• Franz Kafka (unregistered) in reply to webhamster
    webhamster:

    The next month I got a bill from my long distance provider for $0.05 (the cost of leaving that message). I went to my online banking and paid it. The next month I got a notice from them that basically said "Hey, we got your 5 cents. Thanks a bunch!"

    By my math it cost them at least $1.04 to collect that 5 cents from me (in postage for the bill and the notice) and who knows how much more in processing time.

    This reminds me of an actual smart behavior that Amex has: when you pay your balance, you don't get another statement until you owe them money; no $0.50 envelope to say that you're even.

  • Dan (unregistered) in reply to Leon
    Leon:
    GMo:
    Not something you want to happen to your mission-critical system.

    Places it is appropriate to use the phrase "mission-critical":

    1. Front lines of the military
    2. NASA

    Anywhere that a company has a system that if it goes down will cripple your businesses ability to provide their service/product is "mission-critical".

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mission_critical

    Places it is appropriate to try being a pompous ass because someone uses a word/phrase correctly but not to your satisfaction:

    1. Nowhere
  • David Walker (unregistered)

    One of my credit cards was used to set up an account with Reliance Call India, for a service that allows cheap phone calls to and from India. I don't know anyone in India.

    I called RelianceCall and tried to reason with their customer service idiots (and they were idiots), who demanded that I tell them my account number. I didn't have an account number; I just had a credit card charge. They refused to look up the account using my credit card number, even though they had the ability. I went round and round with them many times over a period of three months, and each time, they insisted that they couldn't look up the charge without knowing my account number (I DON'T HAVE AN ACCOUNT WITH YOU, BUT MY CARD WAS CHARGED ANYWAY. They couldn't comprehend this situation.)

    Finally, I disputed the charge with my card company (which asks you to try to work it out with the main company first, which I did). Reliance Call India was stupid enough to challenge the dispute, providing "evidence" (they finally looked it up by the card number) that showed a guy's name, address (in New Jersey -- not even close to where I live) and phone number, and MY credit card number. I asked Reliance Call why they didn't call the guy up when I first talked to them. They wouldn't answer this, and they were very rude.

    My credit card company was slightly stupid too; they forwarded me the info that Reliance had sent them, and said "doesn't this prove that you made the charge", and I said no, I don't live in New Jersey; please LOOK at the info; and why don't you call the guy up?

    I should have called him myself, but I didn't care any more. I never got Reliance to admit that I didn't make the charge, but at least the charge was finally reversed by my card company, so Reliance didn't get my money. And if anyone ever asks how to call India cheaply, you can bet that I won't recommend Reliance Call India.

  • Lincoln (unregistered) in reply to webhamster
    webhamster:
    This spring (3 years after I graduated) I got a letter from them stating that I owed $1.34 in overdue fees dating back to 2004 and that failure to pay the amount would result in having my grades frozen for the current semester. I haven't paid the $1.34. What are they going to do? Revoke my degree?

    The university I worked for/attended was notorious for pulling this kind of stunt... and they would actually rescend your degree until you paid up / took that one extra credit that they "overlooked" during your grad review

  • David Walker (unregistered)

    Oh yes, one other stupidity: Many years ago, the IRS (in the U.S.) mailed my ex-father-in-law a bunch of papers with calculations showing that if he had not rounded his income and deductions to the nearest dollar on his income tax forms, which is allowed (and most professional accountants do this routinely), he would have owed 17 cents less on his taxes.

    They included a check for 17 cents. He was furious at this waste of postage, paper, and effort.

  • (cs) in reply to David Walker
    David Walker:
    Oh yes, one other stupidity: Many years ago, the IRS (in the U.S.) mailed my ex-father-in-law a bunch of papers with calculations showing that if he had not rounded his income and deductions to the nearest dollar on his income tax forms, which is allowed (and most professional accountants do this routinely), he would have owed 17 cents less on his taxes.

