The Daily WTF: Curious Perversions in Information Technology

2010-10-13 Reply Admin

pkmnfrk:
Why do people say "velocity" when they've only ever heard "speed", and don't know the difference between the two? Is it to sound smart?

Externalize self-referential magnificence! Maximize polysyllabic profunditude!

Similarly, the word "utilize" is completely unnecessary, because "use" can be substituted in every case. (Except when you're talking about the word "utilize", of course.)

Captcha: damnum -- also today's discussion topic!

lolwtf · 2010-10-13 Reply Admin

I want to say this guy originally wrote all the names, then changed them to numbers and forgot one... but that's just not stupid enough.

davee123:
George:
considering that the event module was written by a certain developer on our team

Not that guy again. I hate that guy.

TO DO: blackmail that guy/get him fired.

I have a plan for him this 12ember!

1ave2

FTFY.

2010-10-13 Reply Admin

@Deprecated:
TRWTF is writing the octal number '08'.

"Everbody;s favorite trivial change: 8 and 9 are not octal digits."

K&R 2, page 260.

So they were at one time!!

Jaime · 2010-10-13 Reply Admin

0 yeah:
pkmnfrk:
Why do people say "velocity" when they've only ever heard "speed", and don't know the difference between the two? Is it to sound smart?
Externalize self-referential magnificence! Maximize polysyllabic profunditude!
Similarly, the word "utilize" is completely unnecessary, because "use" can be substituted in every case. (Except when you're talking about the word "utilize", of course.)

Captcha: damnum -- also today's discussion topic!

A BA at work uses utilize constantly. A major part of my job involves getting his superflous words out of specification documents. Any time one manages to sneak by me, we end up with some sort of problem later in the project. It's like when building something out of a rigid material like steel, overconstraining dimensions leads to problems. For example, if you specifiy a triangle as the length of three sides, then it's buildable, usually even with poor toleances. If you specifiy all three lengths and all three angles, then you will end up with a bunch of pieces that need to be bent to meet the spec, unless you specified it perfectly and built it with very close tolerances.

BTW, the favorite superfluous IT word is "file". Messaging is a usually much better design pattern than file swapping, but the users love to read and write the word file. I've been forced to build a server application that FTPs to a client because of the way a spec has been written.

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

I can imagine why he'd write code like this:

1: Write buggy code. 2: Get paid to go back and fix it. 3: ... 4: ... December: Profit!

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Ah yes now here's a classic-style wtf that we can all get behind.

DateFormat() is the real answer to the problem, but what makes this truly wtf-ish is that the code in the article is a flawed version of the almost-worst-way to answer the problem.

(The absolute worst way to answer a problem always involves INTERCAL.)

Furry cows moo and decompress.

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Toster:
TheJasper:
hint 3: Octal 10 IS pronounced ten.

Is it? Well it could work this way till base 10, but what about after? How would you pronounce 1A?

The obvious answer is to go A-teen, then B-teen, C-teen, D-teen ...

... and so on till you get to twenty-A, twenty-B, ...

Only trouble with the A's is that they can get confused with 18, 28, etc.

So what you do is go twenty-alpha, twenty-bravo, twenty-charlie, etc.

Use whatever convention comes naturally. If grammar nazis and accuracy pedants complain, then leave them out of the conversation and ensure they are not included in whatever exciting projects for which you are about to assemble a team to embark upon.

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Allan Olesen:
In my opinion, the all to elaborate way to accomplish the zero-padding is not a WTF.
But having a function which at a short glance can be seen to return 1, 2, 3... 10, 11, December IS a WTF.

How can a mistake like that go unnoticed by the programmer who wrote it, unless he worked in a programming environment with less than 4 code lines visible on screen. ?

We still have to maintain code written for a VAX. Said code is run on an emulator nowadays (Charon, I believe). There is a small team that still has to go and work on such stuff, and despite my suggestion that the market for their skills is dwindling and perhaps they should consider upgrading their experience so as to include something more modern, they find themselves incapable.

What really highlights this attitude is that none of them have bothered to learn how, after 12 years of use, to configure their VAX terminal emulators so as to be able to display more than 24 lines of 80 characters on their screens.

