• Christopher (unregistered)

    TRWTF™ is that Jon got fired, instead of being promoted to upper management.

  • David (unregistered)

    Every company thinks their new employees have to "hit the ground running, working on day one," even though those listings stay open for six months or more. Time enough that if they'd hired and trained someone, they would have a competent team member now instead of nothing but wishful thinking. I'm not saying it's never necessary, but since most every company does it, when one actually needs someone like that they're even less likely to find them.

  • The Masked Director of Development (unregistered)

    Don't all companies hire that way!?

  • FredSaw (cs)

    Yes, I have worked under management like this. Thankfully they were scoured away during a cleansing purge a couple of years back, and current management is both competent and good-intentioned.

  • The Masked Director of Development (unregistered) in reply to David

    That's a perceptive comment. Your way of doing things is precisely how it should be done.

    A programmer's precise skill set is 25% of their value. Their ability to learn and adapt is 75% of their value.

  • Dave (unregistered)

    Well, at least it had a happy ending.

  • clively (cs) in reply to Christopher
    Christopher:
    TRWTF™ is that Jon got fired, instead of being promoted to upper management.
    Apparently Jon couldn't spin things well enough to the guy that hired him; otherwise he would have landed in upper management to begin with.
  • ObiWayneKenobi (cs)

    Isn't this standard operating procedure? Hire a well-dressed bullshit artist who can't code worth shit over a regular looking guy, and then regret it immediately when said suave con-person (to be PC) doesn't perform?

    After all, isn't that how we got Paula Bean (of the "Brillance" which bears her name), and Joe (of The Joe Board), and Mark (of The Abstract Candidate) and a slew of other characters featured in past articles on this very site?

  • Tom Woolf (unregistered)

    I like that comment about expecting new hires to hit the ground running after a job has been posted for 6 months, where the employer could have hired and trained someone in that time.

    I used to work for a Giant Entity, and they had an opening in the internal support/networking group. I was interested, but not skilled in that area. That didn't keep me from checking into the job, since the newest guy in the group (a really good guy) was hired without the necessary skills and trained.

    The hiring boss said "we need somebody who can contribute now - we can't wait for someone to be trained." Eight (EIGHT!) months later, the position was filled.

    (It did finally dawn on me that the hiring manager just didn't want me in his group. After getting over my widdle hurt feelings I jumped ship, and now work for a company that charged the Giant Entity $1,200/day for the same work I did while an employee at $125/day. I did enjoy billing day...)

  • Outlaw Programmer (cs)

    It's amazing how easily management is dazzled by charming guys. The best part is that management is equally as clueless so it turns into a contest about who can bullshit the best. I'm sure in this case management realized that this guy hadn't talked with any developer but didn't care anyway.

    After all, they're management, that's like Developer++.

  • Concerned (unregistered)

    Drinking alcohol is cool and all...

    .. but if you miss work because of it and cause your company problems, you should reevaluate your drinking.

    Believe it or not, that is not normal behavior. Most people have never missed work because of a hangover.

  • belgariontheking (cs)

    Aww, I was hoping it would be a secretary interviewing for a job, like those other sites.

    "From time to time, I'll need you to help me release some pressure. Can you show me how you'd do that for me?"

    "Oh sure, teehee"

  • akatherder (cs) in reply to Concerned
    Concerned:
    Drinking alcohol is cool and all...

    .. but if you miss work because of it and cause your company problems, you should reevaluate your drinking.

    Believe it or not, that is not normal behavior. Most people have never missed work because of a hangover.

    What the hell do you think sick days are for? You sound like my wife.

    There's no evidence presented of a habitual drinking problem that leads him to miss work more than this one occasion. On the contrary, having a hangover points to the fact that he isn't a frequent drinker.

  • xix (unregistered) in reply to akatherder
    akatherder:
    Concerned:
    Drinking alcohol is cool and all...

    .. but if you miss work because of it and cause your company problems, you should reevaluate your drinking.

    Believe it or not, that is not normal behavior. Most people have never missed work because of a hangover.

    What the hell do you think sick days are for? You sound like my wife.

    There's no evidence presented of a habitual drinking problem that leads him to miss work more than this one occasion. On the contrary, having a hangover points to the fact that he isn't a frequent drinker.

    Indeed, I've stayed up reading books so late that, being so exhausted, I should stay home the next day. We get sick days, we use sick days. Am I a habitual book-reader who needs to see BookReaders Anonymous? If you know you can take the day off, why not? He probably could have struggled through the day, I know I have.

    Plus, the "most people haven't missed work due to hangover" bit is truly intriguing. Did you run a door-to-door survey?