    They included a check for 17 cents. He was furious at this waste of postage, paper, and effort.

    Imagine how angry he would have been if it turned out he owed them 17 cents (plus interest and penalties).

    Really, though, think about this logically:

    they've got a process where they enter in every number on every tax return into their computer and it checks the math and sends out bills to people who came up short and checks to people who overpaid. They have to do this because some people are going to screw up by larger amounts in both directions, and they have to know who has deductions that are questionable enough to flag up for an audit, etc.

    When you're coding such a system how do you justify putting in an exception for the guy who's only off by 17 cents?

  • Jay (unregistered)

    I once closed an account at a bank. Two years later I got a statement from them saying:

    Beginning balance: $0.00
Deposits:          $0.00
Withdrawals:       $0.00
Ending balance     $0.00

Service charge    $20.00

    I didn't pay it. But it seemed like a great marketing plan: Charge everyone who is not a customer of your company a $20 annual service charge.

  • Walleye (unregistered) in reply to Random832
    Random832:
    When you're coding such a system how do you justify putting in an exception for the guy who's only off by 17 cents?

    The IRS now has just this exception coded. Any amount less than a dollar is not charged or refunded.

  • Matt (unregistered)

    My roommate has a similar issue. Nelnet or something has been sending him monthly bills for three years for $1.34- and $1.32 is late fees. He has tried to resolve it with them, but they refuse to listen. So they are paying $0.42 every month to let him know he owes them $1.34.

  • Kiwi (unregistered) in reply to Leon
    Leon:
    GMo:
    Not something you want to happen to your mission-critical system.

    Places it is appropriate to use the phrase "mission-critical":

    1. Front lines of the military
    2. NASA

    No... anytime the mission is guaranteed to fail on event X, preventing X is mission-critical. The failure of the mission may not cost lives, but X was still critical to the success of the mission.

  • (cs) in reply to fanguad
    fanguad:
    Here's a surprising non-WTF. I worked at the bursar's office at my university. Every semester, all outstanding student bills less than a dollar were just set to zero. This policy wasn't published anywhere, presumably to prevent students from cheating the school out of $12 or so.

    Still, that's totally how these things should be run. Who really cares if you're $1 short on your $10,000 bill?

    Office Space Superman III attack! Micro-Deposits

    Lolz for suggesting more rounding in the billing depts.

  • Schmitter (unregistered)

    When I went to pay off my first car, I went to the teller for the payoff amount and brought cash to pay it off. She said I should get the title in 7 buisness days. Two weeks later I go to find out why I haven't gotten my title. "You still owe $1.17". Now I custimalrily find out what the daily interest charge is and add 3 or 4 days worth to my final payment. The last two times I have done this they automatically send me the check for the 2.34 or whatever it ends up being.

  • (cs) in reply to Otis P Criblecoblis
    Otis P Criblecoblis:
    Due to a rounding error when calculating sales tax, I once received a bill for one cent which included 12 pre-addressed envelopes so that I could make monthly payments.

    Did you write a check for 1/12 of a cent?

  • Sean M (unregistered) in reply to snoofle

    The student loans were for law school, weren't they?

  • Whaddayacare (unregistered) in reply to snoofle

    You sued them for a cent? Looks to me like you need to get laid!

  • (cs) in reply to David Walker
    David Walker:
    Oh yes, one other stupidity: Many years ago, the IRS (in the U.S.) mailed my ex-father-in-law a bunch of papers with calculations showing that if he had not rounded his income and deductions to the nearest dollar on his income tax forms, which is allowed (and most professional accountants do this routinely), he would have owed 17 cents less on his taxes.

    They included a check for 17 cents. He was furious at this waste of postage, paper, and effort.

    The real question is, if they want you to round all your amounts to the nearest dollar, why do you leave the cents spaces blank on all the forms? If you want people to round values and enter zero in those spaces, why don't you print zero in those spaces FOR them?

