Just a Warm-Up

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  • fabs0 2012-07-10 10:40
    thats just awesome!
  • Dave 2012-07-10 10:42
    You know you'll get more heat from a CPU if your code actually does some FP math and such rather than just a while loop. Actually it would be simpler to just grab Prime95 and run it in torture test mode...
  • Axe 2012-07-10 10:49
    That actually made me Laugh Out Loud.....
  • XXXXX 2012-07-10 10:54
    In the future, mankind will develop ways to spin and weave wool from sheep into torso-shaped wrappings. These wrappings (I'll call them sweaters) will insulate jackasses. Others will build on this innovation with hand-shaped wrappings (call them gloves). At such a time, jackasses who whine about the thermostat can regulate their own bodies' temperatures.

    Until then, this seems like a reasonable substitute.
  • badman 2012-07-10 10:55
    Personally, and from personal experience, I would have just modified the thermostat to read whatever the boss wanted to see. However it would be set to "comfortable" and not changeable from the outside controls.
  • PiisAWheeL 2012-07-10 10:55
    XXXXX:
    In the future, mankind will develop ways to spin and weave wool from sheep into torso-shaped wrappings. These wrappings (I'll call them sweaters) will insulate jackasses. Others will build on this innovation with hand-shaped wrappings (call them gloves). At such a time, jackasses who whine about the thermostat can regulate their own bodies' temperatures.

    Until then, this seems like a reasonable substitute.
    You ever try to use gloves with a keyboard? (Gloves that are worth a shit anyways?)

    I have a bent piece of medal designed specifally for the box in our office.

    The stupid thing is, the manager would turn the air way down or the heat way up depending on the season, and then stand outside with the door open to smoke a cigarette. First electric bill and the owner put that box on there. I just need a couple of degrees so my adjustments go unnoticed.
  • pantsman 2012-07-10 11:00
    TRWTF is wasting all those CPU cycles on an empty loop instead of taking part in a distributed computing project like folding@home. Incidentally, making the CPU do real work instead of an empty while loop would produce significantly more heat.
  • trtrwtf 2012-07-10 11:01
    Couldn't they just burn requirements documents to keep warm?
  • Someone 2012-07-10 11:03
    My Suggestion: Use multiple threads, so that every core of a multi-core CPU is used. At best start as many threads as you have cpu cores.
  • pitchingchris 2012-07-10 11:03
    trtrwtf:
    Couldn't they just burn requirements documents to keep warm?


    Smoke inhalation ?
  • Anketam 2012-07-10 11:04
    I was so glad that my phone was on mute (dialed into a meeting) when I read this, because I nearly killed over laughing at this.

    As for the comment about wearing heavier clothes... Gloves + Keyboard does not work. Put on some well insulated gloves and try to post a response on this thread.
  • Nagesh 2012-07-10 11:05
    Funny article. Remy should work some place to write funny comedy stories.
  • wraith 2012-07-10 11:08
    Too bad there isn't a program for the oposite. These days it's kinda hard sympathizing for somebody for being cold
  • Chelloveck 2012-07-10 11:10
    Anketam:
    As for the comment about wearing heavier clothes... Gloves + Keyboard does not work. Put on some well insulated gloves and try to post a response on this thread.


    That would explain a good many of the usual comments.
  • Pero Perić 2012-07-10 11:10
    55 °F is ~13 °C

    Not really cold...

    captcha: nulla - uncaught NullReferenceException
    TheDailyWTF.Comments.AddComment(int articleId) +47
    System.Web.UI.WebControls.Button.OnClick(EventArgs e) +108
    System.Web.UI.WebControls.Button.System.Web.UI.IPostBackEventHandler.RaisePostBackEvent(String eventArgument) +57
    System.Web.UI.Page.RaisePostBackEvent(IPostBackEventHandler sourceControl, String eventArgument) +18
    System.Web.UI.Page.RaisePostBackEvent(NameValueCollection postData) +33
    System.Web.UI.Page.ProcessRequestMain() +1292
  • Mijzelf 2012-07-10 11:11
    wraith:
    Too bad there isn't a program for the oposite. These days it's kinda hard sympathizing for somebody for being cold

    while( false ){}
  • sprezzatura 2012-07-10 11:12
    I don't see how this would increase the temperature. Isn't the OS is in a perpetual loop anyway waiting for interrupts? Just because it doesn't show up in the Task Manager Performance graph (or whatever OS you use), doesn't mean it isn't looping.

    Another solution would be to wire up the heat to another (hidden) thermostat, and let the 'main' one become a decoy.
  • Matt 2012-07-10 11:13
    I had a similar problem - my solution was to create a lapwarmer by recompiling GCC on my Dell Inspiron.
  • RandomUser423717 2012-07-10 11:14
    pantsman:
    TRWTF is wasting all those CPU cycles on an empty loop instead of taking part in a distributed computing project like folding@home. Incidentally, making the CPU do real work instead of an empty while loop would produce significantly more heat.
    Remember the article said this was in a government office. Running anything that did anything even vaguely like complex calculation could be an... issue.
  • PZ 2012-07-10 11:18
    Mijzelf:
    wraith:
    Too bad there isn't a program for the oposite. These days it's kinda hard sympathizing for somebody for being cold

    while( false ){}


    +1
  • Andrew 2012-07-10 11:20
    pantsman:
    TRWTF is wasting all those CPU cycles on an empty loop instead of taking part in a distributed computing project like folding@home. Incidentally, making the CPU do real work instead of an empty while loop would produce significantly more heat.
    This. And also use one of the newer GPU clients if you can. You know you've gone over the cliff when, in the winter, you start folding/turn on 3DMark instead of the furnace.
  • Hello 2012-07-10 11:21
    Brain for the win!! :)
  • Chip 2012-07-10 11:21
    A far simpler solution would have been to tape icepacks to the thermostats.
  • trtrwtf 2012-07-10 11:24
    Chip:
    A far simpler solution would have been to tape icepacks to the thermostats.


    Yeah, but where are you going to find ice in Alaska?

    Better to kill a grizzly bear and crawl into its still-warm carcass.
  • David Emery 2012-07-10 11:26
    Good thing you weren't using a highly optimizing compiler that optimized that loop away :-)
  • Severity One 2012-07-10 11:26
    We're in somewhat the opposite situation: in winter, the office is kept comfortably warm by all the electronics. In summer, though, we need the airco big time.

    A quick glance at the Windows weather gadget shows that it's 37 C (98.6 F) outside, and tomorrow it will go up to 38 C (100.4 F). That's body temperature today, and just a bit more tomorrow.

    Cost is a concern, and the airco eats a lot of electricity, but if it were to be turned up a bit, in order to save money, there would be complaints, and possibly riots.
  • pinko 2012-07-10 11:28
    In my country the law says that if the workplace for light / office work is cooler than 18C (~64F), the employees are allowed to stop working (and it's still paid time) ater notifying their superior. Notifying the appropriate government agency is also recommended.
  • Glenn Lasher 2012-07-10 11:36
    You should be sure to run one instance per core, by the way, to maximize the output.

    BTW, I personally like the Common LISP implementation of this, because it is so compact:

    (loop)


    There's probably an assembly language version that is even more compact, but I'll leave that to someone else to develop.
  • David 2012-07-10 11:38
    Shouldn't this have been written in ADA?
  • CRT Styled Heat 2012-07-10 11:41
    Ohhh ohh I know another way. Request a bunch of OLD CRT style monitors. You know, because they're older and obviously cheaper and literal OVENS when used in a concert.
  • snoofle 2012-07-10 11:43
    Glenn Lasher:
    You should be sure to run one instance per core, by the way, to maximize the output.

    BTW, I personally like the Common LISP implementation of this, because it is so compact:

    (loop)


    There's probably an assembly language version that is even more compact, but I'll leave that to someone else to develop.
    JMP $
  • SomeAssemblyRequired 2012-07-10 11:44
    Glenn Lasher:
    BTW, I personally like the Common LISP implementation of this, because it is so compact:

    (loop)

    There's probably an assembly language version that is even more compact, but I'll leave that to someone else to develop.

    a:jmp a

    That's about as short as I can get it.

    And yes, I turn off my Prime95 calculations when it gets too hot in here. In winter, makes a fine heater.

    SAR
  • Paolo 2012-07-10 11:48
    And what exactly is wrong with a personal heater? Conceal one in a desktop case.
  • Rootbeer 2012-07-10 11:54

    As an American taxpayer, I'd like to say "Thanks, asshole, for finding a way to use a $1000 computer as a $20 space heater instead of just buying a fucking $20 space heater."

  • Nagesh 2012-07-10 11:55
    pinko:
    In my country the law says that if the workplace for light / office work is cooler than 18C (~64F), the employees are allowed to stop working (and it's still paid time) ater notifying their superior. Notifying the appropriate government agency is also recommended.


    Look like trolling, but I will respond.

    In my country, they don't care how hot or cold it gets.
  • Nagesh 2012-07-10 11:55
    Rootbeer:

    As an American taxpayer, I'd like to say "Thanks, asshole, for finding a way to use a $1000 computer as a $20 space heater instead of just buying a fucking $20 space heater."



    Who is selling this mad in China stuff?
  • Robert Hanson 2012-07-10 11:58
    I was really hoping to see code that connected to the building management system and adjusted the thermostat from the guy's workstation. Bonus points for a "boss key" that reset the visual display of the thermostat to 55
  • tegh 2012-07-10 11:59
    [quote user="sprezzatura"]I don't see how this would increase the temperature. Isn't the OS is in a perpetual loop anyway waiting for interrupts? Just because it doesn't show up in the Task Manager Performance graph (or whatever OS you use), doesn't mean it isn't looping.

    Hey kiddo, you're slacking. Don't you have a large Java project to be working on?
  • English Man 2012-07-10 12:05
    Anketam:
    I was so glad that my phone was on mute (dialed into a meeting) when I read this, because I nearly killed over laughing at this.

    As for the comment about wearing heavier clothes... Gloves + Keyboard does not work. Put on some well insulated gloves and try to post a response on this thread.
    Fingerless gloves provide SOME protection, 55 isn't that cold.
  • C-Derb 2012-07-10 12:07
    Rootbeer:

    As an American taxpayer, I'd like to say "Thanks, asshole, for finding a way to use a $1000 computer as a $20 space heater instead of just buying a fucking $20 space heater."

    Welcome to the world of government employment. Having worked in said environment, I can say with 99% certainty that space heaters were likely prohibited for "safety" reasons as well as the aforementioned utility bill reasons.

    Shout out to Despair.com, whose demotivational "Government" poster says it all:

    Government: If you think the problems we create are bad, wait until you see our solutions.
  • cellocgw 2012-07-10 12:10
    wraith:
    Too bad there isn't a program for the oposite. These days it's kinda hard sympathizing for somebody for being cold


    Easy: just run the program in ReverseMode.
  • PiisAWheeL 2012-07-10 12:11
    sprezzatura:
    I don't see how this would increase the temperature. Isn't the OS is in a perpetual loop anyway waiting for interrupts? Just because it doesn't show up in the Task Manager Performance graph (or whatever OS you use), doesn't mean it isn't looping.

    Another solution would be to wire up the heat to another (hidden) thermostat, and let the 'main' one become a decoy.
    nops just don't generate much heat.
  • D-Coder 2012-07-10 12:13
    Rootbeer:

    As an American taxpayer, I'd like to say "Thanks, asshole, for finding a way to use a $1000 computer as a $20 space heater instead of just buying a fucking $20 space heater."

    Why? They already have the $1000 computer, it's not an extra expense. The electricity will cost the same either way (to a first approximation).
  • Bill 2012-07-10 12:16
    This reminds of a job a few years ago and for some reason I started getting hot flashes. First I was only 35 and second, I'm a guy, so it wasn't hormonal.

    I finally realized it was my cube mate on the other side of the partition rendering video on his quad core mac pro with super mega video card (the kind with it's own high powered cooling fans). Every time he would render video I would get blasted with heat from his computer from under the desk.
  • Bill 2012-07-10 12:19
    Rootbeer:

    As an American taxpayer, I'd like to say "Thanks, asshole, for finding a way to use a $1000 computer as a $20 space heater instead of just buying a fucking $20 space heater."



    Seriously this is how beuracracy works. Some asshole who doesn't have to deal with the consequences makes some 'decision' that affects numerous people adversely all to save a few pennies. In the end the troops on the ground come up with their own solutions sometimes better sometimes not.

    Besides I am 100% sure space heaters were not allowed in the office either.
  • spiffytech 2012-07-10 12:20
    Very nice! We took a similar approach in our office last Winter with some old servers that were just sitting around. Very effective!
  • Calli Arcale 2012-07-10 12:21
    English Man:
    Anketam:
    I was so glad that my phone was on mute (dialed into a meeting) when I read this, because I nearly killed over laughing at this.

    As for the comment about wearing heavier clothes... Gloves + Keyboard does not work. Put on some well insulated gloves and try to post a response on this thread.
    Fingerless gloves provide SOME protection, 55 isn't that cold.


    I have Renaud's, so my fingers will go numb with very little provocation. (65 F is enough to make 'em blanch. Seriously.) I have USB heated fingerless gloves and they have made a big difference.
  • pel 2012-07-10 12:32
    sprezzatura:
    I don't see how this would increase the temperature. Isn't the OS is in a perpetual loop anyway waiting for interrupts?

    Absolutely not (and if it is, it's a crappy OS). If the cpu isn't doing anything, it goes into a low-power halt state until an interrupt wakes it up. Busy waiting is pretty much the complete opposite of using interrupts.
  • myName 2012-07-10 12:34
    Isn't it great to live in a country where workers don't have rights. USA! USA! USA!
  • PiisAWheeL 2012-07-10 12:34
    Rootbeer:

    As an American taxpayer, I'd like to say "Thanks, asshole, for finding a way to use a $1000 computer as a $20 space heater instead of just buying a fucking $20 space heater."

    Actually, I'd like to thank this individual for saving the tax payer $20.00 by creating a dual use for the $1000 computer, and thereby removing the need to buy a $20 space heater. If the computer is being used for government purposes, it will generate the heat, if its idle, it will generate the heat. So yes, thank you for saving the taxpayers money.

    Now if we can just figure out a way to cut down on the electric usage, then we might have the most efficient division of government yet.
  • Katie Cunningham 2012-07-10 12:35
    At my old office, when my hands got cold, I'd load up Photoshop and start doing batch edits on my photos directory. Worked like a charm.
  • Katie Cunningham 2012-07-10 12:36
    I actually made fingerless gloves when things got super-bad, but they do impact your typing speed. That gets annoying after a few days.
  • AGray 2012-07-10 12:37
    Rootbeer:

    As an American taxpayer, I'd like to say "Thanks, asshole, for finding a way to use a $1000 computer as a $20 space heater instead of just buying a fucking $20 space heater."



