The Daily WTF: Curious Perversions in Information Technology

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

FWIW: There is a code requirement in the US for a switched "light" of some wort for every room. This can be either a switched outlet (usually only half of it) or an overhead light.

The room mentioned by the OP, is in a commercial building which falls under different guidelines. It is unusual to see any switched outlets in a commercial building.

Dan

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

ochrist:
I suggest they put up a note in the room with this text:
ACHTUNG! ALLES TURISTEN UND NONTEKNISCHEN LOOKENPEEPERS! DAS KOMPUTERMASCHINE IST NICHT FÜR DER GEFINGERPOKEN UND MITTENGRABEN! ODERWISE IST EASY TO SCHNAPPEN DER SPRINGENWERK, BLOWENFUSEN UND POPPENCORKEN MIT SPITZENSPARKSEN. IST NICHT FÜR GEWERKEN BEI DUMMKOPFEN. DER RUBBERNECKEN SIGHTSEEREN KEEPEN DAS COTTONPICKEN HÄNDER IN DAS POCKETS MUSS. ZO RELAXEN UND WATSCHEN DER BLINKENLICHTEN.

PS: What The Fr1st!

TRWTF is everyone who slapped that into Google Translate without trying to read it first. facepalm I'm an idiot.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

When I was in college, I spent a couple of years living in a flat in a converted old house. One day the kitchen light fell out of the ceiling (due to water damage from the floor above weakening the mounting). The landlady's "handyman" showed up to fix it. Looked up at the wires --

Chuck: "has the circuit been shut off?"

Me: "I don't think so." (breaker box for the entire building was in my roommate's bedroom, 15 feet away...)

Chuck: "Oh well, guess I'm gonna get bit." - Reaches up with screwdriver and pliers and trips the breaker from there.

We think Chuck liked 110v...

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

coincidentally... due to my unwillingness to do any rewiring or construction on a house I am renting... the cable modem that connects our telephone service is actually plugged directly into an auxillary power socket on a ceiling light... which of course is on a switch. When the kids get around to turning lights off... we can't receive phone calls until I notice and turn them back on. Were I not moving soon... that might get old quickly and I might get off my lazy arse and do something about it.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Some Jerk:
unsafe if you have your fire detection plugged into that spot.

In the US all fire detection has to be hard wired with battery backup.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Fred Flintstone:
Some Jerk:
unsafe if you have your fire detection plugged into that spot.

In the US all fire detection has to be hard wired with battery backup.

Geez... Assuming people generally come to this site to laugh... why everyone take things so damned seriously? Obviously I was joking... both about this and about the pacemaker!

Captcha: refoveo: Refoveo! Refoveo! Wherefore art though Refoveo!?

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

StMarc:
What, exactly, is the safety issue to which you refer? I can think of a few examples, but none of them really seem so terrifying as to call for a code requirement. More like a "don't be a cheap moron" requirement.

From EU experience... Circuits are wired using the minimum permitted conductor-core and insulation for the required current, and breakers/fuses to match.

Plugging a high-current device into a low-current circuit would either: (a) trip the breaker/blow the fuse (b) heat the wiring/cause a fire

Using more copper and insulation than necessary is expensive - and socket terminals are generally designed to take a maximum thickness of conductor. You can't physically fit a 100A cable in the terminals for a 1A light socket.

Coyne · 2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Sten:
TRWTF is the electrician who connected an outlet to the lights. AFAIK it is illegal in the EU for safety reasons

Can't speak to EU, but here in the U. S., switched outlets are actually common.

Someone commented switched outlets are rare in commercial buildings. But they can be used and can also happen by accident. A lot of commercial buildings use "plug-together" equipment (both lights and outlets) for ease of office reconfiguration (especially in cubicle farms). It's really easy with those systems to accidentally plug something into the wrong circuit.

Most commercial buildings don't do switched outlets simply because companies don't like to buy floor and table lamps; overhead fluorescent is cheaper and easier.

Mason Wheeler · 2012-08-06 Reply Admin

JC:
I here you loud and clear

weeps *

"Herwig grimaced, if only because a roving HR drone might here that and draw the wrong conclusion."

Good grief, the comedian's a bear!

No, Akismet, this is not spam.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

badman:
I used to work at a chemical treatment facility where I was paid to sit and read all night. [...] in the many years I had that job I only had to pick up "the red phone" and make the call to the government once. You know the one,

"... hello, is this the canal lock operator? Say if you happen to see about a dozen kilograms of TCDD come floating down the river, would you kindly scoop it up for us and hold it for collection? We seem to have misplaced it."