  • Shakespeare (unregistered)

    Back in the day, I had the standard $9.95 per month dialup account with a local ISP. It was billed to a FirstUSA credit card. When I closed the credit card account, I forgot to update the info with the ISP. They competently, courteously and in a timely manner contacted me and I gave them the new billiing information.

    Then I get the FirstUSA "bill" which shows a balance of -$9.95. Huh?

    WTF #1: Charging to a closed account with a zero balance causes the customer to gain credit in the amount of the refused charge.

    I figure they'll grok their mistake and correct it with a final statement. Nope -- another month goes by and I get another statement still showing the negative balance.

    I realize this is going to go on forerver unless I call them. So I do and I explain the situation. And the CSR's response? "We can't close the account unless it's a zero balance. The best I can do is send you a check."

    WTF#2: Obvious. At least after I received the check they stopped sending the statements.

  • Shill (unregistered) in reply to SuperousOxide
    SuperousOxide:
    David Walker:
    Oh yes, one other stupidity: Many years ago, the IRS (in the U.S.) mailed my ex-father-in-law a bunch of papers with calculations showing that if he had not rounded his income and deductions to the nearest dollar on his income tax forms, which is allowed (and most professional accountants do this routinely), he would have owed 17 cents less on his taxes.

    They included a check for 17 cents. He was furious at this waste of postage, paper, and effort.

    The real question is, if they want you to round all your amounts to the nearest dollar, why do you leave the cents spaces blank on all the forms? If you want people to round values and enter zero in those spaces, why don't you print zero in those spaces FOR them?

    Did you forget your brain again? Why not just omit the fields entirely instead of printing zero in them...

  • Joe (unregistered) in reply to Shakespeare
    Shakespeare:
    Back in the day, I had the standard $9.95 per month dialup account with a local ISP. It was billed to a FirstUSA credit card. When I closed the credit card account, I forgot to update the info with the ISP. They competently, courteously and in a timely manner contacted me and I gave them the new billiing information.

    Then I get the FirstUSA "bill" which shows a balance of -$9.95. Huh?

    WTF #1: Charging to a closed account with a zero balance causes the customer to gain credit in the amount of the refused charge.

    I figure they'll grok their mistake and correct it with a final statement. Nope -- another month goes by and I get another statement still showing the negative balance.

    I realize this is going to go on forerver unless I call them. So I do and I explain the situation. And the CSR's response? "We can't close the account unless it's a zero balance. The best I can do is send you a check."

    WTF#2: Obvious. At least after I received the check they stopped sending the statements.

    Actually, that makes some sense from an account management perspective. You shouldn't close out an account with a balance on it. Even if it's a credit balance. In fact, especially if it's a credit balance. The customer will want his money, so you have to issue the credit before closing the account.

    The WTF is that there never should've been a credit in the first place. But not being able to close out a non-zero balance account is not a WTF.

  • (cs) in reply to Jay

    I once opened a checking account with a local bank while I was staying in another city for a few months. When I left town I still had something like $12.34 in the account. After two years, I had forgotten about the account. Then I got a statement with an inactivity service charge for exactly $12.34 and a notice that my account was being closed. Convenient.

  • TInkerghost (unregistered) in reply to AT
    AT:
    OK, I have an even better one: When I canceled my mobile account with Sprint a few years ago the last bill was something like $180. I paid the bill, but somehow they lost that information and kept billing me for the same amount (they actually had cashed the final payment check). I kept calling them to complain, but nothing would stop the threatening bills each month.

    Finally, they turned my account over to their internal collections department, which started calling to harass me at home. Now I'm really pissed off. I laid into the next collections person that called pretty good, and they researched my account and acknowledged that my final payment was received and that I didn't own anything.