    This. Also, Brain instead of Brian? :(

    CAPTCHA: conventio - Italian for convention.
  • JoeCool 2012-07-10 12:38
    Anketam:
    Gloves + Keyboard does not work. Put on some well insulated gloves and try to post a response on this thread.


    iuo dfonm;'tr saere trhe porobnlenm
  • Jack 2012-07-10 12:38
    Where I work, building managers seem to be obsessed with air conditioning. As in, the room temperature is down to 66 but the chiller is still blasting a high speed breeze of cold air on everyone. They generously put a vent right over each desk so you can't avoid it. I tried taping cardboard over mine; safety officer made me take it down. I wear a heavy jacket, ski mask, and gloves -- in the summer. Not exaggerating. Sometimes I even have to step outside for 10 minutes or so to warm up. You can imagine how that helps productivity.

    Years of complaints to everyone imaginable have had absolutely no effect. Not even when the governor of the state put up a "suggestion box" web site to help cut costs.

    Yeah, that's right, it is a tax funded facility. And we all know taxpayers are a sustainable resource made out of unlimited money so why not waste it as fast as possible?

    I can sorta understand a place that is too cold because they want to save money, but too cold and wasting money? WTF?
  • Katie Cunningham 2012-07-10 12:39
    Seconded.

    We got yelled at for running folding@home, even after we proved that it wasn't a virus, and wasn't causing anyone any harm. I couldn't even get them to agree to SETI@home, and our agency works with them!
  • PedanticCurmudgeon 2012-07-10 12:39
    pinko:
    In my country the law says that if the workplace for light / office work is cooler than 18C (~64F), the employees are allowed to stop working (and it's still paid time) ater notifying their superior. Notifying the appropriate government agency is also recommended.
    That wouldn't work in this case, as the U.S. government routinely exempts itself from laws it passes.
  • Jack 2012-07-10 12:41
    Oh, and I forgot to mention, space heaters (in the summer, mind you) are of course banned, so a bunch of us bought these lovely air purifiers which just happen to put out a substantial amount of heat... which only makes the AC work harder but F 'em if they won't listen.
  • Goplat 2012-07-10 12:43
    sprezzatura:
    I don't see how this would increase the temperature. Isn't the OS is in a perpetual loop anyway waiting for interrupts? Just because it doesn't show up in the Task Manager Performance graph (or whatever OS you use), doesn't mean it isn't looping.


    x86, as well as pretty much every other CPU architecture, has a "halt" instruction that will stop execution until the next interrupt. An OS should use it whenever all threads are idle.
  • anon 2012-07-10 12:44
    Prime95 can load all cores to 100% and verify hardware integrity. Why reinvent the heater um I mean wheel....
  • FishBasketGordo 2012-07-10 12:51
    Core body temperature isn't the issue. Try typing with gloves on.
  • Yazeran 2012-07-10 12:53
    sprezzatura:
    I don't see how this would increase the temperature. Isn't the OS is in a perpetual loop anyway waiting for interrupts? Just because it doesn't show up in the Task Manager Performance graph (or whatever OS you use), doesn't mean it isn't looping.


    Nope..

    I once had a PSU vent the 'magic smoke' due to a compile of a new Perl version for a software upgrade. The server had worked fine until then, but load had been small enough that the PSU was not taxed, the compile of the Perl executable on the other hand...

    So yes, specifically giving the CPU something to do does indeed increase the power consumtption of the system => Heat...

    Yours Yazeran.

    Plan: To go to Mars one day with a hammer
  • Kasper 2012-07-10 12:54
    TRWTF is measuring temperature in non-standard units.
  • Harrow 2012-07-10 12:58
    pinko:
    In my country the law says that if the workplace for light / office work is cooler than 18C (~64F), the employees are allowed to stop working (and it's still paid time) ater notifying their superior. Notifying the appropriate government agency is also recommended.

    Unfortunately the "appropriate government agency" is where Brian works.

    -Harrow.
  • Yazeran 2012-07-10 12:59
    Katie Cunningham:
    Seconded.

    We got yelled at for running folding@home, even after we proved that it wasn't a virus, and wasn't causing anyone any harm. I couldn't even get them to agree to SETI@home, and our agency works with them!


    He.

    Reminds me of the time when I found that one of our core servers had 4 CPU's sitting arround doing almost nothing and started running SETI@home on all of them. I specifically ran all the instances at nice -19 so that any real work would get priority, however after a few months, the sysadmins stopped me saying that it did not look good on their survaliance systems having that server show up with 100% CPU load....
    Did give me a good ranking for a while though...

    Yazeran

    Plan: To go to Mars one day with a hammer
  • PiisAWheeL 2012-07-10 12:59
    Yazeran:
    sprezzatura:
    I don't see how this would increase the temperature. Isn't the OS is in a perpetual loop anyway waiting for interrupts? Just because it doesn't show up in the Task Manager Performance graph (or whatever OS you use), doesn't mean it isn't looping.


    Nope..

    I once had a PSU vent the 'magic smoke' due to a compile of a new Perl version for a software upgrade. The server had worked fine until then, but load had been small enough that the PSU was not taxed, the compile of the Perl executable on the other hand...

    So yes, specifically giving the CPU something to do does indeed increase the power consumtption of the system => Heat...

    Yours Yazeran.

    Plan: To go to Mars one day with a hammer
    Ya, you can't put that magic smoke back in once you let it out. But on a positive note, you learned that it had a weak psu before it was doing something important.
  • PRMan 2012-07-10 13:03
    sprezzatura:
    I don't see how this would increase the temperature. Isn't the OS is in a perpetual loop anyway waiting for interrupts? Just because it doesn't show up in the Task Manager Performance graph (or whatever OS you use), doesn't mean it isn't looping.

    Another solution would be to wire up the heat to another (hidden) thermostat, and let the 'main' one become a decoy.


    Most CPUs now reduce the voltage when not "doing something". This keeps them "doing something" and keeps the voltage at full the whole time they are running. They should have been reading and writing a file the whole time, too. Keep those hard drives spinning...
  • PiisAWheeL 2012-07-10 13:08
    PRMan:
    sprezzatura:
    I don't see how this would increase the temperature. Isn't the OS is in a perpetual loop anyway waiting for interrupts? Just because it doesn't show up in the Task Manager Performance graph (or whatever OS you use), doesn't mean it isn't looping.

    Another solution would be to wire up the heat to another (hidden) thermostat, and let the 'main' one become a decoy.


    Most CPUs now reduce the voltage when not "doing something". This keeps them "doing something" and keeps the voltage at full the whole time they are running. They should have been reading and writing a file the whole time, too. Keep those hard drives spinning...
    You are a genius... Constant Background Defragging would generate the most heat, from the cpu, the hard drives, and the psu. If it was running windows, you would also generate extra heat from the ram.

    Hard drive gets organized as part of the "heating" system. Its genius.

    +1
  • lanmind 2012-07-10 13:09
    trtrwtf:
    Chip:
    A far simpler solution would have been to tape icepacks to the thermostats.


    Yeah, but where are you going to find ice in Alaska?

    Better to kill a grizzly bear and crawl into its still-warm carcass.


    And I thought they smelled bad on the outside...
  • satoshi 2012-07-10 13:13
    Ah, i love to remember the days before bitcoin mining..
  • PRMan 2012-07-10 13:15
    I used to work in a room where the fat CFO would come down the hall and crank the AC because his office was colder than ours. He would always shove it as far as it would go, because, like most people, he didn't understand how AC works.

    Also, in the winter he would try to save money by not running the heat. But then everyone had space heaters under their desks making it 10X more expensive to get the same amount of heat.

    I solved the problem with a single piece of paper. I just folded it 7 times over and then opened the ancient Honeywell thermostat and shoved the wad in there to the left of the slider. At that point, it couldn't move farther left than 72°F. That worked great for almost a year until he finally opened it. Once he opened it, he looked at us accusingly, but I told him that he was the one that told maintenance to be sure nobody could set it lower than 72°F (which was true).

    Finally one day, I told him to set the heat at 72° in the offices and see what happened. The next month, the electric bill was down 20%.
  • North Bus 2012-07-10 13:18
    Anketam:
    As for the comment about wearing heavier clothes... Gloves + Keyboard does not work. Put on some well insulated gloves and try to post a response on this thread.
    oikayt, niow what6?
  • Zylon 2012-07-10 13:19
    lanmind:
    And I thought they smelled bad on the outside...



    (not fucking spam, akismet)
  • @Deprecated 2012-07-10 13:25
    Chip:
    A far simpler solution would have been to tape icepacks to the thermostats.

    I used to work in a HW/SW lab, which also has a locked box over the thermostat.

    One day the lab was too cold for one guy. So, he took a can of cold spray and shot the thermostat. The cold spray is normally used to test for temperature sensitivity in rugged PCBs, and other things.

    The thermostat froze right up, and so lab became very hot, and stayed that way for a looooong time.
    Not sure why we didn't ram a soldering iron in there...

    Now that I think of it, maybe that could be the plot of ... ummm... a certain kind of movie.
  • lanmind 2012-07-10 13:29
    Zylon:
    lanmind:
    And I thought they smelled bad on the outside...



    (not fucking spam, akismet)


    +1
  • Spewin Coffee 2012-07-10 13:36
    I do this with a command-line PHP script. Interestingly it is named 'heater.php'.

    <?php while (1) {} ?>

    Useful during winter, spring, AND summer. The building's heating system is the heat from two very expensive pieces of equipment. And that doesn't work very well. The A/C works too well and is constantly on during the summer since the thermostats are basically broken. So, the company can afford the big expensive hardware but can't afford a $10 thermostat. Thus the programmers resort to writing programs that control the heat by wasting tons of electricity.
  • operagost 2012-07-10 13:38
    myName:
    Isn't it great to live in a country where workers don't have rights. USA! USA! USA!
    What country are you talking about? It's confusing that they use the same abbreviation as the United States of America. Oh wait, you're trolling. Never mind, no one could be that stupid.
  • The Bytemaster 2012-07-10 13:39
    Rootbeer:

    As an American taxpayer, I'd like to say "Thanks, asshole, for finding a way to use a $1000 computer as a $20 space heater instead of just buying a fucking $20 space heater."


    First, this is the government. They are likely not allowed to bring in their own equipment, so the must requisition them through the normal channels.

    Since that must go through GSA (the internal monopoply supplying agency that was to "save money", but wastes it left and right), the $20 heater costs $110.

    Then you have the 5 people that must approve and process the orders, the paperwork costs, etc. etc. etc.

    I think he ends up saving money in the long run.
  • Edward Royce 2012-07-10 13:58
    XXXXX:
    In the future, mankind will develop ways to spin and weave wool from sheep into torso-shaped wrappings. These wrappings (I'll call them sweaters) will insulate jackasses. Others will build on this innovation with hand-shaped wrappings (call them gloves). At such a time, jackasses who whine about the thermostat can regulate their own bodies' temperatures.

    Until then, this seems like a reasonable substitute.


    Do you cut the fingers off the gloves there Bob Cratchit?
  • M 2012-07-10 14:00
    Pero Perić:
    55 °F is ~13 °C

    Not really cold...


    I imagine it is only 55 at the thermostat. Thermostats often seem to be (conveniently?) located near a large vent, which means pretty much everywhere else is guaranteed to be colder.
  • JamesH 2012-07-10 14:09
    That would require them to have requirement documents.
  • ¯\(°_o)/¯ I DUNNO LOL 2012-07-10 14:10
    Kasper:
    TRWTF is measuring temperature in non-standard units.

    Absolutely, we should only use the Kelvin scale.
  • ¯\(°_o)/¯ I DUNNO LOL 2012-07-10 14:14
    @Deprecated:
    Now that I think of it, maybe that could be the plot of ... ummm... a certain kind of movie.

    Number Fifty-Five IS ALIVE!
  • Zost 2012-07-10 14:18
    Saeer,m I cvaN CXOMM,ENT JUSAT FINME WIOTHJ GLOVCEWS ON.
  • C-Derb 2012-07-10 14:21
    I used to work in a small office building with the world's least efficient glass windows lining the entire outer wall of the office space, most of which faced south. Even though we had blinds on all the windows, any sunny day in the (Utah) winter time, the low sun would just absolutely bake our offices, with the thermostat reading between 84°-89° F.

    It took a couple of calls to the building manager and the power company to finally figure out why the AC was not working. Turns out, there was a regulator on the AC unit outside that prevented the AC from turning on if the outside temperature was lower than 50°F.

    Totally makes sense, I guess. Except for the inefficient windows that could not be opened. So, we had the regulator removed and ran the AC many days when it was sunny but below freezing outside.
  • Mcoder 2012-07-10 14:24
    badman:
    Personally, and from personal experience, I would have just modified the thermostat to read whatever the boss wanted to see. However it would be set to "comfortable" and not changeable from the outside controls.


    At this point, I'd be tempted to become BOFH and modifying the bureocrats' heaters.
  • Kasper 2012-07-10 14:27
    ¯\(°_o)/¯ I DUNNO LOL:
    Kasper:
    TRWTF is measuring temperature in non-standard units.

    Absolutely, we should only use the Kelvin scale.
    Yes. If the article had said 55K I would almost instinctively know that was pretty darn cold. If it said 55°C I could convert that to 328K in my head and realize that would be too hot for me to want to stay in that room for a long time. But when it says 55°F I start thinking, what is the formula again, and is that closer to 55°C or to 55K then thinking it is closer to 55°C, which is not so bad but maybe a tad hot, or is it?
  • Sannois 2012-07-10 14:47
    CXhALLWEN GE A<XCCEPTED!
    RTwo pairs of gloves <ads i CAN STRILÖL MA<KE MYSAELFD UNDERSTOODS CVIOA KEYBV OAD.
    Fuirthwermore itr myt firm bweliqef thaqt wreiting VB cxode ias vcadstlyt im peroved usionfg rthgis merthods.

    SAolvcingf casptchaqs arwe n ort, ghowever.
  • trtrwtf 2012-07-10 14:47
    Kasper:
    ¯\(°_o)/¯ I DUNNO LOL:
    Kasper:
    TRWTF is measuring temperature in non-standard units.

    Absolutely, we should only use the Kelvin scale.
    Yes. If the article had said 55K I would almost instinctively know that was pretty darn cold. If it said 55°C I could convert that to 328K in my head and realize that would be too hot for me to want to stay in that room for a long time. But when it says 55°F I start thinking, what is the formula again, and is that closer to 55°C or to 55K then thinking it is closer to 55°C, which is not so bad but maybe a tad hot, or is it?


    TRTRWTF is people who can't convert liquid-water temperatures from one of the two commonly-used scales to the other. Come on, you don't need that much precision here. don't worry about 9/5, just use 2.
  • csdx 2012-07-10 14:56
    So that's how you type with boxing gloves on.
  • Orv 2012-07-10 14:57
    I did something very much like that when the heating system in our office building broke in mid-winter, and it took three days to fix it.
  • Nagesh 2012-07-10 15:01
    trtrwtf:
    Kasper:
    ¯\(°_o)/¯ I DUNNO LOL:
    Kasper:
    TRWTF is measuring temperature in non-standard units.

