gun.

No! No! When you stab someone with a gun, that's called hitting.

well on the line of servers... it reminds me of what i heard about metal gear online when it first came out. Supposedly they were running a 2008 game on servers from the 90's or 80's

Dont forget the Internet Tough Guy.

  
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