• (cs) in reply to operagost
    operagost:
    sjs:
    onomatopoeia:
    The Real WTF is DST! The rest of the world should follow Arizona's example (I guess there are a few other places that also don't change?) and just not do it!

    Honestly, I never understood how changing the time could be beneficial to anyone, including farmers.

    Clearly you don't live an area where DST is needed. Without DST it would get light at 10-11am here in the winter and dark at about 3-4pm. Screw that!

    Are you joking? I don't think the day's that short anywhere. And DST is for the SUMMER, not the winter!

    Ever heard of White Nights?? Some places up north ... veeeery north as in "I'm almost touching the arctic circle" have dismal differences on sunrise/sunset times. So, somewhere around the summer solstice, they get "white nights" .. that is, the sun doesn't set completely for some days ... i think its like a week.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Nights

    That said, DST or no DST, daylight will be the same times in winter, as yot is standard time. ;)

  • (cs) in reply to Anon
    Anon:
    akatherder:
    A lot of people have been burned by automating things. You can test and practice all you want, then 10 minutes before "go time" someone changes an IP address or renames a column or does SOMETHING stupid that they shouldn't have done. The best case scenario is that your script just fails. The worst case is that half of it completes, the other half does something destructive, and the third half breaks the space time continuum along with all known knowledge of fractions.

    We all prefer to automate things, but it's not without it's own risks.

    Um..that's why we have backups. You DO backup everything before running update scripts, right?

    Sure. You have to when you are dealing with a script that can wreak havoc on several components all in a single swoop.

  • someone anonymous (unregistered) in reply to [twisti]
    [twisti]:
    Oh, a minor correction, those office systems used NT4.0. I think the hospital had a ban on the 9x series or something of that sort. And one of my predecessors hid a copy of TIM (the incredible machine, a really old fun game) deep within the bowels of the Novell server, so it wasn't JUST minesweeper and freecell ;)
    Ah, that reminds me very much of being an undergraduate, except there it was Win3.1 and Novell that were used to hide The Incredible Machine away.

    CAPTCHA: pirates (how apt!)

  • Heinz Gorgon (unregistered) in reply to anne
    anne:
    who's the guy in that picture? he's kind of cute!

    Are you a nurse, by any chance?

    capthca: onomatopoeia. Boing!

  • (cs) in reply to Anon
    Anon:
    It was introduced during WWII so that people would start working an hour earlier, thus saving an hour of daylight in the evening for productive work. It's mostly useful for work outside, like construction or farming.

    Actually it was introduced in World War One by the Germans. Now the Germans had a lot of good ideas, did a lot of great science and also did an empirical study on a society run by pure evil. DST was obviously a trial for the latter.

    DST was not so musch invented by franklin, who suggested that parisians get up an hour earlier to save on candles. Willet made the case to the english, who absolutely refused. Of course, if Germany was going to do it, then they had to do it to.

    I never bother adjusting my clocks to DST. I merely adjust my schedule to fit what the rest of the world wants. The semi-viable argument that it keeps more of your waking day in sunlight, which makes it 'nicer' is really bs. This is because where I live, either most of the day falls in the hours when i am working (dark when I get up, dark when I go home) or else there is enough light to go round. Those two days a year where I might have some benefit are not worth the trouble.

  • Nick (unregistered) in reply to anne

    He's in an Irish boy band (westlife)

  • (cs) in reply to Licky Lindsay
    Licky Lindsay:
    I had to support an application on 1/1/2000 that at first appeared to have a Y2K bug. Then it turned out that it had been in production for less than a year, and that it would've had that bug on the first day of *any* new year, not just Y2K.

    Also, anybody else have applications that gave trouble on 9/9/01 when the number of seconds since the epoch went from 9 decimal digits to 10?

    That reminds me of an application that used an array element per day for something or another (not mine, don't remember exactly for what). An array of 365, you know, since there's only 365 days in a year.

    There was once an article in a programming mag about a kewl way to save space in programs and databases: store phone numbers in 32-bit ints, just flip the first two digits in the string representation, parse to an integer and there you go. That probably seemed like a good idea until they started handing out area codes with the middle digit greater than 1 shortly after that article came out. Not to mention that it only handled North American numbers in the first place because it didn't account for a country/region code.

  • lets_roll (unregistered) in reply to Drocket

    Time change is all a conspiracy by Television advertisers. Gotta sell stuff to the farmers also...so, gotta keep em watching "prime TIME".

    Tongue is firmly in cheek here.

  • Worf (unregistered)

    The problem is that for over 20 years, the start/end if DST has been fixed, and a lot of devices have that coded in. The 'mini-y2k' is more of mass-confusion than anything else. Devices will be an hour off, people can't log in, TV shows won't be recorded at the right time, etc. All very minor things, but added together can be very inconvenient.

    And the worst part is, people will update the time on their computers by changing the clock, rather than the timezone. End result is that the computer's view of UTC is skewed, which causes problems in itself. (Not a big deal, usually, except if you're writing files to fileservers and such which override the file times).

    Another effect are things like scheduled meetings. You have a meeting scheduled at 9AM March 12. Now, depending on internal time storage, it may move to 10AM automatically (if stored as UTC) or not... interesting effects have been observed for back-to-back meetings including meeting rooms that are now double-booked, meetings where people are double-booked, etc.

    The issue isn't y2k-potential devestation, it's more of a ton of minor inconveniences. Of course, the issue is that we "learned" from y2k since nothing happened, it's not worth investing the effort (basically, everyone worked hard so that nothing would happen - there are many tales of systems that would've disasterously failed had it not been actually fixed in time), and now DST patches are being rolled out last minute...