    Absolutely, we should only use the Kelvin scale.
    Yes. If the article had said 55K I would almost instinctively know that was pretty darn cold. If it said 55°C I could convert that to 328K in my head and realize that would be too hot for me to want to stay in that room for a long time. But when it says 55°F I start thinking, what is the formula again, and is that closer to 55°C or to 55K then thinking it is closer to 55°C, which is not so bad but maybe a tad hot, or is it?


    TRTRWTF is people who can't convert liquid-water temperatures from one of the two commonly-used scales to the other. Come on, you don't need that much precision here. don't worry about 9/5, just use 2.


    We ain't being ignorent of liniar interpolation as being taught in university:

    [0, 100] -> [32, 212]

    Also easy remembering Fahrenheit is human body closing to 100F and frieze of water is 2^5. ([0, 37] -> [32, 100])
  • s73v3r 2012-07-10 15:31
    XXXXX:
    In the future, mankind will develop ways to spin and weave wool from sheep into torso-shaped wrappings. These wrappings (I'll call them sweaters) will insulate jackasses. Others will build on this innovation with hand-shaped wrappings (call them gloves). At such a time, jackasses who whine about the thermostat can regulate their own bodies' temperatures.

    Until then, this seems like a reasonable substitute.


    Seriously? Go fuck yourself. I shouldn't have to bundle up like I'm going to Alaska just to feel relatively comfortable at my INDOOR job.
  • s73v3r 2012-07-10 15:33
    Someone:
    My Suggestion: Use multiple threads, so that every core of a multi-core CPU is used. At best start as many threads as you have cpu cores.


    I'm guessing that a place that doesn't see the value in not having it's developers freeze to death wouldn't see the value in multiple core CPUs
  • s73v3r 2012-07-10 15:36
    Rootbeer:

    As an American taxpayer, I'd like to say "Thanks, asshole, for finding a way to use a $1000 computer as a $20 space heater instead of just buying a fucking $20 space heater."



    As an American taxpayer, shouldn't you be bitching more that people are complaining about government costs so much that someone thinks its a good idea to not provide heat to an office in Alaska?
  • s73v3r 2012-07-10 15:43
    operagost:
    myName:
    Isn't it great to live in a country where workers don't have rights. USA! USA! USA!
    What country are you talking about? It's confusing that they use the same abbreviation as the United States of America. Oh wait, you're trolling. Never mind, no one could be that stupid.


    Compared to any other country in the first world, no he's not. Sure, you could say we have more rights than Nagesh's country, but is that really what we want to judge ourselves by? That we're slightly better than a shithole 3rd world country?
  • Nagesh 2012-07-10 16:15
    s73v3r:
    operagost:
    myName:
    Isn't it great to live in a country where workers don't have rights. USA! USA! USA!
    What country are you talking about? It's confusing that they use the same abbreviation as the United States of America. Oh wait, you're trolling. Never mind, no one could be that stupid.


    Compared to any other country in the first world, no he's not. Sure, you could say we have more rights than Nagesh's country, but is that really what we want to judge ourselves by? That we're slightly better than a shithole 3rd world country?


    In my country, ain't person except for untouchable that have labour rights.
  • Mike 2012-07-10 16:25
    I worked for a few years in a "temporary" office trailer outside a manufacturing plant somewhere north of Los Angeles... and farther north than whatever you thought after that. Anyhow, one bright frigid winter day I had my office blinds open to enjoy the solar heating on my back. Left them open, went home for the night. The next morning it was about 20° (F) out, I came in late due to icy roads. My colleagues were already in by the time I got to work, and boy were they pissed.

    Turns out the rising sun shone right down my south-facing window to the thermostat situated on the opposite corner of the room, which of course meant it was time to cool things off. Imagine arriving at 7am on a freezing cold morning to find the air conditioning going at full blast. No wonder they were pissed.

    Captcha: saluto (a little tiny salute)
  • Yazeran 2012-07-10 16:28
    PiisAWheeL:
    Yazeran:
    sprezzatura:
    I don't see how this would increase the temperature. Isn't the OS is in a perpetual loop anyway waiting for interrupts? Just because it doesn't show up in the Task Manager Performance graph (or whatever OS you use), doesn't mean it isn't looping.


    Nope..

    I once had a PSU vent the 'magic smoke' due to a compile of a new Perl version for a software upgrade. The server had worked fine until then, but load had been small enough that the PSU was not taxed, the compile of the Perl executable on the other hand...

    So yes, specifically giving the CPU something to do does indeed increase the power consumtption of the system => Heat...

    Yours Yazeran.

    Plan: To go to Mars one day with a hammer
    Ya, you can't put that magic smoke back in once you let it out. But on a positive note, you learned that it had a weak psu before it was doing something important.


    Yep, and more importantly I was there to pull the plug before the darn thing caught fire..... (not something you want at all in a lab with a supply system for compressed H2, CO, CH4 and O2 , we do have gas detectors, but still.....)

    Yazeran

    Plan: To go to Mars one day with a hammer
  • Slicerwizard 2012-07-10 16:33
    PiisAWheeL:
    You are a genius... Constant Background Defragging would generate the most heat, from the cpu, the hard drives, and the psu. If it was running windows, you would also generate extra heat from the ram.

    Hard drive gets organized as part of the "heating" system. Its genius.

    +1

    You're an idiot. Defragging is an I/O intensive operation - you'd barely warm up a single core.
  • Meep 2012-07-10 16:40
    s73v3r:
    operagost:
    myName:
    Isn't it great to live in a country where workers don't have rights. USA! USA! USA!
    What country are you talking about? It's confusing that they use the same abbreviation as the United States of America. Oh wait, you're trolling. Never mind, no one could be that stupid.


    Compared to any other country in the first world, no he's not. Sure, you could say we have more rights than Nagesh's country, but is that really what we want to judge ourselves by? That we're slightly better than a shithole 3rd world country?


    Are we talking about "rights" as in inalienable rights, or "rights" as in handouts and political influence? And are "we" the actual workers, or are "we" the members of a union?
  • Mike Flex 2012-07-10 16:42
    nOPrelb em aAT lLLLLLLLLL
  • The Great Lobachevsky 2012-07-10 16:53
    Calli Arcale:
    English Man:
    Anketam:
    I was so glad that my phone was on mute (dialed into a meeting) when I read this, because I nearly killed over laughing at this.

    As for the comment about wearing heavier clothes... Gloves + Keyboard does not work. Put on some well insulated gloves and try to post a response on this thread.
    Fingerless gloves provide SOME protection, 55 isn't that cold.


    I have Renaud's, so my fingers will go numb with very little provocation. (65 F is enough to make 'em blanch. Seriously.) I have USB heated fingerless gloves and they have made a big difference.


    If it is a government system, chances are you can't plug in unauthorized USB devices. Seriously.
  • Hoge 2012-07-10 16:54
    Yazeran:
    Katie Cunningham:
    Seconded.

    We got yelled at for running folding@home, even after we proved that it wasn't a virus, and wasn't causing anyone any harm. I couldn't even get them to agree to SETI@home, and our agency works with them!


    He.

    Reminds me of the time when I found that one of our core servers had 4 CPU's sitting arround doing almost nothing and started running SETI@home on all of them. I specifically ran all the instances at nice -19 so that any real work would get priority, however after a few months, the sysadmins stopped me saying that it did not look good on their survaliance systems having that server show up with 100% CPU load....
    Did give me a good ranking for a while though...

    Yazeran

    Plan: To go to Mars one day with a hammer


    Nice -19 is the highest priority, not the lowest.
  • The Great Lobachevsky 2012-07-10 16:55
    Oh dear. you just made me think of Strong Bad and typing with boxing gloves on.
  • The Great Lobachevsky 2012-07-10 17:02
    operagost:
    myName:
    Isn't it great to live in a country where workers don't have rights. USA! USA! USA!
    What country are you talking about? It's confusing that they use the same abbreviation as the United States of America. Oh wait, you're trolling. Never mind, no one could be that stupid.


    Actually, a lot of software workers in the USA are exempt from the wage and hour laws.

    213. Exemptions
    (a) Minimum wage and maximum hour requirements
    The provisions of sections 206 (except subsection (d) in the case of paragraph (1) of this subsection) and section 207 of this title shall not apply with respect to—

    (17)
    any employee who is a computer systems analyst, computer programmer, software engineer, or other similarly skilled worker, whose primary duty is—
    (A)
    the application of systems analysis techniques and procedures, including consulting with users, to determine hardware, software, or system functional specifications;
    (B)
    the design, development, documentation, analysis, creation, testing, or modification of computer systems or programs, including prototypes, based on and related to user or system design specifications;
    (C)
    the design, documentation, testing, creation, or modification of computer programs related to machine operating systems; or
    (D)
    a combination of duties described in subparagraphs (A), (B), and
    (C)
    the performance of which requires the same level of skills, and
    who, in the case of an employee who is compensated on an hourly basis, is compensated at a rate of not less than $27.63 an hour.
  • MarkJ 2012-07-10 17:03
    Nagesh:
    s73v3r:
    operagost:
    myName:
    Isn't it great to live in a country where workers don't have rights. USA! USA! USA!
    What country are you talking about? It's confusing that they use the same abbreviation as the United States of America. Oh wait, you're trolling. Never mind, no one could be that stupid.


    Compared to any other country in the first world, no he's not. Sure, you could say we have more rights than Nagesh's country, but is that really what we want to judge ourselves by? That we're slightly better than a shithole 3rd world country?


    In my country, ain't person except for untouchable that have labour rights.
    Does the nagesh have a country?
  • Jack 2012-07-10 17:07
    I can't imagine thinking 55°F is cold enough for gloves. And if the author really does, then very thin, or even fingerless gloves should certainly suffice.
  • D-Coder 2012-07-10 17:08
    MarkJ:
    Nagesh:
    s73v3r:
    operagost:
    myName:
    Isn't it great to live in a country where workers don't have rights. USA! USA! USA!
    What country are you talking about? It's confusing that they use the same abbreviation as the United States of America. Oh wait, you're trolling. Never mind, no one could be that stupid.


    Compared to any other country in the first world, no he's not. Sure, you could say we have more rights than Nagesh's country, but is that really what we want to judge ourselves by? That we're slightly better than a shithole 3rd world country?


    In my country, ain't person except for untouchable that have labour rights.
    Does the nagesh have a country?
    ~/dcikhead/bin
  • Coyne 2012-07-10 17:27
    Meep:
    Are we talking about "rights" as in inalienable rights, or "rights" as in handouts and political influence?


    Right to free press and to redress are inalienable Rights.

    Meep:
    And are "we" the actual workers, or are "we" the members of a union?


    Well, outside of the nasty implied insult, again, freedom of association is an inalienable Right. That the workers should take what they get, like what they get, and shut up?

    It's amazing, the duality of some of the arguments that plutocrats make:

    * Companies should have the right to spend any amount of money they want publishing anything they want in support of any political position they wish but workers should not.

    * Companies should have the right to terminate any worker at any time, penalize them in any way, pay them any amount and should have the right to seek legal redress if those are inadequate but workers should not.

    * Companies should have the right to associate in any way they wish in order to form any kind of trust they choose, in order to set prices for the most profit but workers should not.

    Isn't it amazing how plutocrats get all the rights, but hold the opinion that the workers should not? That workers should take what they get, like what they get, and shut up?
  • Alex Buell 2012-07-10 17:34
    That's why I keep my Sun Blade 2000 around, I only use it in winter to keep my apartment warm. :-)
  • Tom 2012-07-10 17:46
    Coyne:
    * Companies should have the right to spend any amount of money they want publishing anything they want in support of any political position they wish but workers should not.

    * Companies should have the right to terminate any worker at any time, penalize them in any way, pay them any amount and should have the right to seek legal redress if those are inadequate but workers should not.

    * Companies should have the right to associate in any way they wish in order to form any kind of trust they choose, in order to set prices for the most profit but workers should not.
    I'm not saying I disagree with you, but, do you have any specific examples? Who is saying workers can't express political opinions? Can't quit their jobs or seek redress? Can't form groups for price negotiations?
  • Daniel 2012-07-10 18:11
    I have no problem with employers banning cheap space heaters. There are two ways that they generally get used and neither are good:

    1. Under desks with papers and all sorts of crap. This is a fire hazard and probably invalidates the fire insurance (most things do).
    2. On the floor, a short distance away from the desk, but in a pretty random position defined by the length of the cable. This is a often a trip hazard.

    Portable air-con is almost as bad. Idiots love portable air-con units because idiots think they contain magic ice gnomes that make coldness out of butterbeans (or something). Hence idiots will cheerfully plonk a portable air-con unit down in an office, not even bother to connect up the duct, and refuse to believe that it makes more heat than it "makes cold". Oh, and the stupid things tend to leak. (The air-con units, not the idiots, although...)

    But before we blame the employees for their insubordination and poor grasp of thermodynamics you have to look at the wider set up. You can't expect employees to respect the wisdom, sanity and fairness of an employer that sets their thermostats slightly more than 3C below the UK legal minimum for an indoor workplace. That implies that the guy in charge is just as dumb as the twits with their own heaters and air-con units, just with even more power to bugger everybody up. If the employer refuses to provide even an approximation to a usable working environment (and 13C is not such an approximation) then the employees are going to do whatever they can to keep warm and keep working.

    The specific WTF here is that spending money on ad-hoc electric heating has to be vastly more expensive than using the building wide gas or oil fired heating system that the boss is too mean to switch on. Joule for Joule, oil or gas is probably less than half the price of electricity.

    The wider WTF is that I have yet to come across an office where the climate control has ever worked right. More often than not there are competing heating and cooling systems which end up fighting to the death. I suspect that the vendors secretly quite like this because it offers lots of opportunities for new sales. Even when that crime against the environment and the economy is avoided the radiators, vents and thermostats are nearly always in the wrong places so that the climate control system is either misled into doing something silly or just can't avoid making a mixture of hot and cold spots. On the odd occasion that the system is not intrinsically broken, some bozo will come along and bugger it up manually by fiddling with it randomly, just to make good and sure that nobody is happy. If you are really lucky you might get legionnaires disease too.
  • Meep 2012-07-10 18:40
    Coyne:
    Meep:
    Are we talking about "rights" as in inalienable rights, or "rights" as in handouts and political influence?


    Right to free press and to redress are inalienable Rights.


    Free press? What's that got to do with the price of eggs?

    Redress requires the services of lawyers, police, judges, etc., and they might want compensation for those services. So, please do explain how you can have an "inalienable" right to someone else's services, given that it directly contradicts their inalienable right to not provide those services.

    That right for them to enter into a contract or to decline to do so is, of course, the most relevant inalienable right, and the one you completely missed.

    Coyne:
    Meep:
    And are "we" the actual workers, or are "we" the members of a union?


    Well, outside of the nasty implied insult, again, freedom of association is an inalienable Right.


    It's astounding. You call being forced into a union, and being forced to pay union dues whether you like it or not "freedom of association." Black is white, white is black, complete insanity. The only plutocrats here are union bosses and the politicians that are paid off with union dues.