Nagesh · 2012-08-06 Reply Admin

This would be WTF in 1980. Consider the presence of Sudoku, it look like more recent timing. I call shengenz on this one.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Skeeve:
foo:
This, or something like: "Hmm, this socket is dead, I'll have to open it and check the wires. But let me just turn on the lights so I can see better ..."

Anyone who opens up a socket to handle the wires without turning the circuit off at the breaker is a moron who deserves to have their electrician's licence revoked, for the safety of everyone around them.

Seriously. Switched or not, you turn the power off before you screw around with the wiring, no matter what. Ignoring that is a pretty good way to end up hurt.

In addition, you should put a lockout on the breaker/switch, to prevent someone from turning it back on. In an electrical code class (2003), I recall the instructor telling a story of a guy that was wiring a subpanel in his barn. He turned off the main breaker. When his wife came home, she turned it back on. Zap dead. Not sure if the story it is true or who knows maybe she wanted to do him. Anyhow, his point stuck.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

C-Derb:
ochrist:
I suggest they put up a note in the room with this text:
ACHTUNG! ALLES TURISTEN UND NONTEKNISCHEN LOOKENPEEPERS! DAS KOMPUTERMASCHINE IST NICHT FÜR DER GEFINGERPOKEN UND MITTENGRABEN! ODERWISE IST EASY TO SCHNAPPEN DER SPRINGENWERK, BLOWENFUSEN UND POPPENCORKEN MIT SPITZENSPARKSEN. IST NICHT FÜR GEWERKEN BEI DUMMKOPFEN. DER RUBBERNECKEN SIGHTSEEREN KEEPEN DAS COTTONPICKEN HÄNDER IN DAS POCKETS MUSS. ZO RELAXEN UND WATSCHEN DER BLINKENLICHTEN.

PS: What The Fr1st!
TRWTF is everyone who slapped that into Google Translate without trying to read it first. facepalm I'm an idiot.

TRWTF is Google Translate for not recognizing this text and providing the appropriate link! :)

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Rootbeer:
It's a solved problem for servers, as any competently designed server room will already have everything critical getting its power through a UPS. In the case in this story, it's possible that the server room proper has a UPS, but the overflow in the Copy Center does not.
It's kind of a solved problem for desktops, too, as home UPS units capable of gently shutting down a home computer and its peripherals in the event of an outage can be bought for under $100.

What I don't understand is why more server rooms don't let the UPSes deliver DC voltage direct to the server motherboards at all times.

This. The usual UPS implementation is a hack, converting from AC to DC to AC, then the device's internal power supply converts back to DC. Some kind of standard DC delivery system would be a huge improvement. USB works fine for small devices, but nothing exists for bigger devices (at least for the home/small biz user).

I wish desktop computers at least supplied a few seconds of additional power, which could be done with a small capacitor. I have experienced way to many 1 second power glitches in my life.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Nagesh:
This would be WTF in 1980.

Hardly so. Coax didn't need switches.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Wouldnt that be the problem?

If I go to my fuse box and pull the fuse labled "kitchen Sockets" id expect that to cut the power to my kitchen sockets, I wouldnt expect the fuse labeled Kitchen lights to have any bearing on the wall sockets.

I would of course check that the power was out even after removing the fuse, but thats not the point, circuts are isolated for a reason.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Infinite Time and Space:
ochrist:
I suggest they put up a note in the room with this text:
ACHTUNG! ALLES TURISTEN UND NONTEKNISCHEN LOOKENPEEPERS! DAS KOMPUTERMASCHINE IST NICHT FÜR DER GEFINGERPOKEN UND MITTENGRABEN! ODERWISE IST EASY TO SCHNAPPEN DER SPRINGENWERK, BLOWENFUSEN UND POPPENCORKEN MIT SPITZENSPARKSEN. IST NICHT FÜR GEWERKEN BEI DUMMKOPFEN. DER RUBBERNECKEN SIGHTSEEREN KEEPEN DAS COTTONPICKEN HÄNDER IN DAS POCKETS MUSS. ZO RELAXEN UND WATSCHEN DER BLINKENLICHTEN.

PS: What The Fr1st!

Two years of college German and that is about as well as I can speak it.