  • Roman (unregistered) in reply to Concerned
    Concerned:
    Drinking alcohol is cool and all...

    .. but if you miss work because of it and cause your company problems, you should reevaluate your drinking.

    Believe it or not, that is not normal behavior. Most people have never missed work because of a hangover.

    You must be new around here.

  • Grovesy (cs) in reply to Concerned
    Concerned:
    Drinking alcohol is cool and all...

    .. but if you miss work because of it and cause your company problems, you should reevaluate your drinking.

    Believe it or not, that is not normal behavior. Most people have never missed work because of a hangover.

    !!

    Really?? How long have you been programming for! and how sanitised has your work environment(s) been?!!

    Though saying that it has been a few years, not since... that individual was on the team.

    Until last week, a new team member has joined my team, I see him, he sees me, I have that sinking feeling and he shouts at the top of his voice 'LET'S GO ON THE RAZZZZ!!!!!' (he normally shouted this at 9pm while we were hammering away at our keyboards in the central London office while trying to get a release out... he was the largest single risk to a project. At one point several team members were on the drambue while putting out live what is pretty much one of the largest CMS system out there, swapping one of the most hit (non porn) pages in the world over to it.

    lucky HR / Corporate HQ were based the other side of the country.

    I am just glad that this town was built by Quakers and there are no pubs around and he lives in a different direction to me...

    Besides I have more sense now, I arrange to work from home the day before going out with co-workers. Culturally in the UK, particularly if you are single and live in central London it is not to uncommon to go out on a Thursday night and knock back 8 pints with co-workers before getting the last tube home. I’m not condoning it, just stating that it is more common than you think.

  • One too many... (unregistered) in reply to Concerned

    No but virtually everyone has turned up late and spent the entire morning trying not to groan too loudly!

  • One too many... (unregistered) in reply to Concerned

    No but virtually everyone has turned up late and spent the entire morning trying not to groan too loudly!

  • DeLos (cs) in reply to Concerned
    Concerned:
    Drinking alcohol is cool and all...

    .. but if you miss work because of it and cause your company problems, you should reevaluate your drinking.

    Believe it or not, that is not normal behavior. Most people have never missed work because of a hangover.

    Real men don't get hangovers.

    Seriously though, if you miss work because of a hangover more than once a year, you need to reevaluate. I have only missed work 1 time because I had been drinking the night before. It was after a baseball game with an out of town friend. We went to a bar after the game, met some nice women ... I woke up at like noon. Not my finest hour.

    Sounds like he was just blowing off some steam after working a hard stretch. Then he got carried away. Happens to the best of us.

  • gabba (cs)

    I followed this typical corporate story right up to where Jon got fired. Why did he get fired? Did he stop being charming? We are left hanging.

  • SomeCoder (unregistered) in reply to xix
    xix:
    akatherder:
    Concerned:
    Drinking alcohol is cool and all...

    .. but if you miss work because of it and cause your company problems, you should reevaluate your drinking.

    Believe it or not, that is not normal behavior. Most people have never missed work because of a hangover.

    What the hell do you think sick days are for? You sound like my wife.

    There's no evidence presented of a habitual drinking problem that leads him to miss work more than this one occasion. On the contrary, having a hangover points to the fact that he isn't a frequent drinker.

    Indeed, I've stayed up reading books so late that, being so exhausted, I should stay home the next day. We get sick days, we use sick days. Am I a habitual book-reader who needs to see BookReaders Anonymous? If you know you can take the day off, why not? He probably could have struggled through the day, I know I have.

    Plus, the "most people haven't missed work due to hangover" bit is truly intriguing. Did you run a door-to-door survey?

    I've never missed work due to a hangover. shrug Of course I never miss work, period, because I don't get sick very often and I like to keep my Brett Favre like streak alive :P

  • Grovesy (cs) in reply to gabba

    It strikes me that if he hadn't come up and asked for helpw with some basic coding problems, we would have been reading another 'Brillant' story.

  • Remco (unregistered) in reply to Concerned

    "Miss work"?

    I have a number of days per year I'm allowed to stay home. They're called vacation days, or what have you. Why I decide to take them on a particular day is my own business.

    The story makes it sound as if he didn't know the interview was coming up. Not his fault.

  • krupa (unregistered)

    If it were me, I'd be re-evaluating whether I wanted to work for that management:

    1. We're going to fill a technical position based on the recommendation of the receptionist. Granted, having a good personality is a plus, but the potential hire still needs to be vetted for skills.

    2. Even though he's been here for a day, we think we're going to promote him over you, the employee who has more seniority. (Oh, and we all think you're pretty ugly.)