    Coyne:
    That the workers should take what they get, like what they get, and shut up?


    Ever been harassed by union thugs? You'll do as your told and you'll like it, or they'll harass your family, beat you up, destroy your property, etc. And the union bosses have paid off the city so they're damned near untouchable. And if you want a job and are willing to accept a non-union job, they'll be screaming "scab" at you and threatening to kill you. The only rights the left cares about are their own, the only laws they care about are the ones they force on everyone else. Fucking hypocrites.
  • Meep 2012-07-10 19:03
    Daniel:
    Portable air-con is almost as bad. Idiots love portable air-con units because idiots think they contain magic ice gnomes that make coldness out of butterbeans (or something). Hence idiots will cheerfully plonk a portable air-con unit down in an office, not even bother to connect up the duct, and refuse to believe that it makes more heat than it "makes cold".


    One such idiot explained to me, very patiently, that cold air sinks and hot air rises.

    And so I responded, "sure, if the hot air is contained inside a fucking balloon, otherwise it just mixes." Or, at least, I would have if the idiot in question hadn't been my platoon sergeant... Though, he wasn't entirely an idiot; since it was blowing in his face, he was quite comfortable.
  • Jim 2012-07-10 19:06
    trtrwtf:
    Couldn't they just burn requirements documents to keep warm?
    +1
  • Saleem 2012-07-10 19:22
    Jack:
    Where I work, building managers seem to be obsessed with air conditioning. As in, the room temperature is down to 66 but the chiller is still blasting a high speed breeze of cold air on everyone. They generously put a vent right over each desk so you can't avoid it. I tried taping cardboard over mine; safety officer made me take it down. I wear a heavy jacket, ski mask, and gloves -- in the summer. Not exaggerating. Sometimes I even have to step outside for 10 minutes or so to warm up. You can imagine how that helps productivity.

    Years of complaints to everyone imaginable have had absolutely no effect. Not even when the governor of the state put up a "suggestion box" web site to help cut costs.

    Yeah, that's right, it is a tax funded facility. And we all know taxpayers are a sustainable resource made out of unlimited money so why not waste it as fast as possible?

    I can sorta understand a place that is too cold because they want to save money, but too cold and wasting money? WTF?
    I don't know why but that seems to be what people do around here (especially big department stores).

    The moment the temperature rises above 20C we need to cool to 15C. The moment the temperature drops below 20C, we need to heat to 25C. Obviously they don't realise people actually dress for the conditions.....
  • Counter 2012-07-10 19:24
    Goplat:
    sprezzatura:
    I don't see how this would increase the temperature. Isn't the OS is in a perpetual loop anyway waiting for interrupts? Just because it doesn't show up in the Task Manager Performance graph (or whatever OS you use), doesn't mean it isn't looping.


    x86, as well as pretty much every other CPU architecture, has a "halt" instruction that will stop execution until the next interrupt. An OS should use it whenever all threads are idle.
    What does an interrupt interrupt? Or is the interrupt a physical switch?
  • J 2012-07-10 21:11
    Counter:
    Goplat:
    sprezzatura:
    I don't see how this would increase the temperature. Isn't the OS is in a perpetual loop anyway waiting for interrupts? Just because it doesn't show up in the Task Manager Performance graph (or whatever OS you use), doesn't mean it isn't looping.


    x86, as well as pretty much every other CPU architecture, has a "halt" instruction that will stop execution until the next interrupt. An OS should use it whenever all threads are idle.
    What does an interrupt interrupt? Or is the interrupt a physical switch?

    Interrupts are physical, yes. They are a signal that tells the CPU/OS that something wants attention.
  • CRTs are better 2012-07-10 21:40
    CRT Styled Heat:
    Ohhh ohh I know another way. Request a bunch of OLD CRT style monitors. You know, because they're older and obviously cheaper and literal OVENS when used in a concert.


    The pic on a good quality CRT blows away the Liquid Crap Display (LCD). No, this is not meant to be sarcastic.

  • Andrew Au 2012-07-10 21:53
    Should spent the CPU cycles on finding mersenne prime.
    By chance you may win a million :p
  • Matt 2012-07-10 22:01
    "Brain walked away from that job" - I would have to had I used such an inefficient way of heating a room.
  • Dick Head 2012-07-10 22:20
    Oh come on, hasn't anyone made a fucking FILE_NOT_FOUND joke yet?
  • Callin 2012-07-10 22:58
    Sometimes the best programs are the shortest.
  • Yazeran 2012-07-11 03:06
    Hoge:


    Nice -19 is the highest priority, not the lowest.


    Yep, typo on my part... I did set it to the correct nice 19 though (Yes I did test it before I let it loose... I just forgot to remove the '-' form the syntax before I submitted my comment.... :-)

    Yazeran

    Plan: To go to Mars one day with a hammer
  • AndyCanfield 2012-07-11 03:09
    And what exactly is wrong with a personal heater? Conceal one in a desktop case.

    Not on the deskTOP. Under the desk. Between your legs. Female. Keeps you warm.
  • Decius 2012-07-11 03:33
    Daniel:

    The wider WTF is that I have yet to come across an office where the climate control has ever worked right. More often than not there are competing heating and cooling systems which end up fighting to the death. I suspect that the vendors secretly quite like this because it offers lots of opportunities for new sales. Even when that crime against the environment and the economy is avoided the radiators, vents and thermostats are nearly always in the wrong places so that the climate control system is either misled into doing something silly or just can't avoid making a mixture of hot and cold spots. On the odd occasion that the system is not intrinsically broken, some bozo will come along and bugger it up manually by fiddling with it randomly, just to make good and sure that nobody is happy. If you are really lucky you might get legionnaires disease too.


    The right way to handle climate control in a large building is to have a central chiller(s) take some combination of outside and recirculated air, cool it to the desired dewpoint, and duct that air to all locations in the building. A central boiler should heat water (both for hot potable water and heating water, separately), and pump the heating water to every vent. Valves at each vent, controlled by the zone thermostat, regulate the flow of hot water to that vent in order to output air at the desired temperature.

    Note specifically that in a proper setup, dropping the temperature above/below desired on the thermostat CAN cool the room slightly faster.

    If you're only using a pure cooling or heating system, you have no way of regulating humidity independently from temperature
  • phi 2012-07-11 03:33
    Brain walked away from that job...


    Yeah, definitely not a job for a brain.
  • me 2012-07-11 04:21
    Due to new insulation, our office is constantly *overheated*.

    Can you please share the code for **Refridgerator.exe**?
  • puzzled of england 2012-07-11 04:31
    I just don't get why anybody would stay at a job where they are not given a comfortable environment to work in? Not happy? move on. Treated badly? move on. Simple.
  • PiisAWheeL 2012-07-11 04:36
    Slicerwizard:
    PiisAWheeL:
    You are a genius... Constant Background Defragging would generate the most heat, from the cpu, the hard drives, and the psu. If it was running windows, you would also generate extra heat from the ram.

    Hard drive gets organized as part of the "heating" system. Its genius.

    +1

    You're an idiot. Defragging is an I/O intensive operation - you'd barely warm up a single core.
    So, Just solve some math while you're idle. Warm up io bus, make stuff warmer. :p
  • Jibble 2012-07-11 04:40
    David Emery:
    Good thing you weren't using a highly optimizing compiler that optimized that loop away :-)


    Are compilers allowed to change the flow of a program these days? I need to get up to date.


  • Jibble 2012-07-11 04:46
    Daniel:
    Portable air-con is almost as bad. Idiots love portable air-con units because idiots think they contain magic ice gnomes that make coldness out of butterbeans (or something). Hence idiots will cheerfully plonk a portable air-con unit down in an office, not even bother to connect up the duct, and refuse to believe that it makes more heat than it "makes cold".


    That depends on which side of the apparatus you're sitting. If you're sat in front of the main outlet then you'll definitely be cooler than all those idiot whiners who keep saying it doesn't work.
  • Gurth 2012-07-11 04:58
    C-Derb:
    the world's least efficient glass windows

    They were not transparent?
  • pantsman 2012-07-11 05:17
    phi:
    Brain walked away from that job...


    Yeah, definitely not a job for a brain.


    My brain walked away from my job a long time ago.
  • Tuna-Fish 2012-07-11 05:27
    sprezzatura:
    I don't see how this would increase the temperature. Isn't the OS is in a perpetual loop anyway waiting for interrupts? Just because it doesn't show up in the Task Manager Performance graph (or whatever OS you use), doesn't mean it isn't looping.


    Modern CPUs/OSs clock down, clock-gate and power-gate very aggressively. While you type on your keyboard at desktop, large portions of your cpu is likely shut down when it's waiting for interrupts between keystrokes.

    That's why your computer uses much less power when it's not being fully loaded.
  • Anonymous 2012-07-11 05:50
  • ekolis 2012-07-11 06:01
    Government offices running dueling AC and heat? Someone call the EPA, for God's sake!
  • dkf 2012-07-11 06:06
    Daniel:
    Portable air-con is almost as bad. Idiots love portable air-con units because idiots think they contain magic ice gnomes that make coldness out of butterbeans (or something). Hence idiots will cheerfully plonk a portable air-con unit down in an office, not even bother to connect up the duct, and refuse to believe that it makes more heat than it "makes cold". Oh, and the stupid things tend to leak. (The air-con units, not the idiots, although...)
    There is one way in which they do demonstrably work, and that is that they dehumidify the room. When the humidity is low, you can tolerate far higher temperatures than when it is high. (The net extra heat from pumping power into the room for the AC unit will also reduce the humidity a bit.)

    (Now I just need to find a way to work “magic ice gnomes” into my next report…)
  • Herr Otto Flick 2012-07-11 06:41
    Yazeran:
    Katie Cunningham:
    Seconded.

    We got yelled at for running folding@home, even after we proved that it wasn't a virus, and wasn't causing anyone any harm. I couldn't even get them to agree to SETI@home, and our agency works with them!


    He.

    Reminds me of the time when I found that one of our core servers had 4 CPU's sitting arround doing almost nothing and started running SETI@home on all of them. I specifically ran all the instances at nice -19 so that any real work would get priority, however after a few months, the sysadmins stopped me saying that it did not look good on their survaliance systems having that server show up with 100% CPU load....
    Did give me a good ranking for a while though...

    Yazeran

    Plan: To go to Mars one day with a hammer


    If you did that with any of my servers, you wouldn't get a telling off, you'd get the sack. Company servers are for company work, not for internet-rank-wankery looking for aliens or drugs.
  • Matthias 2012-07-11 07:24
    The PET could have done it in fout characters of BASIC code:

    1RUN
  • Jack 2012-07-11 07:37
    Matthias:
    The PET could have done it in fout characters of BASIC code:

    1RUN
    Look I get awful tired of you PET fanbois... that's portable code and would run on any decent technology of that era.
  • My Name 2012-07-11 08:03
    The Great Lobachevsky:
    Calli Arcale:
    English Man:
    Anketam:
    I was so glad that my phone was on mute (dialed into a meeting) when I read this, because I nearly killed over laughing at this.

    As for the comment about wearing heavier clothes... Gloves + Keyboard does not work. Put on some well insulated gloves and try to post a response on this thread.
    Fingerless gloves provide SOME protection, 55 isn't that cold.


    I have Renaud's, so my fingers will go numb with very little provocation. (65 F is enough to make 'em blanch. Seriously.) I have USB heated fingerless gloves and they have made a big difference.


    If it is a government system, chances are you can't plug in unauthorized USB devices. Seriously.


    I work for an unknown medium-sized software/internet company and our handbook specifically bans unauthorised portable media, so it's no surprise to me that a gov org would have rules like that and actually enforce them.
  • Nagesh 2012-07-11 08:09
    MarkJ:
    Nagesh:
    s73v3r:
    operagost:
    myName:
    Isn't it great to live in a country where workers don't have rights. USA! USA! USA!
    What country are you talking about? It's confusing that they use the same abbreviation as the United States of America. Oh wait, you're trolling. Never mind, no one could be that stupid.


    Compared to any other country in the first world, no he's not. Sure, you could say we have more rights than Nagesh's country, but is that really what we want to judge ourselves by? That we're slightly better than a shithole 3rd world country?


    In my country, ain't person except for untouchable that have labour rights.
    Does the nagesh have a country?

    I am Indian only.
  • ted 2012-07-11 08:16
    Anonymous:


    I didn't even click on the link and knew it was some fag linking thedailywtf. It's not clever. It's not funny. Just the word "gloves" with a link under it and the short, useless, one sentence post shows the kind of unoriginal, uninspired, idiot is making the post.

    It was funny to read when it came out. It's even funny when clicking on the Random Article button on the site and seeing it. It's NOT funny when someone links to it from a one-sentence post and thinks they're so fucking clever to have discovered thedailywtf.

    You probably still use lmgtfy and think you're so damn clever.

    It means in real life, you're an unoriginal hipster doofus.


    Got anything to do with sanitizing inputs to a SQL database, etc.? Link to Bobby Tables. Got a nerd-project slow-ass turing machine? Like a minecraft logic circuit from redstone? Link to the one where it's some guy in Alaska making a heater out of a bunch of servers. Got a story about password security or encryption? Link to the one where the BOFH beat the password out of the guy with a wrench.

    Fuck off. You're not clever.
  • PedanticCurmudgeon 2012-07-11 08:40
    Meep:
    Are we talking about "rights" as in inalienable rights, or "rights" as in handouts and political influence? And are "we" the actual workers, or are "we" the members of a union?
    The latter, of course. If you even mention the former these days you get either "but...but...terrorists!" or "don't you want people to have health care?", depending on which side of the two-party coin whoever you're talking to happens to be a member of.
  • Paul 2012-07-11 09:03
    Rights are things you have the ability to do for yourself. The right to speak. The right to associate with like minded people. The right to defend yourself from violence.

    You do not have the right to make anybody else do something for you without their consent.

    Oh and by the way all those rights are yours whether or not (some document / the armed thugs currently controlling your neighborhood) agree. Freedom is not something anybody can give you. Freedom is something you take.
  • linepro 2012-07-11 09:15
    sdfahjkd :OKpik\f;xnv\dc x
  • F 2012-07-11 09:16
    oh yes, it is! Try this... (55°F is 13°C). I've experienced this temperature twice as a student, it was really freezing (for a sedentary work).
  • linepro 2012-07-11 09:16
    Anketam:
    I was so glad that my phone was on mute (dialed into a meeting) when I read this, because I nearly killed over laughing at this.

    As for the comment about wearing heavier clothes... Gloves + Keyboard does not work. Put on some well insulated gloves and try to post a response on this thread.


    sdfahjkd :OKpik\f;xnv\dc x
  • F 2012-07-11 09:21
    puzzled of england:
    I just don't get why anybody would stay at a job where they are not given a comfortable environment to work in? Not happy? move on. Treated badly? move on. Simple.