This is everything but german. To me it reads more like a bastard of dutch and english.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Wonko:
Wouldnt that be the problem?
If I go to my fuse box and pull the fuse labled "kitchen Sockets" id expect that to cut the power to my kitchen sockets, I wouldnt expect the fuse labeled Kitchen lights to have any bearing on the wall sockets.

I would of course check that the power was out even after removing the fuse, but thats not the point, circuts are isolated for a reason.

The above was in response to : Anyone who opens up a socket to handle the wires without turning the circuit off at the breaker is a moron who deserves to have their electrician's licence revoked, for the safety of everyone around them.

Seriously. Switched or not, you turn the power off before you screw around with the wiring, no matter what. Ignoring that is a pretty good way to end up hurt.

TRWTF is the reply button.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Wonko:
Wouldnt that be the problem?
If I go to my fuse box and pull the fuse labled "kitchen Sockets" id expect that to cut the power to my kitchen sockets, I wouldnt expect the fuse labeled Kitchen lights to have any bearing on the wall sockets.

I would of course check that the power was out even after removing the fuse, but thats not the point, circuts are isolated for a reason.

Your fuses are labeled? Correctly even? Wow! Which alternate universe do you live in, and how can I transition over to it?

Zylon · 2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Been a while since we've had a Remy WTF so tortuously overwritten that it's almost impossible to follow what's actually happening.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Wiring a power socket to a lighting circuit is contrary to wiring regulations in the U.K.

For starters, safety is improved by segregating power and lighting. If the lights are off at the breaker, I know they're all off, and that power will be on. I can plug a work light into the power to avoid working in the dark.

Conversely, I can have the lights on whilst I work on the "known to be switched off" power circuits.

Also, this means that if a light bulb blows, and trips the breaker, it doesn't cut power to anything.

The wiring behind lighting circuits is usually either 5 or 15 amp rated, and will not carry the 30 amps that a power circuit can.

Power circuits have to be earthed, but light fitings do not. I usually connect earths wherever possible, in case someone decides to fit a metallic/conducting light fitting, and/or metallic (e.g. decorative brass) light switch.

The idea of a power applicance without an earth is usually not good, unless it's a double insulated applicance and specifically designed to work that way.

Finally, lighting circuits are usually connected to circuit breakers and not an RCD, whereas power circuits should always be connected to an RCD. Thus an errant finger in a power circuit can get a maximum current across the heart of 30 milliamps (or whatever the RCD trips at) which is not enough to kill.

Considerably more current than this may flow before a breaker operates on overcurrent. Residual current will not cause a standard breaker to operate, so the lighting circuit may take a painfully long time to trip.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Nagesh:
badman:
I used to work at a chemical treatment facility where I was paid to sit and read all night. [...] in the many years I had that job I only had to pick up "the red phone" and make the call to the government once. You know the one,
"... hello, is this the canal lock operator? Say if you happen to see about a dozen kilograms of TCDD come floating down the river, would you kindly scoop it up for us and hold it for collection? We seem to have misplaced it."

Why would you call a CANAL lock opertor if you suspect something to be floating down a RIVER

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Cat:
Wonko:
Wouldnt that be the problem?
If I go to my fuse box and pull the fuse labled "kitchen Sockets" id expect that to cut the power to my kitchen sockets, I wouldnt expect the fuse labeled Kitchen lights to have any bearing on the wall sockets.

I would of course check that the power was out even after removing the fuse, but thats not the point, circuts are isolated for a reason.
Your fuses are labeled? Correctly even? Wow! Which alternate universe do you live in, and how can I transition over to it?

Hold mains in one hand and ground in the other ...

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Steve:
Nagesh:
badman:
I used to work at a chemical treatment facility where I was paid to sit and read all night. [...] in the many years I had that job I only had to pick up "the red phone" and make the call to the government once. You know the one,
"... hello, is this the canal lock operator? Say if you happen to see about a dozen kilograms of TCDD come floating down the river, would you kindly scoop it up for us and hold it for collection? We seem to have misplaced it."

Why would you call a CANAL lock opertor if you suspect something to be floating down a RIVER

What's being difference of CANAL and RIVER?

Gurth · 2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Nagesh:
You know you've been reading TDWTF too long when you can read the first two paragraphs of an article, and the only suspense left is whether it was something plugged into the wrong socket, or somebody explicitly unplugging it in favor of a kettle/phone charger/vacuum cleaner.

You know you've been reading TDWTF too long when you notice "Nagesh" making a post without any obvious grammar and spelling errors.