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Not that I'm defending this stuff, but I have a theory: It used to be a human-readable value, with the switch statement turning 1 into "January" etc. Not ideal, perhaps, but quickly done and relatively painless.

Then it became a value to be inserted into a database, or otherwise handled automagically, and due to time constraints, the developer simply changed the switch statements. Due to those same time constraints he ooopsed the last one.

Still made me O.o, which qualifies it as a WTF for me.

TRWTF is people complaining about site content, and then coming back the next day to complain about the new site content, over and over again.

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

jdw:
D Larson:
Johnny Awkward:
And, you should have learned the definition of the word "of". But, I did like your use of "But" at the start of your sentence. It reminded me of "Finding Forrester".
It's more of an homage to the previous article's comments going on and on about grammar, starting a sentence with and/or/but, etc.
Starting sentences with conjunctions is generally accepted, these days, and only the staunchest prescriptionists will hold it against you.
Tsk, tsk.

Starting a sentence with "tsk" is a grammatical error.

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Anonymous:
causa:
Anonymous:
causa:
Here we go now:
Izhido:
Anonymous:
@Deprecated:
TRWTF is writing the octal number '08'. That must be one of those imaginary numbers, like eleventeen or thirty-twelve.
Why wasn't octal 6 afraid of 7? Because 7 10 11!

Somebody care to explain the joke to me?
Hint 1: read the joke out loud. Hint 2: Octal 10 is not pronounced "ten".

Apparently the poster doesn't understand the joke either. If he did, he would have said "was" instead of wasn't.

What a dumbass.
So that's why it never gets a laugh - nobody actually understands it!

The original joke is: "why was six afraid of seven - because seven ate nine".

The octal version is: "why wasn't octal six afraid of seven - because seven ten eleven".

Do you understand it now or should I talk even slower for you? Dumbass indeed, well said.
Translated Quote: I simply don't understand this joke.
So you don't understand, that's absolutely fine, but it doesn't change anything and it doesn't re-write the joke. I've explained it to you perfectly well, if you still don't get it then you're better off just forgetting about it. I knew it was a lousy joke but come on, this is ridiculous.

The joke may be poor, bu this exchange is the funniest thing I've read in ages. But haven't to explain to my colleagues why I was laughing out loud rather than working on unit tests was a little embarrassing...

method1 · 2010-10-14 Reply Admin

David:
Embedded Programmer:
On an embedded computer with no filesystem, this isn't so unusual.
Rubbish. On an embedded computer with no filesystem, you make sure small numbers like 12 are stored in 1 byte, and don't use text strings like 'December' unless you HAVE to.
And if you do, you convert digits to text by adding 30H

Whoosh!

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

anon:
Anonymous:
causa:
Anonymous:
causa:
Here we go now:
Izhido:
Anonymous:
@Deprecated:
TRWTF is writing the octal number '08'. That must be one of those imaginary numbers, like eleventeen or thirty-twelve.
Why wasn't octal 6 afraid of 7? Because 7 10 11!

Somebody care to explain the joke to me?
Hint 1: read the joke out loud. Hint 2: Octal 10 is not pronounced "ten".

Apparently the poster doesn't understand the joke either. If he did, he would have said "was" instead of wasn't.

What a dumbass.
So that's why it never gets a laugh - nobody actually understands it!

The original joke is: "why was six afraid of seven - because seven ate nine".

The octal version is: "why wasn't octal six afraid of seven - because seven ten eleven".

Do you understand it now or should I talk even slower for you? Dumbass indeed, well said.
Translated Quote: I simply don't understand this joke.
So you don't understand, that's absolutely fine, but it doesn't change anything and it doesn't re-write the joke. I've explained it to you perfectly well, if you still don't get it then you're better off just forgetting about it. I knew it was a lousy joke but come on, this is ridiculous.

The joke may be poor, bu this exchange is the funniest thing I've read in ages. But haven't to explain to my colleagues why I was laughing out loud rather than working on unit tests was a little embarrassing...

I just love the fact that people decided to nitpick that the joke was incorrect on the basis that Octal 10 is not pronounced "ten", and not, say, on the basis that numbers (or their representations in various bases) are abstract concepts and therefore incapable of experiencing human emotions.