    Beats my issues w/ Cingular - I canceled 3 phones so they docked me 3X $175 for 3 months. I went from fully paid up to owing $1600. I didn't want to pay the first $525, but it was in the contract. Supposedly it was resolved after 9 months of yelling at them, but every 6 months to a year they sell the debt to someone & I get phonecalls until I threaten to sue them for harassment.
  • Saaid (unregistered) in reply to Jay
    Jay:
    I once closed an account at a bank. Two years later I got a statement from them saying: 
    Beginning balance: $0.00
Deposits:          $0.00
Withdrawals:       $0.00
Ending balance     $0.00

Service charge    $20.00

    I didn't pay it. But it seemed like a great marketing plan: Charge everyone who is not a customer of your company a $20 annual service charge.

    Oh snap! I just checked and this is not patented yet! I'm calling my lawyer.

  • treasury (unregistered) in reply to David Walker

    Did they use a treasury check, though? I love getting those:

    http://www.ustreas.gov/usss/images/kym_66.jpg

    So nice looking.

  • Raju (unregistered) in reply to David Walker
    David Walker:
    And if anyone ever asks how to call India cheaply, you can bet that I won't recommend Reliance Call India.

    Thank you sir for the tip - I just signed up!

  • anonny (unregistered)

    I'm betting Brian T. Graggs, at 1-501-748-6633 really appreciates the editors going the extra mile to make sure the submission was annonymized.

  • some name (unregistered)

    Got one too. This one being about the German Railroad (Die Bahn AG).

    Not long ago, they sent me a letter saying I had to pay about 100€. No problem so far. Waited long enought for that, too. However, it also said I should use the reference number for the transaction.

    No reference number. But 4 ticket numbers. Oh, well, why not call them. It went kinda like that: Me: [describing situation] Her: Then use the ticket number. Me: There's four of them. Her: Use the reference number. Me: There is none. That's why I'm calling. [...]

    In the end, she said I should two transactions, using two of the ticket numbers (the ones on my name). I wonder what will happen next. Will they put the pieces together? Will my girlfriend (the other two tickets) get a bill over 0.00€?

  • Spoe (unregistered) in reply to Whaddayacare
    Whaddayacare:
    You sued them for a cent? Looks to me like you need to get laid!

    Sounds more like he sued to get collections off his back and protect his credit rating. If you pay once it gets to collections it'll be on your credit report (and the all-important FICO score) for years that you had a delinquent account. Only one cent could be the difference between mortgage rates or even loan approval in the first place.

  • Franz Kafka (unregistered) in reply to Random832
    Random832:
    When you're coding such a system how do you justify putting in an exception for the guy who's only off by 17 cents?

    if (discrepancyAmount < Currency(5.00)) fuggedaboutit();

  • Saccharissa (unregistered)

    Years ago, my Dad closed out one of his savings accounts. A couple of weeks later, he recieved a letter, telling him that because his current ballance of $0 was less than the required minimum ballance, he was being charged a $20 insufficient funds fee. This would be taken out of his account, bringing his ballance to $-20. Shortly thereafter, he received another letter informing him that he was overdrawn by $20, and would have to pay a $30 overdraft fee. My Dad had to call the bank, and was fortunately successful in persuading them that he should not have to pay $50 in penalty fees for an account that did not actually exist.

  • (cs) in reply to Franz Kafka
    Franz Kafka:
    Random832:
    When you're coding such a system how do you justify putting in an exception for the guy who's only off by 17 cents?

    if (discrepancyAmount < Currency(5.00)) fuggedaboutit();

    You might want to make that abs(discepancyAmount) - if you casually toss out the fact that you owe a customer $10,000 things could get ugly.

  • Elhaard (unregistered) in reply to snoofle
    snoofle:
    my balance was $0.01

    You should just have sent them $0.02 (preferrably in cash) and then demanding that they should send you the $0.01 they now owed you.

  • Noel (unregistered) in reply to Leon
    Leon:
    GMo:
    Not something you want to happen to your mission-critical system.

    Places it is appropriate to use the phrase "mission-critical":

    1. Front lines of the military
    2. NASA

    Because missions are only carried out by the military and a US based space program?