    3. We're willing to promote this new hire over you based on the recommendation of the receptionist. Also, the postman says you should be using Web 2.0. Get on that, will you?

  • CRNewsom (cs)

    Reminds me of when I got hired at Shaw Aero (no, you haven't heard of it, but be afraid, be very afraid). I talked to the boss for 3 minutes. It went something like this:

    Me: I took a class on (insert expensive software name here) first semester freshman year in college. Him: You know (insert expensive software name here)!? That's what we use. You start tomorrow, 9AM. Me: Ok.

    You see, what I should have said was "No," but what I did was suffer for three years. I still get harassing phone calls from him at 2AM when he's been drinking, and I haven't worked there for 3 years.

  • d000hg.wordpress.com/ (unregistered)

    You can't take a day off with a hangover if you were out drinking with colleagues... THAT is likely to get noticed when they all turn up the next day.

  • aaron (unregistered) in reply to Remco
    Remco:
    I have a number of days per year I'm allowed to stay home. They're called vacation days

    Umm ... wow, really?

    thats just sad

  • OneOfTwelvePercent (unregistered) in reply to Concerned

    That's a good one, I guess you might've missed that 12% of the US workforce calls in sick the day after the Superbowl...

  • vanekl (cs)

    Pictures or it didn't happen.

  • Jason (unregistered) in reply to ObiWayneKenobi
    ObiWayneKenobi:
    Isn't this standard operating procedure? Hire a well-dressed bullshit artist who can't code worth shit over a regular looking guy, and then regret it immediately when said suave con-person (to be PC) doesn't perform?

    After all, isn't that how we got Paula Bean (of the "Brillance" which bears her name), and Joe (of The Joe Board), and Mark (of The Abstract Candidate) and a slew of other characters featured in past articles on this very site?

    Don't we sound a little bitter this morning.

    Well Dressed does not necessarily mean "bullshit artist" and Regular Looking does not necessarily mean "good at his job."

    Relax a bit. Get rid of your preconceived notion that good looking guys (and girls) don't know what they're doing. You'll be happier in life. I promise.

  • Mez (unregistered) in reply to DeLos
    DeLos:
    Real men don't get hangovers.

    Seriously though, if you miss work because of a hangover more than once a year, you need to reevaluate.

    The only reason I can think you said this is because it's better to turn up and let work pay for your hangover.

  • Paul (unregistered)

    Did Danny get his office?

  • Mez (unregistered) in reply to DeLos
    DeLos:
    Seriously though, if you miss work because of a hangover more than once a year, you need to reevaluate.

    Like only once a year is a waste of four more sick days?

  • Bob (unregistered)

    Just how I got my job, boss was stuck in a meeting with a client and the secretary liked me. I did do the technical part of the interview though, just with one of the random developers who had a spare hour.

  • lulz (unregistered)

    I always try to bang the secretary, or the wife/daughter of my boss (heck even the Boss herself if she's pretty ) to try and get promotion.

  • Botzinger Gulm (unregistered) in reply to Jason
    Jason:
    Don't we sound a little bitter this morning.

    It's just all the people who skipped Monday due to being too hung over after the weekend and still have headache.

  • dlikhten (cs)

    Unfortunately there is only so much Management can do. They assumed that the person was hired because he passed interviews with the managers/developers. Having the secretary accept this guy was a terrible move.

    Now TRWTF is that this guy sent out such a retarded email. Had I been in that position, not knowing ANY java and being hired by the secretary, I would have studied my ass off learning Java and trying to fit as much into that position as I could. Obviously opportunity knocked and Jon just slapped it in the face.

  • Mike (unregistered) in reply to Roman

    That's the first time a comment has actually made me laugh out loud.

    And for the record, I confess that I have skipped a day of work due to a hangover at a previous job. I was young and stupid then. Now, instead of using alcohol to relieve tension, I just sit in someone else's cubicle and throw shoes at executives.

  • Paul (unregistered)

    I would have moved Jon into sales or marketing. Looks like a perfect fit.

  • themagni (cs) in reply to aaron
    aaron:
    Remco:
    I have a number of days per year I'm allowed to stay home. They're called vacation days

    Umm ... wow, really?

    thats just sad

    I get as many sick days as I want in a year - I just don't get paid for them.

    I've had jobs with benefits before, and this job is way better. I get paid by the hour, so when I have to pull a stretch of overtime, I actually GET OVERTIME. I get about $6k more than my last job.

    (I do get the standard vacation of 4%.)