But really, did anyone stop to consider that there might be TWO versions of this "joke"?

i) The written version where Octal 6 was afraid of 7 because 7 10 11 (a geeky in joke in its own right) ii) The spoken version where Octal 6 wasn't afraid of 7 because "seven ten eleven" (a subversion of the clbuttic "seven eight nine" joke)

Sure so the latter might not technically be correct, but for reasons that nitpicking that is retarded please see my earlier point above.

Now, as for whether either version is actually funny...

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

causa:
Here we go now:
Izhido:
Anonymous:
@Deprecated:
TRWTF is writing the octal number '08'. That must be one of those imaginary numbers, like eleventeen or thirty-twelve.
Why wasn't octal 6 afraid of 7? Because 7 10 11!

Somebody care to explain the joke to me?
Hint 1: read the joke out loud. Hint 2: Octal 10 is not pronounced "ten".

Apparently the poster doesn't understand the joke either. If he did, he would have said "was" instead of wasn't.

What a dumbass.

In decimal, 6 IS afraid of 7 because 7 8 9 (seven ate nine). In octal, 6 IS NOT afraid of 7 becuase 7 10 11.

Dumbass.

WthyrBendragon · 2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Johnny Awkward:
D Larson:
Bert Glanstron:
Your and idiot and should be band from using your mommy and daddy's modem.

But, you should of learned by now the definition of the word "and."

And, you should have learned the definition of the word "of". But, I did like your use of "But" at the start of your sentence. It reminded me of "Finding Forrester".

Finally, if you guys are going to comment in English you should learn the language first...

you should be BANNED (not "band") from using ...
you should HAVE (not "of") learned ...

And, yes, I am the PGP (pedantic grammar police)!

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

[quote user="0 yeah"][quote user="pkmnfrk"]Why do people say "velocity" when they've only ever heard "speed", and don't know the difference between the two? Is it to sound smart?[/quote]Externalize self-referential magnificence! Maximize polysyllabic profunditude!

Similarly, the word "utilize" is completely unnecessary, because "use" can be substituted in every case. (Except when you're talking about the word "utilize", of course.)

And "to architect" is also always wrong, since an architect designs things. No need to invent a new word.

"Experience" (as noun or verb) is often used wrongly as well. "The user experiences a crash" is nonsense. There is a crash, and if the user takes notice of it or not is irrelevant.

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Jaime:
0 yeah:
pkmnfrk:
Why do people say "velocity" when they've only ever heard "speed", and don't know the difference between the two? Is it to sound smart?
Externalize self-referential magnificence! Maximize polysyllabic profunditude!
Similarly, the word "utilize" is completely unnecessary, because "use" can be substituted in every case. (Except when you're talking about the word "utilize", of course.)

Captcha: damnum -- also today's discussion topic!
A BA at work uses utilize constantly. A major part of my job involves getting his superflous words out of specification documents. Any time one manages to sneak by me, we end up with some sort of problem later in the project. It's like when building something out of a rigid material like steel, overconstraining dimensions leads to problems. For example, if you specifiy a triangle as the length of three sides, then it's buildable, usually even with poor toleances. If you specifiy all three lengths and all three angles, then you will end up with a bunch of pieces that need to be bent to meet the spec, unless you specified it perfectly and built it with very close tolerances.

BTW, the favorite superfluous IT word is "file". Messaging is a usually much better design pattern than file swapping, but the users love to read and write the word file. I've been forced to build a server application that FTPs to a client because of the way a spec has been written.

Have you ever been called a "moron?"

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

CapCity:
causa:
Here we go now:
Izhido:
Anonymous:
@Deprecated:
TRWTF is writing the octal number '08'. That must be one of those imaginary numbers, like eleventeen or thirty-twelve.
Why wasn't octal 6 afraid of 7? Because 7 10 11!

Somebody care to explain the joke to me?
Hint 1: read the joke out loud. Hint 2: Octal 10 is not pronounced "ten".

Apparently the poster doesn't understand the joke either. If he did, he would have said "was" instead of wasn't.

What a dumbass.

In decimal, 6 IS afraid of 7 because 7 8 9 (seven ate nine). In octal, 6 IS afraid of 7 becuase it's still 7 10 11 (seven ate nine).