Zylon · 2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Gurth:
You know you've been reading TDWTF too long when you notice "Nagesh" making a post without any obvious grammar and spelling errors.

You know "Nagesh" has been posting too long when he forgets to log out of his troll account.

Gurth · 2012-08-06 Reply Admin

C-Derb:
TRWTF is everyone who slapped that into Google Translate without trying to read it first. *facepalm* I'm an idiot.

A german:
This is everything but german. To me it reads more like a bastard of dutch and english.

So … never heard of blinkenlights then?

da Doctah · 2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Cat:
Wonko:
Wouldnt that be the problem?
If I go to my fuse box and pull the fuse labled "kitchen Sockets" id expect that to cut the power to my kitchen sockets, I wouldnt expect the fuse labeled Kitchen lights to have any bearing on the wall sockets.

I would of course check that the power was out even after removing the fuse, but thats not the point, circuts are isolated for a reason.
Your fuses are labeled? Correctly even? Wow! Which alternate universe do you live in, and how can I transition over to it?

I've got a bank of breakers instead of fuses, but that was the first thing I did when I moved into my place: run around from room to room with a hair-dryer and check which breakers controlled which outlets so I could label them.

It's a good thing I did too, because there's no consistent rule about what's on the same circuit. In one place, all the sockets in one room are grouped and the adjacent room is a different circuit. In another part of the house, all the sockets on both sides of a certain wall are in a bunch, as is the wall light fixture in the hall outside, while the other sockets in both rooms are on other circuits.

snoofle · 2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Skeeve:
foo:
This, or something like: "Hmm, this socket is dead, I'll have to open it and check the wires. But let me just turn on the lights so I can see better ..."

Anyone who opens up a socket to handle the wires without turning the circuit off at the breaker is a moron who deserves to have their electrician's licence revoked, for the safety of everyone around them.

Seriously. Switched or not, you turn the power off before you screw around with the wiring, no matter what. Ignoring that is a pretty good way to end up hurt.

Interestingly, every electrician I've ever had to my house to change this or that has never turned off the breaker; they work with the hot wires - no gloves or anything - because, in their words: I know what I'm doing!

When I queried, they explained that as long as you a) never touch both wires at the same time, and b) stand on something that is an insulator, you're safe.

Seems gutsy to me, but I'm not an electrician.

snoofle · 2012-08-06 Reply Admin

da Doctah:
Cat:
Wonko:
Wouldnt that be the problem?
If I go to my fuse box and pull the fuse labled "kitchen Sockets" id expect that to cut the power to my kitchen sockets, I wouldnt expect the fuse labeled Kitchen lights to have any bearing on the wall sockets.

I would of course check that the power was out even after removing the fuse, but thats not the point, circuts are isolated for a reason.
Your fuses are labeled? Correctly even? Wow! Which alternate universe do you live in, and how can I transition over to it?
I've got a bank of breakers instead of fuses, but that was the first thing I did when I moved into my place: run around from room to room with a hair-dryer and check which breakers controlled which outlets so I could label them.

It's a good thing I did too, because there's no consistent rule about what's on the same circuit. In one place, all the sockets in one room are grouped and the adjacent room is a different circuit. In another part of the house, all the sockets on both sides of a certain wall are in a bunch, as is the wall light fixture in the hall outside, while the other sockets in both rooms are on other circuits.

I think the reason they do that is so that if one breaker blows, a whole side of the house isn't in darkness; you'd still have power in some outlets/lights from other breakers.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

operagost:
Like when handling a firearm, always assume the circuit is live unless you've flipped the breaker and tested for current at the receptacle. Do they have untrained morons playing with electricity in the EU?

[image] So, I believe I've flipped the breaker. Could someone show me how to test for current at the receptacle now?

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

You are missing the point: the OC meant that by turning on the lights, the socket would no longer be dead.

D-Coder · 2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Zylon:
Gurth:
You know you've been reading TDWTF too long when you notice "Nagesh" making a post without any obvious grammar and spelling errors.
You know "Nagesh" has been posting too long when he forgets to log out of his troll account.

You know "Nagesh" has been posting too long when he posts.

Remy Porter · 2012-08-06 Reply Admin

It's okay, I always include an Easy Reader version in the comments, just for folks like you. People who have mastered the English language get to enjoy the whole article, and people who have issues with natural languages can read the source for the easy reader version. It's for accessibility!