  • Hans (unregistered)

    The fact that you can make computers work for you is a thing best kept secret among software engineers.

  • JTK (unregistered) in reply to Dan
    Dan:
    jessica:
    So, the D stands for Daylight. Daylight is beneficial to everyone because they have to use less energy to create artificial light. Waking up an hour earlier and going to bed an hour earlier for part of the year means you save on candles/oil/whatever energy source.

    It's completely outdated now as we use artificial light during the day since we're not all farmers, but how can you not understand the concept?

    the key is to simply wake up and get to work an hour early and leave an hour earlier.

    Why revolve "time" (the only constant 'element' in the world) around our living patterns?

    Because with DST I can actually leave work on time and make it to my son's baseball games. Without DST, the game would start too early for me to get there on time.

    It's easier for the government to mandate a clock change than flex time....

  • too smart for my own good (unregistered)

    I'm stunned by the number of self-proclaimed IT professionals asking, basically, what's the big deal. Poke you head out of your little patch of sand and look around.

    1. A red-eye (long overnight flight for ESL impaired) flight takes off Saturday evening, scheduled to arrive Sun morning. Oops, the arrival time is an hour off, and meets a departing flight head-on. No big deal, really, as long as I or a loved one isn't on the plane...
    2. A company depends on a partner to deliver a biz critical feed by 9:00 am. It's not delivered until 10. Oops, the biz fails for at least a day. No big deal, really, as long as I don't work for that company or depend on them in any way...
    3. A financial company needs to execute trades on the stock market. They have until 4:30 ET time to execute the trades. Oops, trades not submitted on time, US markets crash, sending shockwaves thru markets around the world... No big deal, really, as long as my savings are safe in my mattress...

    Finally, I have to add - I love going on daylight savings. Granted it's an artifical boundary being arbitrarily shifted. In my case, my working hours are tied to the stock market being open. Daylight savings kicks in, I DO get an extra hour of daylight in the evening.

  • David Walker (unregistered)

    Let's all move one time zone to the East (or West) twice a year.

    Or once, permanently, and be done with it.

  • Rhialto (unregistered)

    Well, the problem does not occur on Unix systems, mainly on MSWindows systems, because MS thought they could make do with just one "DST start" rule and one "DST end" rule. I bet that that their "fix" messes up the start and end dates for all previous years, just like it did when they "fixed" the changed "summer time" rules in Europe (when we went from 6 to 7 months of "summer").

  • (cs) in reply to KattMan
    KattMan:
    akatherder:
    Here's a solution. Everyone switches to one time zone (GMT would suffice). Then it doesn't matter what the little numbers on the clock say. People in Michigan work from 10:00 to 19:00. People in Idaho work from 13:00 to 22:00. People in Egypt work from 2:00 to 11:00. Whatever it may be. The farmers can work from sunrise to sunset (plus or minus an hour). Sunrise and sunset change from day to day, but if it's light that matters to them then it is the perfect standard.

    It would take a while to get used to but it would solve so many problems.

    no No and NO! That would render the old song "Working 9 to 5" useless! We can't have that!

    Speak for yourself.

    Signed

    A. Brit

  • KevinB (unregistered) in reply to themagni

    As Dave Barry said, "You will never find anybody who can give you a clear and compelling reason why we observe daylight savings time."

    Oh, bullshit. I live in Toronto, Canada. Without DST, it gets light about 4:00 am in the morning, when everyone wants to sleep, and it gets dark about 8:00, when people want to be outdoors playing golf or softball or soccer.

    DST keeps it dark when most of us are asleep, and light when we want to do more activies after work.

  • DST is stupid (unregistered) in reply to sjs

    Clearly you don't live an area where DST is needed. Without DST it would get light at 10-11am here in the winter and dark at about 3-4pm. Screw that!

    DST have nothing to do with winter time. Winter uses standard time.

    DST is for people that insist on screwing with everyone else's time by adjusting the clock forward by 1 hour during the "summer" part of the year. BTW the biggest trading nation is China and they don't use stupid things like DST.

  • Franz Kafka (unregistered) in reply to too smart for my own good
    too smart for my own good:
    I'm stunned by the number of self-proclaimed IT professionals asking, basically, what's the big deal. Poke you head out of your little patch of sand and look around. 1) A red-eye (long overnight flight for ESL impaired) flight takes off Saturday evening, scheduled to arrive Sun morning. Oops, the arrival time is an hour off, and meets a departing flight head-on. No big deal, really, as long as I or a loved one isn't on the plane... 2) A company depends on a partner to deliver a biz critical feed by 9:00 am. It's not delivered until 10. Oops, the biz fails for at least a day. No big deal, really, as long as I don't work for that company or depend on them in any way... 3) A financial company needs to execute trades on the stock market. They have until 4:30 ET time to execute the trades. Oops, trades not submitted on time, US markets crash, sending shockwaves thru markets around the world... No big deal, really, as long as my savings are safe in my mattress...

    Finally, I have to add - I love going on daylight savings. Granted it's an artifical boundary being arbitrarily shifted. In my case, my working hours are tied to the stock market being open. Daylight savings kicks in, I DO get an extra hour of daylight in the evening.

    1. ATC doesn't let two airplanes occupy the same level and route going different directions, so at worst, this causes gate delays at the destination airport.

    2 and 3 are reasonable impacts, although I would expect stock traders to be a bit more on the ball, what with there being most of a day to figure things out.

  • Hognoxious (unregistered) in reply to Anon
    Anon:
    Nowadays I think it's just a boss's excuse to get employees to come in an hour earlier.
    Always try to compromise. Offer to leave early, and make it up by coming in late.
  • Brill (unregistered) in reply to ObiWayneKenobi

    ObiWayneKenobi, Use the force ...

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