FTFYYF Retard

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

causa:
CapCity:
causa:
Here we go now:
Izhido:
Anonymous:
@Deprecated:
TRWTF is writing the octal number '08'. That must be one of those imaginary numbers, like eleventeen or thirty-twelve.
Why wasn't octal 6 afraid of 7? Because 7 10 11!

Somebody care to explain the joke to me?
Hint 1: read the joke out loud. Hint 2: Octal 10 is not pronounced "ten".

Apparently the poster doesn't understand the joke either. If he did, he would have said "was" instead of wasn't.

What a dumbass.

In decimal, 6 IS afraid of 7 because 7 8 9 (seven ate nine). In octal, 6 IS NOT afraid of 7 becuase 7 10 11.

Dumbass.
<causa dribbles a bit, looks confused>

Just give it up you simpering idiot, either you're too stupid to understand this joke or you're too stubborn to admit you do. Either way we just don't care anymore.

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Anonymous:
causa:
CapCity:
causa:
Here we go now:
Izhido:
Anonymous:
@Deprecated:
TRWTF is writing the octal number '08'. That must be one of those imaginary numbers, like eleventeen or thirty-twelve.
Why wasn't octal 6 afraid of 7? Because 7 10 11!

Somebody care to explain the joke to me?
Hint 1: read the joke out loud. Hint 2: Octal 10 is not pronounced "ten".

Apparently the poster doesn't understand the joke either. If he did, he would have said "was" instead of wasn't.

What a dumbass.

In decimal, 6 IS afraid of 7 because 7 8 9 (seven ate nine). In octal, 6 IS STILL afraid of 7 becuase 7 10 11 seven ate nine.

Dumbass.
FTFYYF Retard
Just give it up you simpering idiot, either I'm too stupid to understand octal or I'm too stubborn to admit I told the joke wrong.

FTFY, once again.

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Anonymous:
Just give it up you simpering idiot, either you're too stupid to understand this joke or you're too stubborn to admit you do. Either way we just don't care anymore.

So, stop feeding.

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Ouch!:
Anonymous:
Just give it up you simpering idiot, either you're too stupid to understand this joke or you're too stubborn to admit you do. Either way we just don't care anymore.
So, stop feeding.

You're right, I'm taking that advice.

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Anonymous:
Ouch!:
Anonymous:
Just give it up you simpering idiot, either you're too stupid to understand this joke or you're too stubborn to admit you do. Either way we just don't care anymore.
So, stop feeding.
You're right, I'm taking that advice.

I've got a better idea: admit that you don't know as much about numbers as you think you do.

NSCoder · 2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Anonymous:
Everyone:
Anonymous:
@Deprecated:
TRWTF is writing the octal number '08'. That must be one of those imaginary numbers, like eleventeen or thirty-twelve.
Why wasn't octal 6 afraid of 7? Because 7 10 11!
[Stony silence]
Yep, that's exactly the same response this joke gets IRL. I once got a chuckle of out of a Math major, but I think it was out of pity.

I'm a maths major, and I chuckled when I read that, so now you can say you twice got a chuckle out of a math(s) major.

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

causa:
Anonymous:
Ouch!:
Anonymous:
Just give it up you simpering idiot, either you're too stupid to understand this joke or you're too stubborn to admit you do. Either way we just don't care anymore.
So, stop feeding.
You're right, I'm taking that advice.
I've got a better idea: admit that you don't know as much about numbers as you think you do.

Dear causa and Anonymous,

In case you can’t tell, this is a grown-up place. The fact that you insist on arguing about what's funny clearly shows that you’re too young and too stupid to be using humor.

Go away and grow up.

Sincerely, Bert Glanstron

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

You have no idea what you're talking about:
Jaime:
0 yeah:
pkmnfrk:
Why do people say "velocity" when they've only ever heard "speed", and don't know the difference between the two? Is it to sound smart?
Externalize self-referential magnificence! Maximize polysyllabic profunditude!
Similarly, the word "utilize" is completely unnecessary, because "use" can be substituted in every case. (Except when you're talking about the word "utilize", of course.)

