• (cs)

    I have worked with Becky and her milk!

  • Anon (unregistered)
    article:
    This is 2014, and if we can put a man on Mars, then we can make a search smart enough to give the users what they want.

    The statement is not technically wrong... Vacuous truths and all that.

  • sulis (unregistered) in reply to Nagesh

    Eww

  • Kees (unregistered)

    I heard Google MRI was working on this

  • Ziplodocus (unregistered)

    Why have even a single search field? Why not just have the page return just the results you want to see? Elegant design AND you don't have to be a geeky type to work it.

    Maybe they'll give me a job...

  • Jay (unregistered)

    I've done searches kinda like that, it checks the format of what the user typed in and changes the lookup.

    So a 16-digit number does a credit card lookup, in the format X9999 looks up parts, plain text is names and so on.

    Not quite as telepathic as Becky wanted.

    It also had a dropdown list to select the specific search, but I guess that was too confusing. I'll go tell them to take it out.

  • John (unregistered)

    The problem is that to the user a simple look up is as deep a magic as a full text search.

    But TRWTF is that management can't be bothered to learn the difference and won't believe there is a difference when told so.

  • faoileag (unregistered) in reply to Anon
    Anon:
    article:
    This is 2014, and if we can put a man on Mars, then we can make a search smart enough to give the users what they want.

    The statement is not technically wrong... Vacuous truths and all that.

    Bah, Mars! We can put a man on Titan, Neptune, Pluto... oh, you wanted him to be alive? You should have said that earlier...

  • nobulate (unregistered)
    "This is 2014, and if we can put a man on Mars, then we can make a comment posting form smart enough to eliminate first posts!"
  • faoileag (unregistered) in reply to nobulate
    nobulate:
    "This is 2014, and if we can put a man on Mars, then we can make a comment posting form smart enough to eliminate frist posts!"
    Come on, there are days when the first comment is actually meaningful!
  • faoileag (unregistered)

    Actually, Becky is not too far off with her remark "This is 2014, and if we can put a man on Mars, then we can make a search smart enough to give the users what they want."

    Google does this, it's called "search engine bias".

    Don't waste your time explaining the concept, just simply tell her that for the time being, she will see all results mixed together, but that with every selection she makes from the search results the system will know her better.

    So she searches for Paris for the first time and sees: Paris, Daughter of Michael Jackson Paris, France. Paris, Texas,

    She clicks on "Paris, Texas" and the next time she searches for Paris she sees: Paris, Texas, Paris, France. Paris, Daughter of Michael Jackson

    System of ordering: Last selection first, then matches from the related category (placenames), then remaining matches.

    Actually, that would be a nice feature for that search form we have on our website... hmmm...

  • Old COBOL'er (unregistered)

    They're using the wrong language. Just switch to a language that has a DWIM* function.

    *DoWhatIMean

  • Kainsin (unregistered) in reply to Old COBOL'er

    #include <dowhatiwantnotwhatitype.h>

  • Ziplodocus (unregistered)

    The real WTF is they didn't use regex

  • QJo (unregistered)

    Brain the size of a planet and all she asks me to do is "return the Atlanta I meant".

  • (cs)

    "On two occasions I have been asked, — "Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?" In one case a member of the Upper, and in the other a member of the Lower, House put this question. I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question."

    • Charles Babbage
  • PB (unregistered) in reply to Old COBOL'er
    Old COBOL'er:
    They're using the wrong language. Just switch to a language that has a DWIM* function.

    *DoWhatIMean

    There are some undocumented opcodes in modern CPUs, they should do the work

    DMNS ; Do what i mean not what i say BBW ; branch both ways BOB; branch on bug RPM; read programmers mind

  • jrgrizz (unregistered) in reply to PB

    What do you mean, "modern" CPUs? I have documents from 30 years ago showing those opcodes for the IBM S/360!

  • (cs) in reply to PB
    PB:
    BBW ; branch both ways

    That one might be dependant on which sites you browse with that CPU.