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Remy Porter:
It's okay, I always include an Easy Reader version in the comments, just for folks like you. People who have mastered the English language get to enjoy the whole article, and people who have issues with natural languages can read the source for the easy reader version. It's for accessibility!

Damnum, thanks for the tip.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Mikerad:
Ben Jammin:
It's that he's concerned with HR about:
"That's what 'night-shift' means," Greta replied with a smirk. "You were here for the whole thing last night."

But not concerned about hr/police about:

With the lights off on his side, Greta couldn't see him, but he could watch her through the glass walls.

Everyone knows HR doesn't exist after 5pm...

Funny.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Franky:
actually, I have the same configuration for my TV ... which is awesome, I just walk into the room, carelessly flip the light-switch on doing so, and the tv springs to live ... everybody is "wtf? how did you do that" the first time they see it :D
and the best is, the thing doesn't draw any excess power when it is switched off (which is most of the day)

So you're one of those guys that if you're in a room, the TV's on?

ochrist · 2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Gurth:
So … never heard of blinkenlights then?

Bingo. That's where I got this specific version of the text from. It was the word 'blinkenlights' that triggered me to search for the text (so I guess Remy or the OP knew about it).

First time I read it was in a server room in the early eighties, but the original text is much older than that.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

I saw this happen in Nat'l Lampoon's Christmas Vacation. I think we should give "fr1st" to Chevy Chase.

Zylon · 2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Remy Porter:
People who have mastered the English language get to enjoy the whole article, and people who have issues with natural languages can read the source for the easy reader version.

So the "easy" version is written in Esperanto?

pjt33 · 2012-08-06 Reply Admin

operagost:
Like when handling a firearm, always assume the circuit is live unless you've flipped the breaker and tested for current at the receptacle. Do they have untrained morons playing with electricity in the EU?

Yes. I've moved into an office which previously had a UPS for some of the sockets. (One small UPS: about a dozen sockets). When the previous occupants moved out they took the UPS with them, replacing it with a piece of terminal block bridging the input and output cables. Said terminal block was wandering around loose inside an unearthed metal rack-mount box.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Fred Flintstone:
Skeeve:
foo:
This, or something like: "Hmm, this socket is dead, I'll have to open it and check the wires. But let me just turn on the lights so I can see better ..."
Anyone who opens up a socket to handle the wires without turning the circuit off at the breaker is a moron who deserves to have their electrician's licence revoked, for the safety of everyone around them.
Seriously. Switched or not, you turn the power off before you screw around with the wiring, no matter what. Ignoring that is a pretty good way to end up hurt.
In addition, you should put a lockout on the breaker/switch, to prevent someone from turning it back on. In an electrical code class (2003), I recall the instructor telling a story of a guy that was wiring a subpanel in his barn. He turned off the main breaker. When his wife came home, she turned it back on. Zap dead. Not sure if the story it is true or who knows maybe she wanted to do him. Anyhow, his point stuck.

True of any safety switches, but even then it's not a guarantee. Once while working at a printing plant (in my pre-IT days) I was working to clear a jam on a labeling machine. I had hit the emergency stop switch (which locks in place and won't allow the machine to be turned on again while it is down).

The packer at the end of the machine was chatting with her fellow workerer and, noticing the machine was off, tried to start it, never turning her head to look down the conveyor belt to see me with my arm on the belt reaching up into the labeling machine. STILL never turning her head from her conversation, she undoes the safety lock and presses the start button. I was so shocked to see her do this while I was working on the machine, it wasn't until the last second that I pulled my hand back as the belt started rolling.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Neveralull:
Franky:
actually, I have the same configuration for my TV ... which is awesome, I just walk into the room, carelessly flip the light-switch on doing so, and the tv springs to live ... everybody is "wtf? how did you do that" the first time they see it :D
and the best is, the thing doesn't draw any excess power when it is switched off (which is most of the day)
So you're one of those guys that if you're in a room, the TV's on?

Once my daughter walked into the living room to see me sitting there and the TV off. She asked, "Why isn't the TV on? Is it broken?"

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Cbuttius:
It's also a WTF that they are paying someone to be onsite until midnight just doing sukodu puzzles.
Incidentally if Greta wants to make some career progress she would better spend her time reading some technical books or browsing technical websites and then find herself an alternative job.

Greta's job is analagous to a security guard or alarm monitor. She's there to react if there is a problem. If nothing goes wrong, great, everybody's happy. An auditor who complains that you're wasting money paying this alarm monitor because nothing went wrong, well, that would be like saying that you wasted money buying life insurance because you didn't die this year.