Captcha: damnum -- also today's discussion topic!
A BA at work uses utilize constantly. A major part of my job involves getting his superflous words out of specification documents. Any time one manages to sneak by me, we end up with some sort of problem later in the project. It's like when building something out of a rigid material like steel, overconstraining dimensions leads to problems. For example, if you specifiy a triangle as the length of three sides, then it's buildable, usually even with poor toleances. If you specifiy all three lengths and all three angles, then you will end up with a bunch of pieces that need to be bent to meet the spec, unless you specified it perfectly and built it with very close tolerances.

BTW, the favorite superfluous IT word is "file". Messaging is a usually much better design pattern than file swapping, but the users love to read and write the word file. I've been forced to build a server application that FTPs to a client because of the way a spec has been written.
Have you ever been called a "moron?"

Yes, plenty of times by lots of the regulars here. Unfortunately it never seems to make any difference to the quality or quantity of his posts. He's also our resident Muphry, he loves to correct people but routinely gets it wrong.

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

NSCoder:
Anonymous:
Everyone:
Anonymous:
@Deprecated:
TRWTF is writing the octal number '08'. That must be one of those imaginary numbers, like eleventeen or thirty-twelve.
Why wasn't octal 6 afraid of 7? Because 7 10 11!
[Stony silence]
Yep, that's exactly the same response this joke gets IRL. I once got a chuckle of out of a Math major, but I think it was out of pity.
I'm a maths major, and I chuckled when I read that, so now you can say you twice got a chuckle out of a math(s) major.

Thanks, remind me to buy you a drink next time you're in town!

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Anonymous:
NSCoder:
Anonymous:
Everyone:
Anonymous:
@Deprecated:
TRWTF is writing the octal number '08'. That must be one of those imaginary numbers, like eleventeen or thirty-twelve.
Why wasn't octal 6 afraid of 7? Because 7 10 11!
[Stony silence]
Yep, that's exactly the same response this joke gets IRL. I once got a chuckle of out of a Math major, but I think it was out of pity.
I'm a maths major, and I chuckled when I read that, so now you can say you twice got a chuckle out of a math(s) major.
Thanks, remind me to **** your **** next time you're in town!

FTFY

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

TRWTF is that this site should be call The semi-daily WTF. Am I right?

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Anon:
TRWTF is that this site should be call The semi-daily WTF. Am I right?

And TRTRWTF is the second I post that, they put up today's WTF. D'oh.

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Matt Westwood:
Anonymous:
NSCoder:
Anonymous:
Everyone:
Anonymous:
@Deprecated:
TRWTF is writing the octal number '08'. That must be one of those imaginary numbers, like eleventeen or thirty-twelve.
Why wasn't octal 6 afraid of 7? Because 7 10 11!
[Stony silence]
Yep, that's exactly the same response this joke gets IRL. I once got a chuckle of out of a Math major, but I think it was out of pity.
I'm a maths major, and I chuckled when I read that, so now you can say you twice got a chuckle out of a math(s) major.
Thanks, remind me to **** your **** next time you're in town!
FTFY

For Christ's sake Westwood, you don't have to turn everything into a tacit suggestion of oral sex. We all know you're a big fan of the cock but please keep those sorts of thoughts in your own sick mind.

Jaime · 2010-10-14 Reply Admin

anon:
You have no idea what you're talking about:
Jaime:
0 yeah:
pkmnfrk:
Why do people say "velocity" when they've only ever heard "speed", and don't know the difference between the two? Is it to sound smart?
Externalize self-referential magnificence! Maximize polysyllabic profunditude!
Similarly, the word "utilize" is completely unnecessary, because "use" can be substituted in every case. (Except when you're talking about the word "utilize", of course.)

Captcha: damnum -- also today's discussion topic!
A BA at work uses utilize constantly. A major part of my job involves getting his superflous words out of specification documents. Any time one manages to sneak by me, we end up with some sort of problem later in the project. It's like when building something out of a rigid material like steel, overconstraining dimensions leads to problems. For example, if you specifiy a triangle as the length of three sides, then it's buildable, usually even with poor toleances. If you specifiy all three lengths and all three angles, then you will end up with a bunch of pieces that need to be bent to meet the spec, unless you specified it perfectly and built it with very close tolerances.

