• aliceif (disco)

    But why do the stupid links break in the first place?!

  • VinDuv (disco)
    Comment held for moderation.
  • PJH (disco) in reply to VinDuv
    Comment held for moderation.
  • boomzilla (disco)

    "Culture of Success" sounds toxic. Toxic culture I tell ya'!

    Never get that around here.

  • chreng (disco)

    This somehow reminds me of recent links from DailyWTF to Discourse...

  • ka1axy (disco) in reply to VinDuv

    The links break because you use your corporate laptop away from the corporate network. Windows logs the fact that it found a broken link and the next time it runs Maintenance...away goes your shortcut.

    I had this happen to me just last month. Couldn't figure out why shortcuts were vanishing. Google provided the reason and the solution: disable the damn Windows Maintenance Process.

    Thanks, Microsoft, for being so helpful...by default...with no way to disable the "feature". I guess you never stopped to think that I might have put those shortcuts there because I wanted them there, and that maybe just once in a while, I would use a portable device on a different network.

  • Jaloopa (disco) in reply to ka1axy
    ka1axy:
    disable the damn Windows Maintenance Process.
    ka1axy:
    no way to disable the "feature"

    no way to disable it apart from disabling it?

  • ka1axy (disco) in reply to Jaloopa
    Jaloopa:
    ka1axy:
    no way to disable the "feature"

    no way to disable it apart from disabling it?

    Right. Too early for me.

    The disable is hidden behind a locked door, marked "Beware of Leopard!"

  • Jaloopa (disco) in reply to ka1axy

    The sensible way to deal with this would be to do some sort of desktop cleanup, possibly via a wizard, which could put the shortcuts in a separate folder instead of removing them entirely

  • Gaska (disco) in reply to Jaloopa
    Jaloopa:
    The sensible way to deal with this would be to do some sort of desktop cleanup, possibly via a wizard, which could put the shortcuts in a separate folder instead of removing them entirely
    I remember Windows XP doing this with half of my desktop every so often. Hated it.
  • Eldelshell (disco)

    local admin rights for all users

    Too bad the article doesn't mention the WTF riddled way a mega corporate has to go through before making that decision.

  • lightsoff (disco) in reply to Jaloopa
    Jaloopa:
    The sensible way to deal with this would be to do some sort of desktop cleanup, possibly via a wizard, which could put the shortcuts in a separate folder instead of removing them entirely
    No, the sensible way is to leave them alone until the user tries to use the link.

    If it's dead at the time of use, then offer to delete it.

    The user can then choose whether to kill it or to phone tech support and ask why the link to the central network database doesn't work from their hotel room in Kerblekistan.

  • Excelsior (disco) in reply to lightsoff

    You forget that users are stupid.

    Windows does offer to delete dead shortcuts when you click on them. And people are accepting it without knowing what the heck they are doing. Then, they are complaining their beloved shortcut has disappeared and they don't know how to create it again. (In fact, a user just called me for this exact reason at this very moment.)

    Ok, on second thought, they may not be stupid, but they simply does not care.

  • anonymous234 (disco) in reply to PJH

    What's the advantage vs just creating the topic when the article goes live?

  • accalia (disco) in reply to anonymous234
    anonymous234:
    What's the advantage vs just creating the topic when the article goes live?

    those of us that have the articles category watched can get in early and have fun in comments. much like in old site we could if we subscribed to the RSS

  • ka1axy (disco) in reply to Jaloopa
    Jaloopa:
    The sensible way to deal with this would be to do some sort of desktop cleanup, possibly via a wizard, ***disabled by default***, which could put the shortcuts in a separate folder instead of removing them entirely

    FTFY

    Microsoft either needs to hire some decent HFE/UI designers or fire the ones they have, because significantly changing the behavior and UI of an OS with every release, is like redesigning a tool...people expect it to work a certain way, and that behavior shouldn't be changed unlwithout a very good reason...

  • PJH (disco) in reply to anonymous234
    anonymous234:
    What's the advantage vs just creating the topic when the article goes live?

    I've absolutely no idea.

    Ask Alex? It's TDWTF code, not DC code.

  • Jaloopa (disco) in reply to ka1axy
    ka1axy:
    disabled by default

    No, just regularly ask the user if they want to run it. Every 60 days sounds like an acceptable time frame

  • CoyneTheDup (disco) in reply to boomzilla

    But wait until the full strength kool-aid arrives: Culture for success.

  • PleegWat (disco)

    Reminds me of a vaguely similar story when we were acquired.

    One of the major items on the 'forbidden software list' was the type of software we make. Common reaction on the workfloor - "Do you realize what you've bought?".

    On the upside, I've never seen that one enforced.

  • Medinoc (disco)

    We already have local admin rights because we're an IT shop playing with Visual Studio and ASP.Net websites, but we still had a similar WTF just a few days ago, when an admin published a Group Policy that set the UAC to "disabled" on all machines company-wide. Thanks to those local admin rights, I set it back to my usual setting ("paranoid") before we even got the company-wide e-mail telling us it was official.