    Simple if you find an other job. Not simple today here (Europe)
  • Frank 2012-07-11 09:28
    F:
    puzzled of england:
    I just don't get why anybody would stay at a job where they are not given a comfortable environment to work in? Not happy? move on. Treated badly? move on. Simple.

    Simple if you find an other job. Not simple today here (Europe)
    But wait! Europe is the world leader in glorious socialism, high taxes, workers benefits etc. How is it possible that everyone isn't wealthy and happy?
  • F 2012-07-11 09:35
    Almost everyone is in good health. That is the point. No tuberculosis, not the same rate of teen mothers, not the same rate of young child death.
    And I do not think it is easyier to find a job in the USA during crisis...
  • polanski 2012-07-11 09:39
    Not really cold, but here it's against the law. And I'm serious: labor regulations state that temperature in office areas has to be at least 18°C.
    One good side of what some idiots call socialism.
  • Nagesh 2012-07-11 10:17
    We ain't worry aboat too cold workplace in my job.

  • Loren Pechtel 2012-07-11 10:47
    XXXXX:
    In the future, mankind will develop ways to spin and weave wool from sheep into torso-shaped wrappings. These wrappings (I'll call them sweaters) will insulate jackasses. Others will build on this innovation with hand-shaped wrappings (call them gloves). At such a time, jackasses who whine about the thermostat can regulate their own bodies' temperatures.

    Until then, this seems like a reasonable substitute.


    Good luck being a decent typist with gloves on!
  • Sayer 2012-07-11 10:57
    Frank:
    F:
    puzzled of england:
    I just don't get why anybody would stay at a job where they are not given a comfortable environment to work in? Not happy? move on. Treated badly? move on. Simple.

    Simple if you find an other job. Not simple today here (Europe)
    But wait! Europe is the world leader in glorious socialism, high taxes, workers benefits etc. How is it possible that everyone isn't wealthy and happy?


    I know this one! Is it because that's not a reasonable situation to expect anywhere on the planet and your question is deliberately hyperbolic, for the sake of being a smug shithead?
  • RichP 2012-07-11 11:17
    CRT Styled Heat:
    Ohhh ohh I know another way. Request a bunch of OLD CRT style monitors. You know, because they're older and obviously cheaper and literal OVENS when used in a concert.


    I've never been to a CRT concert before. Loved their first album, though.
  • pitchingchris 2012-07-11 11:43
    Loren Pechtel:


    Good luck being a decent typist with gloves on!


    You're likely to type faster with thin gloves than typing on a glass surface.

    Maybe they can justify an IPad for work purposes. The actual purpose is a lap/hand warmer.
  • Frank 2012-07-11 11:59
    Sayer:
    Frank:
    F:
    puzzled of england:
    I just don't get why anybody would stay at a job where they are not given a comfortable environment to work in? Not happy? move on. Treated badly? move on. Simple.

    Simple if you find an other job. Not simple today here (Europe)
    But wait! Europe is the world leader in glorious socialism, high taxes, workers benefits etc. How is it possible that everyone isn't wealthy and happy?


    I know this one! Is it because that's not a reasonable situation to expect anywhere on the planet and your question is deliberately hyperbolic, for the sake of being a smug shithead?
    Or maybe it is because I suspected all along that the lies were, well, lies, and this seemed like an opportunity to point that out.
  • PedanticCurmudgeon 2012-07-11 12:11
    Sayer:
    I know this one! Is it because that's not a reasonable situation to expect anywhere on the planet and your question is deliberately hyperbolic, for the sake of being a smug shithead?
    I think someone may be projecting here...
  • ceiswyn 2012-07-11 12:11
    Frank:
    Or maybe it is because I suspected all along that the lies were, well, lies, and this seemed like an opportunity to point that out.


    No, I don't think that's the reason.

    On the bright side, Stephen Hawking is still alive and not facing any of these 'death panels' I hear so much about from the US :)

    A couple of employers ago, I worked in an office that only had one aircon setting for the entire building. There was one floor where everyone used desktops and they had the sun on them all day; and then there was us, where we all used desktops and were in the shade of other buildings.

    Come summertime, we used to freeze; until we found a screwdriver that we could use to open the locked windows and let the heat in.
  • Frank 2012-07-11 12:20
    ceiswyn:
    Frank:
    Or maybe it is because I suspected all along that the lies were, well, lies, and this seemed like an opportunity to point that out.
    No, I don't think that's the reason.
    So why do you think many people oppose socialism? Is it just because we hate to be happy and healthy and well taken care of? Or is it maybe because some people sincerely doubt that you can keep increasing spending and draining the rich forever because they will never run out of money, or for that matter simply leave?
  • PedanticCurmudgeon 2012-07-11 12:24
    I'm sorry to break it to you guys, but the "Alex is dead" guy passed away last night. He was reading the Darwin Awards, and decided to try a few of them (apparently it's really not a good idea to juggle live hand grenades). He has no known family and certainly no friends, so there's no need to keep anyone in your thoughts. Have a nice day.
  • tragomaskhalos 2012-07-11 12:25
    Maybe he was = placebo effect !
  • Not really 2012-07-11 12:35
    PedanticCurmudgeon:
    I'm sorry to break it to you guys, but the "Alex is dead" guy passed away last night. He was reading the Darwin Awards, and decided to try a few of them (apparently it's really not a good idea to juggle live hand grenades). He has no known family and certainly no friends, so there's no need to keep anyone in your thoughts. Have a nice day.
    Funny I was just reading the Darwin Awards (and daydreaming about what might happen to my favorite web developers) when I noticed a brand new entry today! So pleased to learn it was one of our own!
  • zelmak 2012-07-11 12:38
    Someone:
    My Suggestion: Use multiple threads, so that every core of a multi-core CPU is used. At best start as many threads as you have cpu cores.


    I did exactly this, for the exact same reason as the Story Submitter. Except, I spawned 64 threads each solving the Towers of Hanoi problem each with 1,000 discs.

    In Java.

    I never had to worry about heat.
  • El Ka-Ben 2012-07-11 12:51
    Daniel:
    I have no problem with employers banning cheap space heaters. There are two ways that they generally get used and neither are good:

    1. Under desks with papers and all sorts of crap. This is a fire hazard and probably invalidates the fire insurance (most things do).
    2. On the floor, a short distance away from the desk, but in a pretty random position defined by the length of the cable. This is a often a trip hazard.

    Portable air-con is almost as bad. Idiots love portable air-con units because idiots think they contain magic ice gnomes that make coldness out of butterbeans (or something). Hence idiots will cheerfully plonk a portable air-con unit down in an office, not even bother to connect up the duct, and refuse to believe that it makes more heat than it "makes cold". Oh, and the stupid things tend to leak. (The air-con units, not the idiots, although...)

    But before we blame the employees for their insubordination and poor grasp of thermodynamics you have to look at the wider set up. You can't expect employees to respect the wisdom, sanity and fairness of an employer that sets their thermostats slightly more than 3C below the UK legal minimum for an indoor workplace. That implies that the guy in charge is just as dumb as the twits with their own heaters and air-con units, just with even more power to bugger everybody up. If the employer refuses to provide even an approximation to a usable working environment (and 13C is not such an approximation) then the employees are going to do whatever they can to keep warm and keep working.

    The specific WTF here is that spending money on ad-hoc electric heating has to be vastly more expensive than using the building wide gas or oil fired heating system that the boss is too mean to switch on. Joule for Joule, oil or gas is probably less than half the price of electricity.

    The wider WTF is that I have yet to come across an office where the climate control has ever worked right. More often than not there are competing heating and cooling systems which end up fighting to the death. I suspect that the vendors secretly quite like this because it offers lots of opportunities for new sales. Even when that crime against the environment and the economy is avoided the radiators, vents and thermostats are nearly always in the wrong places so that the climate control system is either misled into doing something silly or just can't avoid making a mixture of hot and cold spots. On the odd occasion that the system is not intrinsically broken, some bozo will come along and bugger it up manually by fiddling with it randomly, just to make good and sure that nobody is happy. If you are really lucky you might get legionnaires disease too.


    That has always been my experience in the US as well.

    A++ Where can I subscribe to your newsletter.
  • Sayer 2012-07-11 13:09
    ted:
    Anonymous:


    I didn't even click on the link and knew it was some fag linking thedailywtf. It's not clever. It's not funny. Just the word "gloves" with a link under it and the short, useless, one sentence post shows the kind of unoriginal, uninspired, idiot is making the post.

    It was funny to read when it came out. It's even funny when clicking on the Random Article button on the site and seeing it. It's NOT funny when someone links to it from a one-sentence post and thinks they're so fucking clever to have discovered thedailywtf.

    You probably still use lmgtfy and think you're so damn clever.

    It means in real life, you're an unoriginal hipster doofus.


    Got anything to do with sanitizing inputs to a SQL database, etc.? Link to Bobby Tables. Got a nerd-project slow-ass turing machine? Like a minecraft logic circuit from redstone? Link to the one where it's some guy in Alaska making a heater out of a bunch of servers. Got a story about password security or encryption? Link to the one where the BOFH beat the password out of the guy with a wrench.

    Fuck off. You're not clever.


    umad bro?
  • The Iceman 2012-07-11 13:34
    A few years ago, I worked for a government contractor, in government-leased space, where we did have some control over the thermostat, but managed to freeze ourselves. We did this by parking a LaserJet II under the thermostat, where it kept the thermostat nice and toasty till somebody had an Aha moment.

    We did not so easily resolve the summer problem of tech staff with a southern window and PHB with a northern one. Or rather, we solved to the satisfaction of one person only.

    But the LaserJet solution suggests to me that some approach involving cold packs should be been possible.

    Captcha: laoreet, a rope used in SE Asia.
  • Lorne Kates 2012-07-11 13:45
    PedanticCurmudgeon:
    I'm sorry to break it to you guys, but the "Alex is dead" guy passed away last night. He was reading the Darwin Awards, and decided to try a few of them (apparently it's really not a good idea to juggle live hand grenades). He has no known family and certainly no friends, so there's no need to keep anyone in your thoughts. Have a nice day.


    Remy Martin? Good riddance. I've had to put up with his dumb articles for quite a bit longer than I would have liked.
  • Sayer 2012-07-11 13:55
    PedanticCurmudgeon:
    Sayer:
    I know this one! Is it because that's not a reasonable situation to expect anywhere on the planet and your question is deliberately hyperbolic, for the sake of being a smug shithead?
    I think someone may be projecting here...


    Regardless of whether I'm a smug shithead or not, declaring Socialism a failure because it hasn't created an impossible utopian scenario is really just complaining about an ideology you don't like in the stupidest possible way. Either you're an idiot who thinks there's a scenario where a particular ideology will create an instant utopia, or else you're being transparently hyperbolic for the sake of ridicule.

    Bonus points for pretending 100% wealth and happiness was ever promised.
  • Dan Smith 2012-07-11 14:06
    If there is an alternate source of heat, wouldn't the main heat simply stop functioning if it is registering a temperature above the threshhold?

    In that case, unless these computers are capable of providing A LOT of heat, all that would happen is that the temperature would still remain at the thermostat setting, and the main heat would be working less of the time.

  • Dan Smith 2012-07-11 14:14
    I remember IRQ this was for COM3 and IRQ that was for COM 4, and where was the modem on, and so on.

    But that was 20 years ago.

    Whatever happened to IRQ's in the Windows 7 world?
  • PedanticCurmudgeon 2012-07-11 14:34
    Sayer:
    Regardless of whether I'm a smug shithead or not, declaring Socialism a failure because it hasn't created an impossible utopian scenario is really just complaining about an ideology you don't like in the stupidest possible way. Either you're an idiot who thinks there's a scenario where a particular ideology will create an instant utopia, or else you're being transparently hyperbolic for the sake of ridicule.

    Bonus points for pretending 100% wealth and happiness was ever promised.
    O.K., now I'm sure someone is projecting...(Hint: I wasn't the one who declared Socialism a failure.)
  • Meep 2012-07-11 15:03
    Sayer:
    PedanticCurmudgeon:
    Sayer:
    I know this one! Is it because that's not a reasonable situation to expect anywhere on the planet and your question is deliberately hyperbolic, for the sake of being a smug shithead?
    I think someone may be projecting here...


    Regardless of whether I'm a smug shithead or not, declaring Socialism a failure because it hasn't created an impossible utopian scenario is really just complaining about an ideology you don't like in the stupidest possible way.


    But it is, fundamentally, a utopian ideology: the historical dialectic predicts an relentless march towards a worker's paradise. It's not just that socialism is supposed to bring that, but that socialism is merely one step in an inevitable process. Part of the justification of socialism is that we should go along with it simply because it will happen whether we like it or not.

    The fact that nothing like that has ever materialized, and the fact that all implementations of socialism have been utter failures. In backwards society, we've seen crushing famine and outright mass murder of the populace. In advanced societies, we've seen vibrant economies grind to a halt, and demographic suicide (birthrates below replacement).

    There has never been the slightest hint of success, ever, in the history of socialism, not with any variant of it whatsoever. It has not merely not lived up to its impossible vision, but has utterly failed every possible test imaginable.
  • Jay 2012-07-11 15:06
    Nagesh:
    Rootbeer:

    As an American taxpayer, I'd like to say "Thanks, asshole, for finding a way to use a $1000 computer as a $20 space heater instead of just buying a fucking $20 space heater."



    Who is selling this mad in China stuff?


    Why are the East Asians angry?
  • Jay 2012-07-11 15:19
    The Great Lobachevsky:
    operagost:
    myName:
    Isn't it great to live in a country where workers don't have rights. USA! USA! USA!
    What country are you talking about? It's confusing that they use the same abbreviation as the United States of America. Oh wait, you're trolling. Never mind, no one could be that stupid.


    Actually, a lot of software workers in the USA are exempt from the wage and hour laws.

    213. Exemptions
    (a) Minimum wage and maximum hour requirements
    The provisions of sections 206 (except subsection (d) in the case of paragraph (1) of this subsection) and section 207 of this title shall not apply with respect to—

    (17)
    any employee who is a computer systems analyst, computer programmer, software engineer, or other similarly skilled worker, whose primary duty is—
    (A)
    the application of systems analysis techniques and procedures, including consulting with users, to determine hardware, software, or system functional specifications;
    (B)
    the design, development, documentation, analysis, creation, testing, or modification of computer systems or programs, including prototypes, based on and related to user or system design specifications;
    (C)
    the design, documentation, testing, creation, or modification of computer programs related to machine operating systems; or
    (D)
    a combination of duties described in subparagraphs (A), (B), and
    (C)
    the performance of which requires the same level of skills, and
    who, in the case of an employee who is compensated on an hourly basis, is compensated at a rate of not less than $27.63 an hour.