BTW, the favorite superfluous IT word is "file". Messaging is a usually much better design pattern than file swapping, but the users love to read and write the word file. I've been forced to build a server application that FTPs to a client because of the way a spec has been written.
Have you ever been called a "moron?"
Yes, plenty of times by lots of the regulars here. Unfortunately it never seems to make any difference to the quality or quantity of his posts. He's also our resident Muphry, he loves to correct people but routinely gets it wrong.

If by regulars, you mean "unregistered users posting under some form of the name anonymous", then yes. By most other people, I am generally seen as really good at what I do and someone to come to for advice.

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Jaime:
...I am generally seen as really good at what I do and someone to come to for advice.

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!! Stop, my sides, you're killing me!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sorry, I was going to post a sensible reply but I just can't stop laughing!!!!! Maybe you could give me some of that famous advice - do you use sanitary towels or tampons? LMFAO!!!

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Matt Westwood:
Anonymous:
NSCoder:
Anonymous:
Everyone:
Anonymous:
@Deprecated:
TRWTF is writing the octal number '08'. That must be one of those imaginary numbers, like eleventeen or thirty-twelve.
Why wasn't octal 6 afraid of 7? Because 7 10 11!
[Stony silence]
Yep, that's exactly the same response this joke gets IRL. I once got a chuckle of out of a Math major, but I think it was out of pity.
I'm a maths major, and I chuckled when I read that, so now you can say you twice got a chuckle out of a math(s) major.
Thanks, remind me to **** your **** next time you're in town!
FTFY

I have ****'d your ****. Pray I don't **** it any further.

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Darth ****:
Matt Westwood:
Anonymous:
NSCoder:
Anonymous:
Everyone:
Anonymous:
@Deprecated:
TRWTF is writing the octal number '08'. That must be one of those imaginary numbers, like eleventeen or thirty-twelve.
Why wasn't octal 6 afraid of 7? Because 7 10 11!
[Stony silence]
Yep, that's exactly the same response this joke gets IRL. I once got a chuckle of out of a Math major, but I think it was out of pity.
I'm a maths major, and I chuckled when I read that, so now you can say you twice got a chuckle out of a math(s) major.
Thanks, remind me to **** your **** next time you're in town!
FTFY

I have ****'d your ****. Pray I don't **** it any further.

Sorry, but we've moved on. You don't have a chance to start that again.

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Can you write a Coldfusion application, utilize ORM, create and instantiate custom java objects that parse annotations on 7 versions of Adobe PDF flawlessly and run it all within 357milliseconds? Then maybe you aren't a real developer...

frits · 2010-10-14 Reply Admin

codeGorilla[z]:
Can you write a Coldfusion application, utilize ORM, create and instantiate custom java objects that parse annotations on 7 versions of Adobe PDF flawlessly and run it all within 357milliseconds? Then maybe you aren't a real developer...

No, I would charge at least six months for that.

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

causa:
Sorry. Both of you are just number fail. Expressing a number in some other base does not make it a different number. That at least should be obvious. If I wrote "ten, base 8", it would be "12" which would still be "ten". It is absurdly simple to perceive that when you get to the number past nine (base 10), there is nothing to correlate the name of that number to the digits representing it. Heck, "ten" is a shorter word than "nine." Look, I know you guys aren't native English speakers and have a limp-wristed grasp of the English language, so here it is in a table. Goddamn you, askimet!

You're saying that because changing the base doesn't change the logical value of a number, that therefore we must logically and inevitably pronounce it the same? When you see "0x10", you pronounce this "sixteen", and anyone who doesn't is a mathemetical illiterate? That fails on both logical and practical grounds.

Logically, I can only reply, Who says? The fact that a mathematical concept is universally constant hardly proves that all people everywhere at all times must pronounce it the same. Decimal "4" means this many "IIII". But to say that therefore French people and Germans must pronounce it "four" or they are mathematical illiterates just doesn't follow.

Practically: Quick, how do you pronounce this hexadecimal number: 2B4A. My answer is "two bee four ay". Do you honestly convert that to decimal in your head before pronouncing it?

When I am working in hex, I pronounce 10 as "ten", not "sixteen". I prounce A as "ay", not "ten".

Logically: Who says?