From Greta's point of view, she might well think this is a dream job. She just sits around doing Sudoku puzzles or whatever else amuses her and gets paid for it. Maybe she doesn't want to "make career progress" to a job where she would actually have to work eight hours a day. Some people have the goal of fighting their way to the top. Others want a job where they can just coast along.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

I once bought a house and before long noticed that one of the outlets in a downstairs bedroom didn't work. I figured okay, dead outlet, I'll get around to it sooner or later. But I left a lamp plugged in the socket. A few days later the lamp was on. I tried flipping the wall switch but no, that didn't turn it off. I thought maybe there was a loose connection or something, messed with it, oculdn't find a problem. The next day the lamp was off again. It seemed to go on and off with no discernable pattern. I gave up on it while I worked on other repairs and upgrades.

One of those upgrades involved the ceiling lights in the basement. I discovered a wire connected to the ceiling light circuit that went up through the floor to this bedroom. Sure enough: turn on the basement lights, the outlet in the bedroom had power. Turn off the basement lights, the outlet had no power. Hmm.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

About 15 years ago, I helped develop a Pharmacy management package, which uploaded data nightly. One store would fail every night, but succeed when a retry was done in the morning. The only difference was that it was a modem rather than a switch, and that (thankfully) it was the Pharmacy owner, and not myself) who had to do the all nighter..

Thanks for the memories!

operagost · 2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Some Jerk:
Fred Flintstone:
Some Jerk:
unsafe if you have your fire detection plugged into that spot.

In the US all fire detection has to be hard wired with battery backup.

Geez... Assuming people generally come to this site to laugh... why everyone take things so damned seriously? Obviously I was joking... both about this and about the pacemaker!

Captcha: refoveo: Refoveo! Refoveo! Wherefore art though Refoveo!?

Sorry, but we couldn't find the punchline. Is it that when you start a fire with your shoddy wiring, the fire system will be off because you flipped the switch on the way out?

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Reminds me of something that happened to my dad. He had an outside light that wasn't working so He changed the bulb and all that good stuff, then decided he needed to take it apart to figure out what was up with it.

So he turns off the lights on the switch then tells my mom not to turn the lights back on (the fuse box was on the other side of the house and down a a couple flights of stairs)

So hes elbows deep in this fixture with a multimeter checking for bad connections then looks down for a moment, then looks back up to see that all the other lights are now on as he was reaching up to grab the wire, then shortly after my mom calls out "the light switch was off that's why it wasn't working dummy!"

operagost · 2012-08-06 Reply Admin

Tharg:
Wiring a power socket to a lighting circuit is contrary to wiring regulations in the U.K.
For starters, safety is improved by segregating power and lighting. If the lights are off at the breaker, I know they're all off, and that power will be on. I can plug a work light into the power to avoid working in the dark.

Conversely, I can have the lights on whilst I work on the "known to be switched off" power circuits.

This is convenience, not safety. We have work lights here in the USA.

Power circuits have to be earthed, but light fitings do not. I usually connect earths wherever possible, in case someone decides to fit a metallic/conducting light fitting, and/or metallic (e.g. decorative brass) light switch.

Lighting circuits must also be earthed in the USA. The cable must include a ground conductor, and this conductor must be attached to the enclosure of the luminaire. If the outlet box is metal, the ground must also be attached to it. Sounds like the UK wiring is pretty dangerous!

Finally, lighting circuits are usually connected to circuit breakers and not an RCD, whereas power circuits should always be connected to an RCD. Thus an errant finger in a power circuit can get a maximum current across the heart of 30 milliamps (or whatever the RCD trips at) which is not enough to kill.

This is backward logic. Any circuit that has receptacles on it must follow that standard whether or not it has switched receptacles. If the circuit is in a kitchen or bathroom (~1990 and later) or a bedroom (2005 and later) it must have GFCI (is this what an "RCD" is?). In fact, I think bathrooms might need AFCI but I haven't checked because I'm just a DIYer and I haven't rewired my bathroom yet. Dedicated ighting circuits don't need a GFCI because it's not expected that a person will be in contact with anything attached to the circuit except the non-conductive light switch toggle. If there's a receptacle in the circuit, it probably needs GFCI now.

2012-08-06 Reply Admin

With all the logs and stuff--why did he mot notice the TOD pattern?

The Long Goodbye

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