    Too bad the GPO is still in effect and re-disables it every some time... I'll have to find a way to re-enable it programmatically in a scheduled task.

  • levesque (disco)

    Ryan and Woody were stumped as well, until, admitting defeat, they Googled the problem.

    What are these guys, rookies? In this day and age, isn't this pretty much the first thing to do when dealing with a problem you haven't seen before?

  • mruhlin (disco)

    So, the real WTF is that the big company allowed their users to have admin control over their own boxes, but the tiny startup was the one with the draconian policies?

  • Kuro (disco) in reply to ka1axy
    ka1axy:
    The disable is hidden behind a locked door, marked "Beware of Leopard!"

    Isn't that a Mac OSX version? Clearly using a mac to disable windows features is the way to go for a unified Operating System!

    Filed Under: Using Discourse to post things to Discourse also is a "great" way to post things to discourse

  • monkeyArms (disco)
    Comment held for moderation.
  • aliceif (disco) in reply to monkeyArms

    The Jeff™ way of doing things?

  • Jaloopa (disco) in reply to aliceif

    Don't be silly. Jeff doesn't remove broken things, just threads complaining about them

  • monkeyArms (disco) in reply to aliceif
    aliceif:
    The Jeff™ way of doing things?

    It's discoverable; just keep deleting shit until your shit works.

  • monkeyArms (disco) in reply to monkeyArms

    I think I see where this is going:

    Method 2: Disable the System Maintenance troubleshooter
    ... Method 3: Divide the number of desired shortcuts by 4, and round down to the nearest whole number. Purchase this number of computers. Place 4 shortcuts on each computer.

    Method 4: Turn off your computer. Do not attempt to turn back on.

    Method 5: Shoot yourself in the face.

  • vdeogmer (disco)

    I HATE the System Maintenance troubleshooter. I have to deal with this exact stupidity at least weekly. Who thought it was a good idea to check the icons before network connections even have a chance to be established? Bad Microsoft! No!

  • NYKevin (disco) in reply to Jaloopa
    Jaloopa:
    No, just regularly ask the user if they want to run it. Every 60 days sounds like an acceptable time frame

    Remember XP? "You have unused icons on your desktop."

  • PWolff (disco) in reply to lightsoff

    The only sensible way is the way I experience it being handled by Windows:

    If the link points to a not-yet-mounted net drive, search all hard drives, removable drives, etc. for a similarly-named file, and be so helpful to redirect the link to that file, without bothering the user with just another alert window.

  • PWolff (disco) in reply to NYKevin
    NYKevin:
    Remember XP? "You have unused icons on your desktop."

    Dropping file symbols on a link to a program isn't "use" of that link. Otherwise, the desktop cleanup wizard wouldn't ask regularly if that unused link should be deleted.

  • PWolff (disco) in reply to Eldelshell
    Eldelshell:
    Too bad the article doesn't mention the WTF riddled way a mega corporate has to go through before making that decision.

    The simplest and least riddled way would be, in the days of old, when Windows XP was shoved down the throat of the faithful Windows 98 users, most software wouldn't run without power user or admin privileges. So they decided for the only low-cost solution they could think of. And when they switched to Window 7, they simply continued ye olde policie.

  • redwizard (disco) in reply to VinDuv
    VinDuv:
    aliceif:
    But why do the stupid links break in the first place?!

    Because they are checked

    PaulaBean: before the network drives were mapped

    which is a bit surprising because you’d expect Windows to mount the network drives before running the shortcut cleaner... (Maybe they are mounted from a batch file which is started too late in the boot process)

    It's worse than that.

    We had that problem crop up shortly after deploying Win7 stations to one of our departments. Turns out they have a half dozen shortcuts that point to the network. Even changing them to UNC start paths didn't solve the problem, since the local admin account that did the automated cleanup didn't have rights on the domain network share and thus read the shortcuts as broken. Thank you Microsoft for being SO helpful!

    Solution? Drop all the network shortcuts into a folder on the desktop.

    They still complained that the extra double-click on that folder to access the shortcuts was a waste of their time and an inconvenience. :facepalm:

    ka1axy:
    Thanks, Microsoft, for being so helpful...by default...with no way to disable the "feature". I guess you never stopped to think that I might have put those shortcuts there because I wanted them there, and that maybe just once in a while, I would use a portable device on a different network.

    I'm actually surprised not to have this reported to us yet, as we've had remote mobile users running Win7 long before this department that ran into the problem got their machines.

  • FrostCat (disco) in reply to PWolff
    PWolff:
    when Windows XP was shoved down the throat of the faithful Windows 98 users

    Admit it--you're still bitter about the game-y looking jelly blue UI.

  • aliceif (disco) in reply to FrostCat

    The silver theme was pretty.

  • anotherusername (disco) in reply to VinDuv
    VinDuv:
    you’d expect Windows to mount the network drives before running the shortcut cleaner

    Okay, here's the real reason. The shortcut cleaner (henceforth, the shortcut destructinator) runs before any user logs in. Windows can't map network drives before a user logs in. Network drives are mapped when you log in, and each user can have their own network drives.

    vdeogmer:
    Who thought it was a good idea to check the icons before network connections even have a chance to be established?