    If you're a software developer in the U.S., and you are working at a job that pays less than minimum wage, your problem isn't that the government fails to protect you from greedy employers. Your problem is that you don't know how to read the want ads or write a resume.
  • Jay 2012-07-11 15:28
    I call fraud!! He worked for a U.S. government office and they had a budget too small to heat the building? I used to work for the U.S. government. A "small budget" meant that they could only afford to hire five people to do the work of one instead of the standard ten. I think direct deposit was invented by government employee unions so their people wouldn't have to get out of bed to come to work twice a month just to pick up their paychecks. At least once a year we would be told that we needed to spend a bunch of money fast to use up the money left in the budget or the boss would get in trouble for not spending it all.

    Now, I'd believe it if he said that they had a huge budget for heating and cooling and they spent it all on some wacky AC system that never worked, because it used "green energy" or was bought from a company that made large campaign contributions to the right Congressman or some such. That would be plausible.
  • Sayer 2012-07-11 15:29
    PedanticCurmudgeon:
    Sayer:
    Regardless of whether I'm a smug shithead or not, declaring Socialism a failure because it hasn't created an impossible utopian scenario is really just complaining about an ideology you don't like in the stupidest possible way. Either you're an idiot who thinks there's a scenario where a particular ideology will create an instant utopia, or else you're being transparently hyperbolic for the sake of ridicule.

    Bonus points for pretending 100% wealth and happiness was ever promised.
    O.K., now I'm sure someone is projecting...(Hint: I wasn't the one who declared Socialism a failure.)


    Thanks tips. You'll also notice that I did not attribute that statement to you.
  • Jay 2012-07-11 15:31
    You had thermostats?

    I worked at one government building where they turned on the air conditioning on a specified day every year, and they turned on the heat on a specified day every year, regardless of the outside temperature. So if winter weather started early one year, we'd all freeze, because the magic day to turn the heat on hadn't come yet. If winter started late, we'd all broil, because they turned the heat on anyway.

    One year they had the building so overheated in winter that we opened all the windows and brought in big fans.

    People complained regularly, but we were told this was more efficient than using a thermostat. Umm, yeah.
  • SilentRunner 2012-07-11 15:33
    I don't get it.

    How did the computer(s) heat the environment to a comfortable degree?
  • Sayer 2012-07-11 15:35
    Meep:
    Sayer:
    PedanticCurmudgeon:
    Sayer:
    I know this one! Is it because that's not a reasonable situation to expect anywhere on the planet and your question is deliberately hyperbolic, for the sake of being a smug shithead?
    I think someone may be projecting here...


    Regardless of whether I'm a smug shithead or not, declaring Socialism a failure because it hasn't created an impossible utopian scenario is really just complaining about an ideology you don't like in the stupidest possible way.


    But it is, fundamentally, a utopian ideology: the historical dialectic predicts an relentless march towards a worker's paradise. It's not just that socialism is supposed to bring that, but that socialism is merely one step in an inevitable process. Part of the justification of socialism is that we should go along with it simply because it will happen whether we like it or not.

    The fact that nothing like that has ever materialized, and the fact that all implementations of socialism have been utter failures. In backwards society, we've seen crushing famine and outright mass murder of the populace. In advanced societies, we've seen vibrant economies grind to a halt, and demographic suicide (birthrates below replacement).

    There has never been the slightest hint of success, ever, in the history of socialism, not with any variant of it whatsoever. It has not merely not lived up to its impossible vision, but has utterly failed every possible test imaginable.


    Protip: All ideologies at their most basic (outside of dictatorships maybe) are utopian ideals. None of them are intentionally designed to destroy societies. Also, every single one of them (including dictatorships) fail to live up to that idea once people get involved.

    And even without knowledge of your sources,

    There has never been the slightest hint of success, ever, in the history of socialism, not with any variant of it whatsoever.


    does not ring true.
  • Paul 2012-07-11 16:15
    To evaluate the various cure-all political systems it helps to imagine 10 people on a desert island with no near-term hope of rescue.

    Inflation: everyone gets large piles of paper. It is not edible. Everyone dies.

    Stimulus: The strongest inhabitant commands everyone to hand a large stack of paper to the person on the right, in order to stimulate a vibrant economy. The paper moves rapidly, but it is still not edible. Everyone dies.

    Theft: After initially gathering one coconut each, the inhabitants realize that won't be enough. "A" decides it is easier to take the coconut from "B" than go out and pick another. "B" takes "C"s coconut. Eventually they're all eaten and there is nothing left to steal. Everyone dies.

    Socialism / Marxism / Communism: One guy gets hungry and goes off to pick coconuts. When he comes back with 100 coconuts he generously shares with everyone. They assume he will continue to do so, and work on their tans. After a few days he gets tired of doing all the work and applies one coconut to the head of each of the other inhabitants in the middle of the night. Everyone but the producer dies.

    Free market: everyone goes off and gathers their own stuff. If you like my coconuts and I like your oranges, we trade. Everyone lives. Except the one lazy ass who is still working on his tan.
  • Dan 2012-07-11 16:21
    I've actually done something like this. In an office that was kept cold, instead of writing a script, I would open a terminal and flood ping localhost, sending CPU utilization to 100%. This was on a laptop with fan vents on top, which would keep my hands warm enough to work.
  • Late 4chan guy not using data uris 2012-07-11 17:10
    Frank:
    socialism

  • geert 2012-07-11 18:14
    Why bother to write a program to heat your working environment? Just try to boot Eclipse twice, it has the same effect.
  • Coyne 2012-07-11 21:44
    Tom:
    Coyne:
    * Companies should have the right to spend any amount of money they want publishing anything they want in support of any political position they wish but workers should not.

    * Companies should have the right to terminate any worker at any time, penalize them in any way, pay them any amount and should have the right to seek legal redress if those are inadequate but workers should not.

    * Companies should have the right to associate in any way they wish in order to form any kind of trust they choose, in order to set prices for the most profit but workers should not.
    I'm not saying I disagree with you, but, do you have any specific examples? Who is saying workers can't express political opinions? Can't quit their jobs or seek redress? Can't form groups for price negotiations?


    In theory, they can. However, unions are highly unpopular which is, in a way, ridiculous. Because those rights are really what unions are about--or, more properly, those rights give workers the right to create a union, at least in theory.

    But, if they could, companies/plutocrats would do away with all those rights so that workers would:

    * Not be free to pursue political advantage for unions. For an example of this, you can take the screams of plutocrat outrage when Democrats win, because they are "pro worker" and "pro union". Or, if you want another, the screams of outrage when the unions try to buy political commercials (big bucks for political commercials is ok for companies, but not for unions).

    * Not free to seek legal redress against the company when the company is wrong. The latest example of this is the no-class-action, arbitration only contracts employees are being "forced" to sign. (Yes, there's no actionable force, but when a worker is told, "You want to work here you WILL sign it," it really is duress.)

    * Not free to associate and form a union. A recurrent form of this is the retaliation for even meeting with union organizers. Lately, the argument over secret ballot for union organization votes falls in this category: The unions want to open up balloting because companies routinely "buy votes" in secret ballots, to keep unions out.


    Addendum (2012-07-11 22:03):
    Clarification for the last point: The unions want to permit other methods of voting, not require them. But permitting other methods would make it harder for companies to subvert the voting process.
  • Coyne 2012-07-11 22:02
    Meep:
    Coyne:


    Well, outside of the nasty implied insult, again, freedom of association is an inalienable Right.


    It's astounding. You call being forced into a union, and being forced to pay union dues whether you like it or not "freedom of association." Black is white, white is black, complete insanity. The only plutocrats here are union bosses and the politicians that are paid off with union dues.


    Turning the argument on its head, in effect you say, "If we don't interfere with unionization by taking away the employee's freedom of association, then the employee will lose his freedom of association."

    Is there no middle road? Where people can be free to join a union or not, and those who do join the union can negotiate with the company as a union? And those who choose not to join can negotiate as individuals?

    According to both sides, the answer is, "Positively not."

    In actuality, there is a middle of the road for your complaint about unions: It's called "right to work", and I have no problem with it. It ensures the freedom of association so precious to you.

    Now, what will you give in turn to allow freedom of association for employees who wish to join a union? Would you be fine with a "right to unionize" law? One that can't be easily circumvented, as companies today routinely circumvent the existing protections?
  • Friedrice the Great 2012-07-11 22:27
    Bill:
    Rootbeer:

    As an American taxpayer, I'd like to say "Thanks, asshole, for finding a way to use a $1000 computer as a $20 space heater instead of just buying a fucking $20 space heater."



    Seriously this is how beuracracy works. Some asshole who doesn't have to deal with the consequences makes some 'decision' that affects numerous people adversely all to save a few pennies. In the end the troops on the ground come up with their own solutions sometimes better sometimes not.

    Besides I am 100% sure space heaters were not allowed in the office either.


    I worked in one office where one day everyone else put a space heater under their desk to combat the cold from the "extremely close to our heads" airconditioning vents. They turned them all on - and blew the fuses on the electric circuit providing power to their cubes ...
  • Friedrice the Great 2012-07-11 23:11
    The Great Lobachevsky:
    Calli Arcale:
    English Man:
    Anketam:
    I was so glad that my phone was on mute (dialed into a meeting) when I read this, because I nearly killed over laughing at this.

    As for the comment about wearing heavier clothes... Gloves + Keyboard does not work. Put on some well insulated gloves and try to post a response on this thread.
    Fingerless gloves provide SOME protection, 55 isn't that cold.


    I have Renaud's, so my fingers will go numb with very little provocation. (65 F is enough to make 'em blanch. Seriously.) I have USB heated fingerless gloves and they have made a big difference.


    If it is a government system, chances are you can't plug in unauthorized USB devices. Seriously.


    Can't do it in my private employer's systems, either, unless you'd like the security software to either encrypt the device (if it finds a Windows filesystem) or reformat it and THEN encrypt it (if it finds anything else).
  • Friedrice the Great 2012-07-11 23:12
    MarkJ:
    Nagesh:
    s73v3r:
    operagost:
    myName:
    Isn't it great to live in a country where workers don't have rights. USA! USA! USA!
    What country are you talking about? It's confusing that they use the same abbreviation as the United States of America. Oh wait, you're trolling. Never mind, no one could be that stupid.


    Compared to any other country in the first world, no he's not. Sure, you could say we have more rights than Nagesh's country, but is that really what we want to judge ourselves by? That we're slightly better than a shithole 3rd world country?


    In my country, ain't person except for untouchable that have labour rights.
    Does the nagesh have a country?


    No, but he owns a socket puppet that runs one ...
  • Gurth 2012-07-12 04:46
    Friedrice the Great:
    The Great Lobachevsky:
    Calli Arcale:
    I have USB heated fingerless gloves and they have made a big difference.


    If it is a government system, chances are you can't plug in unauthorized USB devices. Seriously.


    Can't do it in my private employer's systems, either, unless you'd like the security software to either encrypt the device (if it finds a Windows filesystem) or reformat it and THEN encrypt it (if it finds anything else).

    Can you tell me what program they use for that? I would love to be able to store data on USB-powered heated gloves, USB-powered desk lights, USB-powered … oh, you name it. I would never run out of hard drive space ever again!
  • My Name 2012-07-12 06:17
    Nagesh:
    We ain't worry aboat too cold workplace in my job.

    That's OK, children don't get as smelly as adults in high temperatures.
  • Bartholemew Taps 2012-07-12 06:45
    Simply tell your boss you can log into the thermostat and override the setting as well as the display, using a priviledged "admin" password. Cobble together some kind of fake web interface, and be sure to emphasise the word "privilege", to put boss into a power rush.

    Boss will literally jump on the opportunity and will reward you richly. No more heating problems.
  • heh 2012-07-12 06:57
    Paul:
    To evaluate the various cure-all political systems it helps to imagine 10 people on a desert island with no near-term hope of rescue.

    Inflation: everyone gets large piles of paper. It is not edible. Everyone dies.

    Stimulus: The strongest inhabitant commands everyone to hand a large stack of paper to the person on the right, in order to stimulate a vibrant economy. The paper moves rapidly, but it is still not edible. Everyone dies.

    Theft: After initially gathering one coconut each, the inhabitants realize that won't be enough. "A" decides it is easier to take the coconut from "B" than go out and pick another. "B" takes "C"s coconut. Eventually they're all eaten and there is nothing left to steal. Everyone dies.

    Socialism / Marxism / Communism: One guy gets hungry and goes off to pick coconuts. When he comes back with 100 coconuts he generously shares with everyone. They assume he will continue to do so, and work on their tans. After a few days he gets tired of doing all the work and applies one coconut to the head of each of the other inhabitants in the middle of the night. Everyone but the producer dies.

    Free market: everyone goes off and gathers their own stuff. If you like my coconuts and I like your oranges, we trade. Everyone lives. Except the one lazy ass who is still working on his tan.

    heh good one. but...

    Socialism / Marxism / Communism -- eee wrong supply for everyone is directed centrally and everyone has ot do his part. not working is looked down upon and while work is propagated as the greatest value of all.

    problem= work for work itself and also that central direction doesn't really adjust fast enough to what people need.

    ----
    moving on there is no socialism in Eeurope and there never really was (despite countries calling themselves socialist).
    even today in social democracy countries the benefits are limited.
    for example a common missconception is that you don't have to work and still get benefits. well you do get them when you are unemployed (for a limted period) but you need to activelly seek employment during this time. if oyu don't you loose the benefits.
    and yes there are less poor people in Europe than in America. And even if they are poor they still get good medical service :-P might not be best in the world or gratest but it is sitll good. most people here probably live in flats, but then again houses are expencive as they are not usually made out of cheap wooden/plaster pannel but thick brics.
  • Bartholemew Taps 2012-07-12 07:04
    Sayer:
    PedanticCurmudgeon:
    Sayer:
    I know this one! Is it because that's not a reasonable situation to expect anywhere on the planet and your question is deliberately hyperbolic, for the sake of being a smug shithead?
    I think someone may be projecting here...


    Regardless of whether I'm a smug shithead or not, declaring Socialism a failure because it hasn't created an impossible utopian scenario is really just complaining about an ideology you don't like in the stupidest possible way. Either you're an idiot who thinks there's a scenario where a particular ideology will create an instant utopia, or else you're being transparently hyperbolic for the sake of ridicule.

    Bonus points for pretending 100% wealth and happiness was ever promised.


    Socialism does fail precisely because it does make those promises, and in spite of the overwhelmingly compelling lessons of history, people continue to be drawn by them.

    Moreover, the main reason socialist societies allow themselves to get so f**ked up that millions are allowed to freeze or starve to death, is that people rationalise and try to shift the goalposts. For example by trying to rewrite history and pretend that utopia was never promised. This serves to inhibit the debunking process and the juggernaught rolls on.

    Capitalism only promises gradual improvements in wealth, along with inequality, recessions, bankruptcies and various other ills. But even when these bad things all happen, people are still better off than those who chose the path of wilful ignorance and blundered into socialism.

    Capitalism (like democracy) sucks - the point is that it sucks *less*.
  • Jibble 2012-07-12 07:08
    Bartholemew Taps:
    Simply tell your boss you can log into the thermostat and override the setting as well as the display, using a priviledged "admin" password. Cobble together some kind of fake web interface, and be sure to emphasise the word "privilege", to put boss into a power rush.