  • faoileag (unregistered) in reply to jrgrizz
    jrgrizz:
    PB:
    There are some undocumented opcodes in modern CPUs
    What do you mean, "modern" CPUs? I have documents from 30 years ago showing those opcodes for the IBM S/360!
    In the context of the poster prior to PB quoting Charles Babbage, an IBM S/360 might be considered as a "modern" computer.
  • Hawk (unregistered) in reply to jrgrizz
    jrgrizz:
    What do you mean, "modern" CPUs? I have documents from 30 years ago showing those opcodes for the IBM S/360!

    Exactly. Modern

  • Alex (unregistered) in reply to Anon

    Sure, given billions of dollars and hundreds of the smartest programmers on Earth, nothing is impossible.

  • anon (unregistered) in reply to nobulate
    nobulate:
    "This is 2014, and if we can put a man on Mars, then we can make a comment posting form smart enough to eliminate first posts!"

    Well, they could just have it ignore any submitted comments as long as there are no comments already posted. Should fix it. Right?

  • jj (unregistered) in reply to Nagesh
    Nagesh:
    and her milk!
    ilk?
  • Anon (unregistered) in reply to jj
    jj:
    Nagesh:
    and her milk!
    ilk?

    They had a very personal relationship.

  • emaN ruoY (unregistered) in reply to nobulate
    nobulate:
    "This is 2014, and if we can put a man on Mars, then we can make a comment posting form smart enough to eliminate first posts!"
    Fark.com solved this one 14+ years ago. It timeshifts the comment to 3 days in the future so it appears last and replaces many combinations of frist to the plural form of a certain blue-footed seabird.
  • Herr Otto Flick (unregistered) in reply to Anon
    Anon:
    article:
    This is 2014, and if we can put a man on Mars, then we can make a search smart enough to give the users what they want.

    The statement is not technically wrong... Vacuous truths and all that.

    Quite. Rewrite it and you get this:

    if land-manned-lander --planet-mars then echo "we can make a search smart enough" fi

    I 100% agree with Becky

  • Russ (unregistered)

    Watson--it needs to incorporate Watson!

    Where Toronto is a US city.

  • Regex (unregistered) in reply to Ziplodocus

    They don't have to.

    They've got their own implementation which always matches exactly what you had in mind.

  • (cs) in reply to emaN ruoY

    Or, depending on the exact way you express your "first", Fark may replace your comment with a popular kind of sausage.

  • tuka (unregistered)

    I had a similar discussion with a woman. I told her some facts (like that a computer cannot know what she wants without telling him)

    Her answer: "This kind of considerations feels very insulting".

  • (cs)

    The Expert: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg

  • ¯\(°_o)/¯ I DUNNO LOL (unregistered) in reply to faoileag
    faoileag:
    Anon:
    article:
    This is 2014, and if we can put a man on Mars, then we can make a search smart enough to give the users what they want.
    The statement is not technically wrong... Vacuous truths and all that.
    Bah, Mars! We can put a man on Titan, Neptune, Pluto... oh, you wanted him to be alive? You should have said that earlier...
    EXCEPT EUROPA

    ATTEMPT NO LANDING THERE

  • faoileag (unregistered) in reply to Russ
    Russ:
    Watson--it needs to incorporate Watson!

    Where Toronto is a US city.

    Never heard of Toronto, OH? "Down by the banks of the O-Hi-o..."

    Reminds me of the footballer who declared "Milano or Madrid, don't care. I wanna play in Italy!"

  • Ninny (unregistered) in reply to faoileag

    Toronto is the centre of the universe

  • Yeah, but (unregistered) in reply to faoileag
    faoileag:
    Google does this, it's called "search engine bias".

    Don't waste your time explaining the concept, just simply tell her that for the time being, she will see all results mixed together, but that with every selection she makes from the search results the system will know her better.

    There are a few issues with this. Key among them, how much it can reveal about you when someone else Google's at your computer.