  • punissuer (cs) in reply to Tom Woolf
    Tom Woolf:
    the same work I did while an employee at $125/day
    I hope your new employer is paying you more.
  • Dazed (unregistered) in reply to David
    David:
    Every company thinks their new employees have to "hit the ground running, working on day one," even though those listings stay open for six months or more.

    It's not just with employees. My company tendered once for a system that a large company (coincidentally a manufacturer of alcoholic beverages) wanted within six months. The schedule looked very tight so we offered delivery in eight months. A curt reply arrived almost by return of post: if we couldn't deliver in six months we wouldn't be considered. We shrugged our shoulders and moved on.

    Seven months on, my manager rang the company to enquire if their new system was satisfactory. They hadn't yet chosen a supplier.

  • Anonymous (unregistered) in reply to FredSaw
    FredSaw:
    Yes, I have worked under management like this. Thankfully they were scoured away during a cleansing purge a couple of years back, and current management is both competent and good-intentioned.

    Or at least, thats what they want you to believe... be afraid, be very afraid...

  • Some Psychologist (unregistered) in reply to Concerned
    Concerned:
    Drinking alcohol is cool and all...

    .. but if you miss work because of it and cause your company problems, you should reevaluate your drinking.

    Believe it or not, that is not normal behavior. Most people have never missed work because of a hangover.

    There is a term for this, it's called "Functional Alcoholic". Someone who does this occasionally might be a "high-functioning alcoholic" while someone who does it constantly (and nearly or often gets fired) would be a "low-functioning alcoholic".

    However, people are adverse to labels and will attempt to rationalize or justify their behavior. Some may project their reasons on to others (for example, "people like you are the reason I drink", etc.); not realizing that other people are not the ones holding the bottle to their lips.

    Alcoholism is a serious mental illness that has a genetic component. Anybody can get sober, but an alcoholic will always be an alcoholic; regardless their last drink was 1 hour ago or 100 years ago.

    Everybody needs to make their own choices and find their own way. Help anybody who asks you for it, but don't feel sorry for anybody. Enabling an alcoholic to function despite their illness only enables them to sink further into the illness without consequences. If they aren't asking you for help, then butt-out of their lives, and let the chips fall where they may.

  • akatherder (cs) in reply to lulz
    lulz:
    I always try to bang the secretary, or the wife/daughter of my boss (heck even the Boss herself if she's pretty ) to try and get promotion. So far I've been fired once, demoted twice, forced into several paycuts and I caught the clap.

    Fixed.

  • ObiWayneKenobi (cs) in reply to Jason
    Jason:
    ObiWayneKenobi:
    Isn't this standard operating procedure? Hire a well-dressed bullshit artist who can't code worth shit over a regular looking guy, and then regret it immediately when said suave con-person (to be PC) doesn't perform?

    After all, isn't that how we got Paula Bean (of the "Brillance" which bears her name), and Joe (of The Joe Board), and Mark (of The Abstract Candidate) and a slew of other characters featured in past articles on this very site?

    Don't we sound a little bitter this morning.

    Well Dressed does not necessarily mean "bullshit artist" and Regular Looking does not necessarily mean "good at his job."

    Relax a bit. Get rid of your preconceived notion that good looking guys (and girls) don't know what they're doing. You'll be happier in life. I promise.

    Umm... I never once said that ALL well-dressed people are bullshit artists, and regular looking are worthless. What I meant was that almost all of these WTFs that involve some incompetent who gets hired, said person is almost always a flashy, suave con-artist and wows clueless management with bogus experience and/or buzzword bingo, only to be found out and fired a few months later

  • WhiskeyJack (cs) in reply to OneOfTwelvePercent
    OneOfTwelvePercent:
    That's a good one, I guess you might've missed that 12% of the US workforce calls in sick the day after the Superbowl...

    40% of all sick days are taken on Mondays and Fridays.

    Hmmm...

  • João Marcus (unregistered)

    Well, Jon should have learned the art of blaming someone else. He could say he wasn't dealing with pro-active assets, because he didn't get a proper solution for the problem (btw, he should've also learned to use the word "asset", which makes people look like meat sticks with eyes and hair). Then, he should talk he would leverage the company's IT BI platforms to increase the ROI with an on-demand SOA paradigm.

  • Anonymous (unregistered) in reply to Outlaw Programmer

    Brillant!

    Outlaw Programmer:
    After all, they're management, that's like Developer++.
    More like Developer# .INC.
  • Gedoon (unregistered)

    Well at least they can't blame the secretary... I mean, that's the way secretaries are hired, right? All your job qualifications are to look good and dress smart, no actuall skills required. How could she have known better?

    The real WTF is a twittering little bird, chirping in a meadow.

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