    Boss will literally jump on the opportunity and will reward you richly. No more heating problems.


    I like this idea.

    I'd go further and introduce some initial randomness so that he thinks somebody else has access and is changing it. You can get extra brownie points by "blocking their account" so the boss has exclusive control.

  • Jibble 2012-07-12 07:11
    Jibble:
    Bartholemew Taps:
    Simply tell your boss you can log into the thermostat and override the setting as well as the display, using a priviledged "admin" password. Cobble together some kind of fake web interface, and be sure to emphasise the word "privilege", to put boss into a power rush.

    Boss will literally jump on the opportunity and will reward you richly. No more heating problems.


    I like this idea.

    I'd go further and introduce some initial randomness so that he thinks somebody else has access and is changing it. You can get extra brownie points by "blocking their account" so the boss has exclusive control.



    Also ... add an email alert in case he sets it to some extreme value to check if it's working.

    This give you a chance to go over and adjust the real controls appropriately until he's satisfied everything is in order.
  • RobR 2012-07-12 09:14
    I often use gloves when I type. The cotton ones that high school marching bands wear. I started when I worked two cubicles away from a floor-to-ceiling window, and in the summer my fingers would stick to the keys, causing typos. My pay was directly proportional to my typing speed. Now I wear the gloves to keep my hands warm.
  • Rowell 2012-07-12 11:51
    CShzalle3ntge Accdeptytfed!!Q!Q

  • ceiswyn 2012-07-12 11:54
    Paul:
    Free market: everyone goes off and gathers their own stuff. If you like my coconuts and I like your oranges, we trade. Everyone lives. Except the one lazy ass who is still working on his tan.


    You're making the classic error of assuming that everyone is able to gather their own coconuts, and that anyone who doesn't is just lazy.

    Now let us assume a more realistic scenario, where, say, one of those ten is too old or disabled to go foraging, one is a child under 5, etc.

    Free market: The oldster dies. The child's mother is unable to pick enough coconuts on her own to feed both of them, so the child dies too. That's just what you get for not being a healthy young adult.

    Socialism: All the able-bodied put a proportion of what they pick towards feeding the non-able-bodied. Some people have to work a little harder, but at least nobody dies unnecessarily.

    No 'Europe' (did you have any particular countries in mind?) is not a workers' paradise and never will be. Up side, we can all access healthcare and nobody loses their home because they can't pay the hospital bills for an unanticipated illness or accident. The US system just scares me.
  • Bartholemew Taps 2012-07-12 12:14
    ceiswyn:
    Paul:
    Free market: everyone goes off and gathers their own stuff. If you like my coconuts and I like your oranges, we trade. Everyone lives. Except the one lazy ass who is still working on his tan.


    You're making the classic error of assuming that everyone is able to gather their own coconuts, and that anyone who doesn't is just lazy.

    Now let us assume a more realistic scenario, where, say, one of those ten is too old or disabled to go foraging, one is a child under 5, etc.

    Free market: The oldster dies. The child's mother is unable to pick enough coconuts on her own to feed both of them, so the child dies too. That's just what you get for not being a healthy young adult.

    Socialism: All the able-bodied put a proportion of what they pick towards feeding the non-able-bodied. Some people have to work a little harder, but at least nobody dies unnecessarily.


    All you're doing here is assigning altruism to the participants in the socialist model, but not in the free market model.

    It's like the agile vs waterfall debate: agilistas assume developers are diligent and competent, always follow the processes, magically know how to refector effectively etc. They then say waterfall must fail because there's no way anyone could ever get an up-front design right.

    If you want to compare systems, you need a consistent model of human behaviour. It doesn't need to be complete, but it must inject the all of the good, bad and ugly aspects into each of the models you are contemplating.
  • Jay 2012-07-12 14:09
    ceiswyn:
    Paul:
    Free market: everyone goes off and gathers their own stuff. If you like my coconuts and I like your oranges, we trade. Everyone lives. Except the one lazy ass who is still working on his tan.


    You're making the classic error of assuming that everyone is able to gather their own coconuts, and that anyone who doesn't is just lazy.

    Now let us assume a more realistic scenario, where, say, one of those ten is too old or disabled to go foraging, one is a child under 5, etc.

    Free market: The oldster dies. The child's mother is unable to pick enough coconuts on her own to feed both of them, so the child dies too. That's just what you get for not being a healthy young adult.

    Socialism: All the able-bodied put a proportion of what they pick towards feeding the non-able-bodied. Some people have to work a little harder, but at least nobody dies unnecessarily.

    No 'Europe' (did you have any particular countries in mind?) is not a workers' paradise and never will be. Up side, we can all access healthcare and nobody loses their home because they can't pay the hospital bills for an unanticipated illness or accident. The US system just scares me.


    Ummm ... no. Nothing about the idea of free markets says that people cannot or should not take care of their own families, or provide charity to those in need. The difference is that in a free market each individual decides what charities to support and with how much, while under socialism the government makes this decision for everyone.

    At this point, of course, the socialist always say, "Yes, but what happens if private charitable contributions are not sufficient to meet the need?" The answer is, of course, that the poor people starve.

    But you could ask such a question of any system. What happens if in a socialist society the people are unwilling to vote for sufficiently high taxes to support the poor? What happens if the people vote for ample taxes, but then corrupt politicians and bureaucrats steal the money, or give it all to members of favored interest groups, or on "contracts" to companies that gave big campaign contributions, rather than to the truly needy?

    In a free market, if I donate to a local homeless shelter, and then I find out that the people who run it are corrupt and are stealing the money that generous people gave to help the poor, I can stop giving to them and redirect my contributions to a more worthy charity.

    But in a socialist society, if I discover that a government agency that is supposed to help the poor is, in fact, siphoning money off to Senator Smith's brother-in-law, or is simply incompetent and wastes huge amounts of money, what can I do? I can't refuse to pay my taxes, not and stay out of jail. I can protest, but you can be sure that Senator Smith and his political supporters will fight back -- probably using my tax money for the lawyers and public relations firms etc that they use to justify getting more of my tax money. And he surely has political allies who may fully recognize how corrupt he is, but will overlook it because they need his political support. Or who are as corrupt as he is and are in on the whole scam.

    Can you honestly tell me that the above scenario does not happen every day in real life?
  • Jay 2012-07-12 14:25
    Coyne:

    It's amazing, the duality of some of the arguments that plutocrats make:

    * Companies should have the right to spend any amount of money they want publishing anything they want in support of any political position they wish but workers should not.

    * Companies should have the right to terminate any worker at any time, penalize them in any way, pay them any amount and should have the right to seek legal redress if those are inadequate but workers should not.

    * Companies should have the right to associate in any way they wish in order to form any kind of trust they choose, in order to set prices for the most profit but workers should not.

    Isn't it amazing how plutocrats get all the rights, but hold the opinion that the workers should not? That workers should take what they get, like what they get, and shut up?


    I don't know any right-winger who says that workers should not be allowed to speak out on political issues, should not be allowed to seek legal redress for breach of contract by their employers, and/or should not be allowed to freely associate with other workers (or anyone else). I'd be interested to see any quotes or other evidence you have of such positions. Perhaps there are a few truly extreme people out there who say such things.

    But what I think you mean is that right-wingers say that UNIONS should not be allowed to do these things. But of course "unions" is not the same thing as "workers" at all. Just because unions claim to speak for workers does not mean they really do. I could stand up and say, "I speak for all white people when I say ..." That wouldn't make it true. For starters, unions are not "free associations" of workers. Peole are forced to join unions whether they want to or not, and are forced to pay dues to those unions, which in many cases the unions use to pursue political objectives with little or no relation to employment contracts, and which the employees may or may not agree with.

    Unions today are big, powerful organizations. Right-wingers routinely say that the unions are run for the benefit of the leaders of the unions, not the workers. Whether it's true in any given case or not, it's surely true in some cases, and it's certainly a danger to be dealt with.

    The issue is not whether employees should be ALLOWED to form a union to bargain with their employer, but whether unions should have special legal privileges that other individuals and organizations do not.
  • no laughing matter 2012-07-12 14:30
    Bartholemew Taps:

    All you're doing here is assigning altruism to the participants in the socialist model, but not in the free market model.

    In the model? It does not exist in the model!
    To the contrary: the claim is that everyone acts egoistically, but still everyone benefits (see Adam Smith: Invisible Hand ... well, others believe in Santa Clause, so why should economic "science" not believe in invisible hands.)

    Bartholemew Taps:

    It's like the agile vs waterfall debate: agilistas assume developers are diligent and competent, always follow the processes, magically know how to refector effectively etc. They then say waterfall must fail because there's no way anyone could ever get an up-front design right.

    The waterfall model requires that requirements and specifications are complete and correct upfront.

    Requirements and specifications are given by PHB. So guess what is to be expected?

    Bartholemew Taps:

    If you want to compare systems, you need a consistent model of human behaviour. It doesn't need to be complete, but it must inject the all of the good, bad and ugly aspects into each of the models you are contemplating.

    It does need to be consistent, but it does not need to be correct?

    It does "not need to be complete", but it must cover "all of the good, bad and ugly aspects"?

    In any case the "model of human behaviour" i see presented in the island example in this thread is neither.
  • ceiswyn 2012-07-12 15:45
    Jay:
    Ummm ... no. Nothing about the idea of free markets says that people cannot or should not take care of their own families, or provide charity to those in need. The difference is that in a free market each individual decides what charities to support and with how much, while under socialism the government makes this decision for everyone.


    How else would you ensure that funds went where they were needed most? I mean, the individual could look at the population demographics and the balance sheets of every single charity and check where every other individual was sending their money to make sure all the bases were covered and one charity wasn't getting all the money by chance, but this individual certainly doesn't.

    a free market, if I donate to a local homeless shelter, and then I find out that the people who run it are corrupt and are stealing the money that generous people gave to help the poor, I can stop giving to them and redirect my contributions to a more worthy charity.


    You can. Of course, you may be giving your money to a homeless shelter when actually the major problem in society is lack of healthcare, but them's the breaks. And of course, people are generally not nearly willingly generous enough with their money to cover the genuine needs of the unfortunate.

    Would I voluntarily give several hundred pounds a month to charities providing for the old or the sick or the purely unable-to-find-jobs? Probably not. I'd have no idea that much was needed. But since that is the cost, I'm glad that there's an external disciple that makes me pay it.

    And given that in my country people don't go bankrupt because of unforeseen illness or accident and the overall cost of healthcare is lower than in the US I gotta say the evidence isn't convincing me of the superiority of the pure free market model.
  • radarbob 2012-07-12 16:17
    In a certain Midwest state on a certain US Gummint installation in a certain WWII era building we were running at 150% of the rated electrical capacity of the building using it for software development.

    During the summer most folks had a heater at their desks; in the winter I would open the very large window during a blizzard, sitting next to it very comfortably.
  • Bartholemew Taps 2012-07-13 04:54
    no laughing matter:
    Bartholemew Taps:

    All you're doing here is assigning altruism to the participants in the socialist model, but not in the free market model.

    In the model? It does not exist in the model!
    To the contrary: the claim is that everyone acts egoistically, but still everyone benefits (see Adam Smith: Invisible Hand ... well, others believe in Santa Clause, so why should economic "science" not believe in invisible hands.)

    Bartholemew Taps:

    It's like the agile vs waterfall debate: agilistas assume developers are diligent and competent, always follow the processes, magically know how to refector effectively etc. They then say waterfall must fail because there's no way anyone could ever get an up-front design right.

    The waterfall model requires that requirements and specifications are complete and correct upfront.

    Requirements and specifications are given by PHB. So guess what is to be expected?

    Bartholemew Taps:

    If you want to compare systems, you need a consistent model of human behaviour. It doesn't need to be complete, but it must inject the all of the good, bad and ugly aspects into each of the models you are contemplating.

    It does need to be consistent, but it does not need to be correct?

    It does "not need to be complete", but it must cover "all of the good, bad and ugly aspects"?

    In any case the "model of human behaviour" i see presented in the island example in this thread is neither.


    Adam Smith describes the wealth-generation process. He does not say that particpants in a free market do not act altruistically. That is your invention.

    You appear to believe that PHBs who write software requirements always get it wrong, but the PHBs who run socialist states always get it right. How curious.

    And nobody, not even you, fully understands the human condition.
  • Mathias 2012-07-13 05:53
    lame story. at least is what short. there's some progress, congrats to you rémy.
  • PedanticCurmudgeon 2012-07-13 08:36
    ceiswyn:
    How else would you ensure that funds went where they were needed most? I mean, the individual could look at the population demographics and the balance sheets of every single charity and check where every other individual was sending their money to make sure all the bases were covered and one charity wasn't getting all the money by chance, but this individual certainly doesn't.
    <sarcasm>I'm sure bureaucrats and politicians would do a better job of this.</sarcasm> Did you know that there are private organizations that specialize in this sort of thing?

    ceiswyn:
    Would I voluntarily give several hundred pounds a month to charities providing for the old or the sick or the purely unable-to-find-jobs? Probably not. I'd have no idea that much was needed. But since that is the cost, I'm glad that there's an external disciple that makes me pay it.
    At least you're honest about it.

    ceiswyn:
    And given that in my country people don't go bankrupt because of unforeseen illness or accident and the overall cost of healthcare is lower than in the US I gotta say the evidence isn't convincing me of the superiority of the pure free market model.
    We don't have a free market for health care and haven't for at least a hundred years. We have a partially free market. What products and services can be offered and who can offer them are strictly limited.
  • solfish 2012-07-13 10:55
    The obvious issue with that massively over simplistic scenario is that all the people are equal, in terms of opportunity, to begin with so hey Socialism has already triumphed.

    If you want a comparison to reality then one of the guys owns half the coconut and orange trees on the island. He also got given a ton of coconuts and oranges by his Daddy along with a step ladder to make it easier for him to collect coconuts. He see it as completely fair that he has all this stuff and doesn't want to share it. Everyone else has to beg him for access to his land to pick their coconuts. He charges them for access. etc etc.
  • no laughing matter 2012-07-13 11:13
    Bartholemew Taps:

    Adam Smith describes the wealth-generation process. He does not say that particpants in a free market do not act altruistically. That is your invention.
    So he does say it and it is part of his description of the wealth-generation process (which underlies the free-market model)?

    Could you point me to a source?

    Bartholemew Taps:

    You appear to believe that PHBs (...) the PHBs who run socialist states always get it right.
    Where did i write so?

    Bartholemew Taps:

    And nobody, not even you, fully understands the human condition.
    So you finally understand why economic models that use simplified models of the human behaviour will fail?
  • Daniel 2012-07-13 14:35
    Agreed. I had a pair of "hobo gloves" I used specifically for typing. The fingertips were cut off of them. It wasn't not perfect, but it kept my hands from locking up and still allowed me to type accurately.
  • Steve 2012-07-14 13:10

    Computers generate more heat when all parts of the hardware are actually being used. Just looping an instruction, doesn't use much of the hardware.