  • (cs) in reply to faoileag
    faoileag:
    Actually, that would be a nice feature for that search form we have on our website... hmmm...
    The hard part is automatically categorizing all the possible search results according to “what they're about”. This is all the stuff that the Semantic Web tries to enable, and it's vastly difficult to get right and efficient.
  • Jeremy (unregistered) in reply to faoileag
    faoileag:
    Actually, Becky is not too far off with her remark "This is 2014, and if we can put a man on Mars, then we can make a search smart enough to give the users what they want."

    Google does this, it's called "search engine bias".

    Don't waste your time explaining the concept, just simply tell her that for the time being, she will see all results mixed together, but that with every selection she makes from the search results the system will know her better.

    So she searches for Paris for the first time and sees: Paris, Daughter of Michael Jackson Paris, France. Paris, Texas,

    She clicks on "Paris, Texas" and the next time she searches for Paris she sees: Paris, Texas, Paris, France. Paris, Daughter of Michael Jackson

    System of ordering: Last selection first, then matches from the related category (placenames), then remaining matches.

    Actually, that would be a nice feature for that search form we have on our website... hmmm...

    First of all, I hate it when people/clients do this. "Well, google does it!" Yeah, we'll, google is a billion dollar a year company with an army of the world's best programmers, and have honed the most advanced searching algorithm on the planet. You paid us $3000 to make you a store.

    Secondly, she doesn't want it to "learn her" either. She wants "Atlanta" to return the city when she wants it to, and "Johnny Atlanta" when she wants it to. There is no reasonable "learning" that can meet that requirement, nor does (as another posted suggested) detecting certain formats (in this case city names) and promoting those.

  • faoileag (unregistered) in reply to Yeah, but
    Yeah:
    faoileag:
    Google does this, it's called "search engine bias".

    Don't waste your time explaining the concept, just simply tell her that for the time being, she will see all results mixed together, but that with every selection she makes from the search results the system will know her better.

    There are a few issues with this. Key among them, how much it can reveal about you when someone else Google's at your computer.
    I didn't say it was without.

    Another potentially negative aspect of SEB is that if you search for news, comments or op-eds on a given topic, what google will serve you most prominently is what matches your known opinions.

    Your chances of seeing material that gives you a different opnion on the topic, that might make you see the topic from a different angle, is thus reduced. So your opinions (as they are known to google) are more and more reinforced instead of constantly challenged.

    Then again, a lot of people prefer it that way.

  • Carl (unregistered)
    leader of the UI effort was Becky, the designer. Becky’s background was in graphic design for print
    ...and we're there! No need to read any further. Time to run for the weapons.
  • (cs) in reply to Ninny
    Ninny:
    Toronto is the centre of the universe
    For certain values of "the universe"
  • Adam (unregistered) in reply to Yeah, but
    Yeah:
    how much it can reveal about you when someone else Google's at your computer.
    You 'should think about 'switching to a modern computer, one that ha's thi's 'sophi'sticated concept called a u'ser ID. You can "log in" a's your'self, and "log out" when you are done. You get your own per'sonal 'space. No one el'se can muck with, or even 'see, your 'stuff, if you 'set the permi's'sion's correctly. 'Sometime's there''''''s a 'switch u'ser function that will let you lock your 'screen when you're away, yet 'someone el'se can 'still u'se it under their ID. It i's an amazing example of progre's's that really help's with all 'sort's of privacy con'sideration's.
  • John Goodwin (unregistered)

    It sounds crazy, but really, Becky isn't entirely wrong in the story.

    The truth is that information workers and software developers have to create new ways to reduce white noise, even if it increases effort.

    One way to do something similar to what Becky is talking about is to group results.

    Example:

    Locations for Atlanta (36) People for Atlanta (89) Organizations for Atlanta (14)

    Only show the ones that have matches. Let the user click/hover/tap/smack/swipe/flip-the-bird to expand.

    People like Becky can sound like they know what they want and what they are doing. It is part of the implementer's job to help that person figure it out. Sometimes you have to do the wrong thing cheaply to provide a springboard to find out exactly what users need and want. When shown a completely blank slate, such people don't know where to begin.