    Indeed, that is the question. Which genius at Microsoft thought it would be a good idea to have the shortcut destructinator run before the users log in?

  • aliceif (disco)

    This might belong in the stupid ideas thread but ... Could you outsmart the tool by making the links on the desktop link to links in a not self-cleaning folder?

  • FrostCat (disco) in reply to anotherusername
    anotherusername:
    henceforth, the shortcut destructinator

    I believe if you use that suffix twice, as in "destructinatorinator" it works better.

  • anotherusername (disco) in reply to aliceif

    Nope. Windows won't create a shortcut to a shortcut; it'll create a shortcut to what the shortcut points to. It's actually halfway smart because moving, deleting, or renaming the first shortcut won't break the second one.

    What I think you can do is create internet shortcuts (.url) instead of normal shortcuts (.lnk). The simple way to do this is to create them using the New -> Shortcut wizard and then for the shortcut link, instead of \\initrode1\shared\ or I:\shared\, you'd type file://initrode1/shared/ or file://i:/shared/.

    Unfortunately, you'll get the default globe internet shortcut icon instead of the correct icon for what you're linking to, so you'll have to go to the Properties and change the icon if you want that to be correct.

  • JBert (disco) in reply to redwizard
    redwizard:
    They still complained that the extra double-click on that folder to access the shortcuts was a waste of their time and an inconvenience.
    Suggested hackaround: log-in script which copies the shortcuts to the desktop, or a shortcut in Startup which opens that folder in a new Explorer window.
  • Helix (disco)

    Sounds like windows is doing this the right way. Yes the desktop can have shortcuts, but shortcuts to network paths/resources do not belong here.

    What bastard admin puts shortcuts on the desktop? This means to get access to them i have to minimize all applications... or use the 'minimize all' button Microsoft had to implement because people put paths/folders on the desktop. Have the admins not found the start button yet? It's a handy menu that is always available at a click of a button and overlaid on top of applications only when you need it. Now, if only this start menu thing has a roaming profile?

  • redwizard (disco) in reply to Helix
    Helix:
    Sounds like windows is doing this the right way. Yes the desktop can have shortcuts, but shortcuts to network paths/resources do not belong here.

    What bastard admin puts shortcuts on the desktop? This means to get access to them i have to minimize all applications... or use the 'minimize all' button Microsoft had to implement because people put paths/folders on the desktop. Have the admins not found the start button yet? It's a handy menu that is always available at a click of a button and overlaid on top of applications only when you need it. Now, if only this start menu thing has a roaming profile?

    Sounds like you're claiming our users are Doing It Wrong™, which I consider a compliment to my users. ;-)

  • aliceif (disco) in reply to Helix

    Nobody forces users to use the - in your opinion awful - desktop shortcuts.

    Anyone who gives enough of a damn about having to minimize windows to reach those icons is probably someone who knows how to make shortcuts more convenient for themselves, for example by adding the folders to the explorer's jumplist.

  • another_sam (disco) in reply to boomzilla
    boomzilla:
    "Culture of Success" sounds toxic.

    What it really means is a culture where failure is not tolerated. Since failure happens anyway, it is hidden and success is feigned. Without failure, nothing is ever learned, nothing gets better and failures continue.

    It's Worse Than Failure.

  • redwizard (disco) in reply to aliceif
    aliceif:
    Nobody forces users to use the - in your opinion awful - desktop shortcuts.

    Anyone who gives enough of a damn about having to minimize windows to reach those icons is probably someone who knows how to make shortcuts more convenient for themselves, for example by adding the folders to the explorer's jumplist.

    Agreed.

    At least with Windows 7, it doesn't matter. You can have as many windows open as you want. Your desktop shortcuts are ONE CLICK away, on the task bar, here: [image]

    So why make the desktop conveniently accessible and then take away the conveniences you put there?

  • Helix (disco) in reply to aliceif
    aliceif:
    Nobody forces users to use the - in your opinion awful - desktop shortcuts.
    Implied in the article: "Eleven—make that twelve—users have reported that the shortcuts to the network databases have gone missing from their desktops" It says 'the' shortcuts, not 'my shortcuts'....
  • Helix (disco) in reply to redwizard
    redwizard:

    So why make the desktop conveniently accessible and then take away the conveniences you put there?

    But it's not convenient. If you 'minimize all' application windows to see the desktop, now open say a (shortcut to) .txt file on the desktop, it's not possible to 'restore all windows'. Where am i going to paste this text from the text file? I have to click open each app or do the whole 'hover over the icon and use aeropeek'

  • monkeyArms (disco) in reply to Helix
    Helix:
    But it's not convenient. If you 'minimize all' application windows to see the desktop, now open say a (shortcut to) .txt file on the desktop, it's not possible to 'restore all windows'. Where am i going to paste this text from the text file? I have to click open each app or do the whole 'hover over the icon and use a

    It's almost like MS built in multiple ways of performing tasks with the idea that different users might have different preferences on how they accomplish those tasks. Pffft, idiots.

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