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

0 yeah:
causa:
Expressing a number in some other base does not make it a different number. That at least should be obvious. If I wrote "ten, base 8", it would be "12" which would still be "ten".
At last, someone who gets it. "Ten" is a quantity, an integer that is bigger than "nine" and smaller than "eleven". You can represent "ten" an infinite number of ways. You can write "one zero" in situations where the base is assumed to be ten. You can write "T E N" or "five plus five" or "octal 12" or "the square root of one hundred" -- however you express it you're still talking about "ten" and the number (or solution to the calculation, if a calculation is used) is still pronounced "ten".
So, "012" (in languages where a leading zero means octal) is pronounced "ten".

So how do you pronounce "0243716" ?

2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Jaime:
0 yeah:
pkmnfrk:
Why do people say "velocity" when they've only ever heard "speed", and don't know the difference between the two? Is it to sound smart?
Externalize self-referential magnificence! Maximize polysyllabic profunditude!
Similarly, the word "utilize" is completely unnecessary, because "use" can be substituted in every case. (Except when you're talking about the word "utilize", of course.)

Captcha: damnum -- also today's discussion topic!
A BA at work uses utilize constantly. A major part of my job involves getting his superflous words out of specification documents. Any time one manages to sneak by me, we end up with some sort of problem later in the project. It's like when building something out of a rigid material like steel, overconstraining dimensions leads to problems. For example, if you specifiy a triangle as the length of three sides, then it's buildable, usually even with poor toleances. If you specifiy all three lengths and all three angles, then you will end up with a bunch of pieces that need to be bent to meet the spec, unless you specified it perfectly and built it with very close tolerances.

BTW, the favorite superfluous IT word is "file". Messaging is a usually much better design pattern than file swapping, but the users love to read and write the word file. I've been forced to build a server application that FTPs to a client because of the way a spec has been written.

I have fond memories of the time I wrote up a users guide for some piece of software my team had developed, and then we had to send it off to corporate headquarters for editing, and among their valuable changes were:

Changing all occurences of the word "use" to "utilize".
Where I had written "to effect a change" meaning "to cause a change", and they changed this to "to affect a change", which made no sense at all as the whole point was to make the change happen, not to change an existing change. (I'll concede, "to create a change" or "to cause a change" might have been better, given that apparently many people do not know what the verb "effect" means.)

Jaime · 2010-10-14 Reply Admin

You have no idea what you're talking about:
Jaime:
0 yeah:
pkmnfrk:
Why do people say "velocity" when they've only ever heard "speed", and don't know the difference between the two? Is it to sound smart?
Externalize self-referential magnificence! Maximize polysyllabic profunditude!
Similarly, the word "utilize" is completely unnecessary, because "use" can be substituted in every case. (Except when you're talking about the word "utilize", of course.)

Captcha: damnum -- also today's discussion topic!
A BA at work uses utilize constantly. A major part of my job involves getting his superflous words out of specification documents. Any time one manages to sneak by me, we end up with some sort of problem later in the project. It's like when building something out of a rigid material like steel, overconstraining dimensions leads to problems. For example, if you specifiy a triangle as the length of three sides, then it's buildable, usually even with poor toleances. If you specifiy all three lengths and all three angles, then you will end up with a bunch of pieces that need to be bent to meet the spec, unless you specified it perfectly and built it with very close tolerances.

BTW, the favorite superfluous IT word is "file". Messaging is a usually much better design pattern than file swapping, but the users love to read and write the word file. I've been forced to build a server application that FTPs to a client because of the way a spec has been written.
Have you ever been called a "moron?"

Just three hours after you posted this, we discovered a disaster in one of our vendor's deliverables. We got to the root of the disaster -- someone on our end made a last minute alteration to the spec before sending it to the vendor, they added some "additional clarification" that was absolutely unneccessary, but it was worded in such a way that the vendor got the wrong idea and delivered a module that totally blew up. Turns out that this clarification abused the word "file" when what was really meant was "report template". Sure, report templates are often stored in files, but in this case the system includes both report templates and files, and they are two very different things. So, not only am I not a moron, but one event that shows that both of my points are real happened today. If that person had simply left well enough alone, everything would have gone well. If I had reviewed the document and removed the unneccessary bits, everything would have been fine.