    In the case of the pre-packaged CRM, the typical answer to improvements/changes will be, "This is what it does." For any other inquiries, the economic benefits of buying prepackaged then highly customizing defeats the economic benefits, so the answers will generally be, "No it does not do that." This solves the problem from another angle. Whether that's a valid solution is for each organization to decide.

    John

  • Gina (unregistered) in reply to gramie
    gramie:
    Ninny:
    Toronto is the centre of the universe
    For certain values of "the universe"
    If the universe is infinite, isn't everywhere the center of the universe???
  • wtf (unregistered) in reply to Jeremy
    Jeremy:
    First of all, I hate it when people/clients do this. "Well, google does it!" Yeah, we'll, google is a billion dollar a year company with an army of the world's best programmers, and have honed the most advanced searching algorithm on the planet. You paid us $3000 to make you a store.

    I have to say this almost weekly to my project manager as well as clients, it is unbelievable. Sometimes they come back "oh so why are we paying you if you are not the best? And I say, cause your paying me 3 grand for a 2 week deadline. If you want the worlds best (and good luck getting them) be prepared to pay $500+ an hour, and expect it to take longer than 2 weeks. And if I am in a particularly bad mood I mad add, and if you only want the worlds best, then home come you are not a multi-billion dollar company/why aren't you bringing in multi-million dollars worth of sales?

    That usually gets them to shut up pretty quickly

  • (cs)

    Maybe the search box can't be psychic; but the "system" can be.

    I heard on NPR last week, of a unmarried teen girl who got a package from Target with samples/coupons for diapers, formula, etc -- two weeks before she told anyone she was pregnant.

    Turns out that by analyzing shopping patterns -- buying a larger purse, etc -- Target can make a pretty good guess at who might be pregnant.

    That's scary.

  • Valued Service (unregistered) in reply to Gina
    Gina:
    gramie:
    Ninny:
    Toronto is the centre of the universe
    For certain values of "the universe"
    If the universe is infinite, isn't everywhere the center of the universe???

    If I poured an infinite amount of water into a bowl with infinite dimensions, could you say there's no stream going in, because it cannot have a position.

    The center of the universe is where the expansion of the universe is evenly distributed in all directions.

    IMO is the universe infinite? No. It's only as big as its contents. The rest of the universe is irrelevant.

  • Gina (unregistered) in reply to Valued Service
    Valued Service:
    Gina:
    gramie:
    Ninny:
    Toronto is the centre of the universe
    For certain values of "the universe"
    If the universe is infinite, isn't everywhere the center of the universe???
    If I poured an infinite amount of water into a bowl with infinite dimensions, could you say there's no stream going in, because it cannot have a position.

    The center of the universe is where the expansion of the universe is evenly distributed in all directions.

    IMO is the universe infinite? No. It's only as big as its contents. The rest of the universe is irrelevant.

    If the universe is infinite, how can it be expanding???

  • Ziplodocus (unregistered) in reply to Gina
    Gina:
    Valued Service:
    Gina:
    gramie:
    Ninny:
    Toronto is the centre of the universe
    For certain values of "the universe"
    If the universe is infinite, isn't everywhere the center of the universe???
    If I poured an infinite amount of water into a bowl with infinite dimensions, could you say there's no stream going in, because it cannot have a position.

    The center of the universe is where the expansion of the universe is evenly distributed in all directions.

    IMO is the universe infinite? No. It's only as big as its contents. The rest of the universe is irrelevant.

    If the universe is infinite, how can it be expanding???
    Overlap?

    Captcha: ideo - Competition in which participants grab on to an idea and must not let go, no matter what.

  • Developer Dude (unregistered) in reply to Gina
    Gina:
    gramie:
    Ninny:
    Toronto is the centre of the universe
    For certain values of "the universe"
    If the universe is infinite, isn't everywhere the center of the universe???

    The universe is finite.

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