    Most computer manufacturers also publish programs called "diagnostics", that are designed to exercise every part of the hardware and report any errors that they find. The random seek test on the disk drives, might be a good one to run during the winter.
  • Coyne 2012-07-14 16:55
    Jay:
    Coyne:

    It's amazing, the duality of some of the arguments that plutocrats make:

    * Companies should have the right to spend any amount of money they want publishing anything they want in support of any political position they wish but workers should not.

    * Companies should have the right to terminate any worker at any time, penalize them in any way, pay them any amount and should have the right to seek legal redress if those are inadequate but workers should not.

    * Companies should have the right to associate in any way they wish in order to form any kind of trust they choose, in order to set prices for the most profit but workers should not.

    Isn't it amazing how plutocrats get all the rights, but hold the opinion that the workers should not? That workers should take what they get, like what they get, and shut up?


    I don't know any right-winger who says that workers should not be allowed to speak out on political issues, should not be allowed to seek legal redress for breach of contract by their employers, and/or should not be allowed to freely associate with other workers (or anyone else).


    Oh, yes, you're probably right about that. Instead, right wingers simply speak out for the unrestricted right of corporations to punish any worker that speaks out or seeks redress.

    An example I saw yesterday was a comment related in this article (page 7) by an employee of Apple that, "Finally, when you are a full-fledged employee [of Apple], you are absolutely restricted from representing Apple in any way outside the store. If you post an identifiable comment as an employee, you will be fired immediately." (You should understand this clearly: According to this article, that means, "If you identify yourself as an Apple employee or are known to be one..." So if you say on your FaceBook profile you work for Apple and then make a "inappropriate comment" on TDWTF...terminated!) Should a company be allowed to restrict an individual's freedom of speech in that way? A right winger would instantly assert that Apple is within its rights; and its rights should not be abridged, regardless of whether Apple's actions are fair or not.

    Sometimes, silence on an issue is as expressive as outright speech: When right wingers defend corporate rights to all exclusion of employee rights, their silence on employee rights is expressive indeed.

    Jay:
    But of course "unions" is not the same thing as "workers" at all. Just because unions claim to speak for workers does not mean they really do.


    Do you really assert that any corporation would be fine with employees creating an entirely new union that was representative? Of course not: a corporation would resist that just as strongly as employees trying to organize with an existing union.

    So it isn't just about "non-representative" unions; the corporation has issue with collective negotiation in itself. The "unions don't represent employees" argument is therefore exposed as a red herring; as an issue between employees and unions, not between companies and employees.


    Addendum (2012-07-14 18:25):
    I should have read a bit more from the second-link in the Apple discussion above. This is at the bottom of the article, quoted from their employment policy: "This applies whether you engage in these activities in or outside of work, and whether or not you identify yourself as an Apple employee."

    Which is even more odious than I thought.
  • KLiudser 2012-07-15 02:54
    > Gloves + Keyboard does not work. Put on some well insulated gloves and try to post a response on this thread.

    JI dsoknj';tr kjnmioew wehjastr yuoiiu;'re cvopnmopklsaiomniomngf asbvoiuytr,.
  • Ha! 2012-07-15 18:51
    We have thermostats with no controls. To adjust one you plug in an RL-45 cable to a handheld device, adjust the temperature and unplug. When facilities refused to adjust it until a specific seasonal date; The office staff took a plastic cup full of ice and used an elastic band to attach it directly of the sensor. This caused the heat to engage.
  • ceiswyn 2012-07-16 11:37
    [quote user="PedanticCurmudgeon"][quote user="ceiswyn"]How else would you ensure that funds went where they were needed most?
    [/quote]<sarcasm>I'm sure bureaucrats and politicians would do a better job of this.</sarcasm> Did you know that there are private organizations that specialize in this sort of thing?[/quote]

    And unlike every other organisation in the world, which is (according to you) possibly/probably corrupt, biased, error-prone and mired in bribery and graft, these particular organisations are shining beacons of ethics and accuracy because...?

    [quote][quote user="ceiswyn"]Would I voluntarily give several hundred pounds a month to charities providing for the old or the sick or the purely unable-to-find-jobs? Probably not. I'd have no idea that much was needed. But since that is the cost, I'm glad that there's an external disciple that makes me pay it.[/quote]At least you're honest about it.[/quote]

    Of course I am. That's the entire problem with both an extreme free market ideology and with communism. They both rely on people being far more self-sacrificing, helpful and generous than people actually tend to be. Have you ever heard of 'social loafing'?

    [quote][quote user="ceiswyn"]And given that in my country people don't go bankrupt because of unforeseen illness or accident and the overall cost of healthcare is lower than in the US I gotta say the evidence isn't convincing me of the superiority of the pure free market model.[/quote]We don't have a free market for health care and haven't for at least a hundred years. We have a partially free market. What products and services can be offered and who can offer them are strictly limited.[/quote][/quote]

    And if you had a completely free market, do you think more or fewer people would have trouble affording healthcare...?
  • ceiswyn 2012-07-16 11:38
    ...what the flip happened with my tags there? Oh well, never mind, you get the idea.

    Or not.
  • A Gould 2012-07-16 12:55
    PiisAWheeL:
    You ever try to use gloves with a keyboard? (Gloves that are worth a shit anyways?)

    I have a bent piece of medal designed specifally for the box in our office.


    Paperclip used to work just fine for me - took them months to figure it out (since they assumed that no-one could change it, they never checked to see if someone *did*).
  • AN AMAZING CODER 2012-07-16 13:25
    Loren Pechtel:
    XXXXX:
    In the future, mankind will develop ways to spin and weave wool from sheep into torso-shaped wrappings. These wrappings (I'll call them sweaters) will insulate jackasses. Others will build on this innovation with hand-shaped wrappings (call them gloves). At such a time, jackasses who whine about the thermostat can regulate their own bodies' temperatures.

    Until then, this seems like a reasonable substitute.


    Good luck being a decent typist with gloves on!



    If you need gloves at 55 degrees, you're probably not capable of working outside of a bubble to begin with.
  • PedanticCurmudgeon 2012-07-16 13:26
    ceiswyn:
    And unlike every other organisation in the world, which is (according to you) possibly/probably corrupt, biased, error-prone and mired in bribery and graft, these particular organisations are shining beacons of ethics and accuracy because...?
    I never said that every other organization is corrupt, biased, etc. What does it say about you that you think I did? Anyway, to answer your question, the fact that they have to rely on voluntary contributions makes a difference.

    ceiswyn:
    At least you're honest about it.


    Of course I am. That's the entire problem with both an extreme free market ideology and with communism. They both rely on people being far more self-sacrificing, helpful and generous than people actually tend to be. Have you ever heard of 'social loafing'?
    No, I haven't, but apparently you've never heard of the United Way, so I guess we're even. But you miss my point, which is that you believe you need to be forced at gunpoint to do the right thing. That should tell you something.

    ceiswyn:
    And if you had a completely free market, do you think more or fewer people would have trouble affording healthcare...?
    Given that the prohibited alternatives tend to be a fraction of the cost of the allowed treatments, and that part of the restriction is on the number of healthcare providers, probably fewer.

    BTW, the preview button is your friend.
  • AN AMAZING CODER 2012-07-16 13:41
    Coyne:
    Jay:
    Coyne:

    It's amazing, the duality of some of the arguments that plutocrats make:

    * Companies should have the right to spend any amount of money they want publishing anything they want in support of any political position they wish but workers should not.

    * Companies should have the right to terminate any worker at any time, penalize them in any way, pay them any amount and should have the right to seek legal redress if those are inadequate but workers should not.

    * Companies should have the right to associate in any way they wish in order to form any kind of trust they choose, in order to set prices for the most profit but workers should not.

    Isn't it amazing how plutocrats get all the rights, but hold the opinion that the workers should not? That workers should take what they get, like what they get, and shut up?


    I don't know any right-winger who says that workers should not be allowed to speak out on political issues, should not be allowed to seek legal redress for breach of contract by their employers, and/or should not be allowed to freely associate with other workers (or anyone else).


    Oh, yes, you're probably right about that. Instead, right wingers simply speak out for the unrestricted right of corporations to punish any worker that speaks out or seeks redress.

    An example I saw yesterday was a comment related in this article (page 7) by an employee of Apple that, "Finally, when you are a full-fledged employee [of Apple], you are absolutely restricted from representing Apple in any way outside the store. If you post an identifiable comment as an employee, you will be fired immediately." (You should understand this clearly: According to this article, that means, "If you identify yourself as an Apple employee or are known to be one..." So if you say on your FaceBook profile you work for Apple and then make a "inappropriate comment" on TDWTF...terminated!) Should a company be allowed to restrict an individual's freedom of speech in that way? A right winger would instantly assert that Apple is within its rights; and its rights should not be abridged, regardless of whether Apple's actions are fair or not.

    Sometimes, silence on an issue is as expressive as outright speech: When right wingers defend corporate rights to all exclusion of employee rights, their silence on employee rights is expressive indeed.

    Jay:
    But of course "unions" is not the same thing as "workers" at all. Just because unions claim to speak for workers does not mean they really do.


    Do you really assert that any corporation would be fine with employees creating an entirely new union that was representative? Of course not: a corporation would resist that just as strongly as employees trying to organize with an existing union.

    So it isn't just about "non-representative" unions; the corporation has issue with collective negotiation in itself. The "unions don't represent employees" argument is therefore exposed as a red herring; as an issue between employees and unions, not between companies and employees.


    Addendum (2012-07-14 18:25):
    I should have read a bit more from the second-link in the Apple discussion above. This is at the bottom of the article, quoted from their employment policy: "This applies whether you engage in these activities in or outside of work, and whether or not you identify yourself as an Apple employee."

    Which is even more odious than I thought.


    I'm not a legal expert, but I've been a working adult for long enough that i'm surprised by your reaction to Apple's policies. Apple is interested in: protecting it's brand, and keeping tabs on it's intellectual property due to their value in the companies success. They do a better job at both than anyone in history, I'd argue.



    First: employment is at-will in the United States. You can quit at any time, and you can get fired at any time. In most cases, a contract cannot change that, it can only set terms for how one may quit or be terminated.


    Second: "Freedom of speech" does not mean "I can say anything I want, whenever I want, without fear of any punishment". It essentially only protects your GENERAL right to have and express an opinion or pass information without fear of punishment _from the government_. It does not protect you from other laws you might violate while doing such. We can all think of 100 examples of this, so I won't bother listing any.

    Third: A contract that defines a consequence to an action does not take any rights away. In fact, a contract cannot take away your basic rights, and a contract that tries to do so would likely be thrown out in court.

    You can still say whatever you want, but Apple will fire you. That's not a violation of your rights -- you don't have a right to a job. You won't be arrested or tried, or killed. No freedom of speech revoked. Similarly, if you sign my NDA, and then go post on the internet about by business secrets, you will be sued for breach of contract.

  • frozen 2012-07-16 23:58
    Re: "At such a time, jackasses who whine about the thermostat can regulate their own bodies' temperatures."
    You've obviously never had to type with gloves on.
    your choices are either thick gloves or blue fingers.
    The plus side of thick gloves is that you get to hit multiple keys with each keystroke
  • ceiswyn 2012-07-17 09:15
    PedanticCurmudgeon:
    ceiswyn:
    At least you're honest about it.


    Of course I am. That's the entire problem with both an extreme free market ideology and with communism. They both rely on people being far more self-sacrificing, helpful and generous than people actually tend to be. Have you ever heard of 'social loafing'?
    No, I haven't, but apparently you've never heard of the United Way, so I guess we're even. But you miss my point, which is that you believe you need to be forced at gunpoint to do the right thing. That should tell you something.


    Yes. It tells me that I have an accurate view of human nature, rather than relying on rosy (and demonstrably false) optimism about people's generosity to those in need. You really should look up social loafing and related topics in social psychology.

    You might also find Latané and Darley's The Unresponsive Bystander interesting on the general theme of man's basic humanity, albeit tangential to the specific point at hand.
  • TOM BOMBADIL 2012-07-17 19:40
    My physics teacher in high school had a similar solution. He'd put a wet paper towel over the thermostat in his room, evaporation would cool it.
  • Gantyep 2012-07-18 01:45
    The CPU is actually idling at this point - it's not even running code. An OS that's doing any more than absolutely nothing at input idle isn't a particularly efficient OS.

    NOPs actually burn cycles, you need to be stuck at a HALT.
  • PedanticCurmudgeon 2012-07-18 08:35
    ceiswyn:
    PedanticCurmudgeon:
    But you miss my point, which is that you believe you need to be forced at gunpoint to do the right thing. That should tell you something.


    Yes. It tells me that I have an accurate view of human nature, rather than relying on rosy (and demonstrably false) optimism about people's generosity to those in need.
    I seriously hope you're trolling, but just in case you aren't: No, believing others need to be forced to do the right thing is realistic. Believing that you need to be forced to do the right thing says that you have no integrity. Have you considered running for public office? You'd fit right in.
  • Xaav 2012-07-18 16:01
    Why the torture test when Prime Grid and all the Computation Projects could do the same with a real purpose ?

    This idea of a infinite loop or a test is nonsense : I use BOINC and particularly the World Community Grid to keep the room warm during winter.
  • andy 2012-07-19 06:16
    I also had this idea...

    -bash-3.00$ cat hot.c

    int main(void)
    {
    while(1) ;
    }
    -bash-3.00$

    32 Mar 14 2005 hot.c

    some years ago
  • zlayer 2012-07-19 07:25
    And if it is too hot, you can just change it.
    while (0.3) {}

    :P
  • KP 2012-07-19 15:00
    Be "Green" and full of irony.. Fire up a bunch of desktops to run BOINC ClimatePrediction project. Keep warm while crunching models of global climate change. :)
  • Jim 2012-07-22 20:46
    I actually worked in a cold room on a navy base in Hawaii once. I always left a sweater on the back of my chair. From time to time I forgot to take it off when I went out to lunch. Got some strange looks wearing my sweater around in the tropical sun ...
  • ^W 2012-08-28 00:07
    Jack:
    Where I work, ... I wear a heavy jacket, ski mask, and gloves...
  • DrDnar 2012-12-19 02:36
    It was a distributed heating process.
  • ccj 2013-02-27 13:35
    TRWTF 1: why use an empty infinite while loop? You could at least make it do something useful or, failing that, make it do some floating point arithmetic on multiple threads (preferably utilizing all CPU cores) and/or upload some complex processing to the GPU cores. Of course this 'solution' kind of requires that no one's machine is actually doing anything useful...
    TRWTF 2: quantum mechanics governs all things. The 'bigger' laws of physics inherit from quantum mechanics. The correct turn of phrase here would have been 'his office was governed ONLY by the laws of quantum mechanics'
  • true_Ouch_false 2013-06-20 09:29
    [quote]Aren't we in that universe which is famous for creating bigger idiots? [quote]

    Create smaller doorframes. Problem solved(tm)

    Capcha: delenit
    undelete autexec.bat
    REM some fucker keps DELenit