Earlier this week, I was reviewing a credit card processing solution I had just finished with the Financial IT person. She asked "who releases the nightly settlement batch file". I responded "This solution is entirely message based, we send a message to a web service endpoint hosted by the credit card processing company to open a batch, then we send a series of messages to add transactions to the batch, and finally we send a message to process the batch". She responded with "but where is the file?" It took about ten minutes to finally convince her that no file ever exists in the settlement process. She was completely befuddled by the concept that companies could exchange information using any mechanism other than files.

Maurits · 2010-10-14 Reply Admin

Jay:
0 yeah:
causa:
Expressing a number in some other base does not make it a different number. That at least should be obvious. If I wrote "ten, base 8", it would be "12" which would still be "ten".
At last, someone who gets it. "Ten" is a quantity, an integer that is bigger than "nine" and smaller than "eleven". You can represent "ten" an infinite number of ways. You can write "one zero" in situations where the base is assumed to be ten. You can write "T E N" or "five plus five" or "octal 12" or "the square root of one hundred" -- however you express it you're still talking about "ten" and the number (or solution to the calculation, if a calculation is used) is still pronounced "ten".
So, "012" (in languages where a leading zero means octal) is pronounced "ten".

So how do you pronounce "0243716" ?

Maurits: Octal two hundred forty-three thousand, seven hundred sixteen.

0 yeah: Eighty-three thousand, nine hundred eighteen.

C4I_Officer · 2010-10-15 Reply Admin

Embedded Programmer:
On an embedded computer with no filesystem, this isn't so unusual.

On the opposite, I hoped for someone to say "This is DEFINITIVELY something not possible on an embedded system with no filesystem" :-p

2010-10-15 Reply Admin

Jay:
0 yeah:
causa:
Expressing a number in some other base does not make it a different number. That at least should be obvious. If I wrote "ten, base 8", it would be "12" which would still be "ten".
At last, someone who gets it. "Ten" is a quantity, an integer that is bigger than "nine" and smaller than "eleven". You can represent "ten" an infinite number of ways. You can write "one zero" in situations where the base is assumed to be ten. You can write "T E N" or "five plus five" or "octal 12" or "the square root of one hundred" -- however you express it you're still talking about "ten" and the number (or solution to the calculation, if a calculation is used) is still pronounced "ten".
So, "012" (in languages where a leading zero means octal) is pronounced "ten".

So how do you pronounce "0243716" ?

I don't know, but I actually give my phone number as "four hundred and forty-seven billion, nine hundred and thirty-four million, eighty-two thousand, four hundred and twenty-three", because... you know... you've always got to pronounce any string of digits as the number they represent. I don't know why people have such an issue with it.

2010-10-15 Reply Admin

JuanCarlosII:
Jay:
0 yeah:
causa:
Expressing a number in some other base does not make it a different number. That at least should be obvious. If I wrote "ten, base 8", it would be "12" which would still be "ten".
At last, someone who gets it. "Ten" is a quantity, an integer that is bigger than "nine" and smaller than "eleven". You can represent "ten" an infinite number of ways. You can write "one zero" in situations where the base is assumed to be ten. You can write "T E N" or "five plus five" or "octal 12" or "the square root of one hundred" -- however you express it you're still talking about "ten" and the number (or solution to the calculation, if a calculation is used) is still pronounced "ten".
So, "012" (in languages where a leading zero means octal) is pronounced "ten".

So how do you pronounce "0243716" ?

I don't know, but I actually give my phone number as "four hundred and forty-seven billion, nine hundred and thirty-four million, eighty-two thousand, four hundred and twenty-three", because... you know... you've always got to pronounce any string of digits as the number they represent. I don't know why people have such an issue with it.

I completely agree. We should discuss it over a drink, are you free at two thousand one hundred and thirty 'o clock?

C4I_Officer · 2010-10-15 Reply Admin

That's too hard to remember!!!oneoneone111eleventy!11!!oneone

2010-10-15 Reply Admin

Zapp Brannigan:
Most programmers, never got dates in high school and college. Now that they're working in the real world many of them still don't get dates.

You Sir, made my day.

Cold Date Conversion

(The absolute worst way to answer a problem always involves INTERCAL.)

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