• David-T (unregistered)

    "With a few minutes of setup, all the errors, crashes, and performance issues will be identified for you,"

    Ahahahahahaahahahahahahahahahaha... Yeah, right.

  • Björn Tantau (unregistered)

    I like how Domino's and Coca Cola are listed before Microsoft and Unity.

  • Brian (unregistered)

    Users find bugs but develop work-a-rounds. That means I can keep working on other features they keep wanting.

    Use software to identify bugs, that users are not complaining about, so I can get them fixed. This means I cannot keep working on features they keep wanting.

    My users tell me, if they can find a work-a-round, to not worry about the bug because they have other things they want.

  • Rémy Grandin (google)

    "Our new sponsor, Raygun..."


    Annnnnnnd, the link is wrong :-) (raaygun instead of raygun)

  • Bryan E (unregistered) in reply to Rémy Grandin

    Only the first link is wrong; the others use "raygun".

  • Piotr Sulecki (google)

    Where's the joke?

  • Sole Purpose of Visit (unregistered)

    "But what if you could?"

    I don't recognise the reality of the premise. In fact, I don't think anybody at all who has ever once been anywhere near customer support (and this includes managers screaming at you because an "important client" screamed at them) would recognise the premise.

    But, OK, let's play along. Let's add another dashboard! Let's attach a virtual cattle-prod to the backside of developers! And while we're at it -- nipple clamps! Nipple clamps work! (Or at least, nipple clamps attract an interesting sub-set of developers.)

    But what if you could? I'll tell you what. In the first place, you'll be swamped by useless error reports, and you won't have time for the 5% that make sense. In the second place, you won't have time to track down the list of 400+ exception reports that are automatically delivered to you and which actually need attention, not to say negotiation with the ignorant moron "developer" in another silo who caused the exception report in the first place and won't admit that he's wrong, because he's French. And in the third place you'll have to deal with the traditional PHB boss who looks at the dashboards and freaks out because "We have a massive spike in reports registered as "Cannot Reproduce!* How can I explain this to Sales and Marketing!"

    This ain't going nowhere, nowise. Your sponsor is a waste of space.

    • Yes, that actually happened in my last job. Software supporting structural engineering, if you will, which actually makes it more frightening. The fact that two separate (qualified structural engineering) QAs and a software sheeple not related to the original code, not to mention that the vast preponderance of these "cannot reproduce" issues were two versions and several schemas back in the past was .... irrelevant.

    (And before you ask, yes, we [b}did[/b] test them against the exact version given on the ticket.)

  • Anonymous Automaton (unregistered)

    You might want to check the link in the sentence "Our new sponsor, Raygun, gives you a window into the real user-experience for your software"; It points to https://raaygun.com/ instead of https://raygun.com/

  • Martin (unregistered)

    How about at least mentioning which platforms are supported.

  • Stardust (unregistered)

    btw raygun is a slang for penis in the queer scene just so you know...

  • LCrawford (unregistered) in reply to Stardust

    That comment not held for moderation!

  • (nodebb) in reply to David-T

    You seem to be sceptic about it. But why? In the age of terabyte disks and petabyte clusters, there's absolutely no reason not to log everything that possibly could go wrong. Some web pages are told to log even every mouse movment (and every hover including its duration) to be analyzed by today's money press, the ad industry.

  • siciac (unregistered) in reply to P. Wolff

    In the age of terabyte disks and petabyte clusters, there's absolutely no reason not to log everything that possibly could go wrong.

    Must be nice living in a world where the only problem with logging is the total disk space of some speculative cluster.

    All the other issues remain, but fundamentally logging is a feature you're providing and the requirement "make it do all the things" is guaranteed to make that feature stupid, wrong and crashy.

  • Doug (unregistered)

    We use a competitor product, and it gives us real value.

    In its current incarnation, when an exception is thrown (whether visible to the user or not), it sends a crash log to our ticket system. (We had to configure a threshold for maximum number of logs to send per program run, after I ran an exe one day and didn't realize it was sending hundreds of crash logs behind the scenes.) We choose to anonymize the logs a bit, since they're sent without explicitly asking the user. That's good, but sometimes leads to the circumstance that we fix a user's bug, then don't know which user to tell to upgrade.

    In its previous incarnation it showed a polite dialog with a prominent "Send crash log" button. I have numerous screenshots from users who, instead of clicking the button that would send a detailed log, took a screenshot of the error dialog and sent us that instead. I started to get quite sarcastic in my reply emails.

  • Anonymous (unregistered)

    I quit ordering from Domino's Pizza after too many bad experiences. Albeit possibly not caused by software.

  • What? I'm not giving you my name. (unregistered)

    I feel so dumb now. I didn't get the WTF.

  • Quite (unregistered) in reply to Doug

    "(We had to configure a threshold for maximum number of logs to send per program run, after I ran an exe one day and didn't realize it was sending hundreds of crash logs behind the scenes.) "

    How very dare you send us all these crash logs? How very dare you encounter bugs in our program!

    TRWTF is development programmers who don't track down the cause of every single stack trace that occurs in the program they are developing, even if (especially if) they are "only warnings". I hold in particular contempt those lowlife bottom-feeding mouth-breathers who ignore an entire wallpapered-roomful of compilation warnings in their C.

  • 🤷 (unregistered) in reply to Stardust

    Anything is slang for "penis" in the queer scene. Even the word "anything".

  • bvs23bkv33 (unregistered)

    who is Reagan? Ronnie?

  • (nodebb) in reply to siciac

    Sorry, I still had https://thedailywtf.com/articles/archive-this in mind and then forgot about the inherent difficulties with the concept of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irony .

  • siciac (unregistered) in reply to P. Wolff

    Those difficulties with sarcasm really are inherent; you managed to closely match real arguments I've heard at various projects. Nothing you've said is implausible.

  • Kaewberg (unregistered) in reply to 🤷

    My anything is really large... Can your something take it? OK, that actually works.

  • Stardust (unregistered) in reply to 🤷

    yea... and not just in the queer scene actually

  • Anonymous (unregistered) in reply to P. Wolff

    Hahaha, holy fucking shit, I don't believe you. I work in a pretty large multinational. Getting approval for more than a ~100gb disk takes months.

  • Anonymous (unregistered) in reply to Quite

    Legacy codebase. 2 developers. 50,000 warnings. No one has time to deal with any of that shit, and management sure as hell isn't going to pay for it.

  • Anonymous (unregistered)

    Raygun's pricing didn't even make it past the laugh test with ANY level of management at my org. $1500/month for logging is batshit fucking insane

  • Zenith (unregistered) in reply to Anonymous

    You'd think so but I do code review for a system that costs $40K annually for terabytes of logging on gigabytes of data. Nobody did any resource planning whatsoever so every time the Indians run out of space they run to management for more rented disk space. The logs are practically useless because they don't contain error details so much as copies of the blocks of XML being pumped in and out of every stored procedure with seven different dates all spelled out in long form text. Plus copies of e-mails because they can't figure out how to use Exchange to send mail. Plus copies of PDF forms attached to the e-mails because reasons. When a ticket comes in, they still can't figure out what happened because it's like finding a microscopic needle in a mountain-size haystack.

    Yes, there are days that I just can't muster the strength to get out of bed.

  • (nodebb)

    The trouble with logging is that I can never remember to look at the logfile.

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