    'Mission' refers to sending out a person/group of people/entity to a foreign place to achieve a goal. It has no specific connection with either military or NASA.

    what an arrogant c*nt

  • shake (unregistered)

    I got a traffic ticket last summer in PA from a trooper that couldn't be bothered to write legibly, so I read the total as $107.00 instead of $107.50. I sent in a check in a very timely manner, and 2 weeks later got an invoice in the mail that was addressed by hand from the county justice with a note written on the bottom saying "you owe $0.50, please pay immediately". At least it was only first class mail, so they wasted $0.41 instead of > $1. They were somewhat intelligent in that they never sent me a receipt for the second check, and I can only assume that it was received.

  • James O'Boston (unregistered) in reply to Leon
    Leon:

    Places it is appropriate to use the phrase "mission-critical":

    1. Front lines of the military
    2. NASA

    um, and anything that would potentially block the incomes of people who need to pay rent and buy food...

    NASA counts, but not US Airways? Front lines of the military only? The grunts are not mission-critical, they are there to absorb the first rounds from the other side.

  • James O'Boston (unregistered) in reply to DKNewsham
    DKNewsham:
    I once opened a checking account with a local bank while I was staying in another city for a few months. When I left town I still had something like $12.34 in the account. After two years, I had forgotten about the account. Then I got a statement with an inactivity service charge for exactly $12.34 and a notice that my account was being closed. Convenient.

    The bank may have done you a favor.

    Their rates and fees are normally (i.e. always) published and fixed, and declared well in advance.

    The policy was perhaps "$20 per year, or the balance in the account if less than $20."

  • James O'Boston (unregistered) in reply to Annon
    Annon:
    The Real WTF is everyone arguing over what the hell mission-critical means.

    Don't be ridiculous.

    Mission-critical means it's important to ME, and everyone should know that already.

  • usagi (unregistered) in reply to webhamster

    Revoke? For that amount, probably not. Hold your transcript so you're unable to prove you actually received the degree and charge you interest until it's paid in full? Oh hell yeah!

  • David Bowie (unregistered) in reply to snoofle

    The Halloween Jack is a real cool cat, and he lives on top of Manhattan Chase The elevators broke, so he slides down a rope onto the street below, oh Tarzie, go man, go Meets his little hussy with his ghost-town approach Her face is sans feature, but she wears a Dali broach Sweetly reminiscent, something mother used to bake Wrecked up and paralyzed, Diamond Dogs are sable-ized

  • David Bowie (unregistered) in reply to snoofle

    The Halloween Jack is a real cool cat, and he lives on top of Manhattan Chase The elevators broke, so he slides down a rope onto the street below, oh Tarzie, go man, go Meets his little hussy with his ghost-town approach Her face is sans feature, but she wears a Dali broach Sweetly reminiscent, something mother used to bake Wrecked up and paralyzed, Diamond Dogs are sable-ized

  • Finibus Bonorum (unregistered)

    This thread reminds me of a similar case of corporate stupidity.

    My vehicle insurance is with Meloche-Monnex. My vehicle loan is with VFC. Both are owned by TD Bank.

    Once a year, I get a nasty letter from VFC about NOT having insurance coverage & that they'll charge me an extra $100/month. They won't call Meloche-Monnex directly, even if I provide them with the toll-free telephone number.

    Meloche-Monnex, of course, confirms my insurance coverage, but is not able to communicate with VFC [even when I give them the toll-free number].

    WTF?

  • (cs) in reply to Dan
    Dan:
    Leon:
    GMo:
    Not something you want to happen to your mission-critical system.

    Places it is appropriate to use the phrase "mission-critical":

    1. Front lines of the military
    2. NASA

    Anywhere that a company has a system that if it goes down will cripple your businesses ability to provide their service/product is "mission-critical".

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mission_critical

    Places it is appropriate to try being a pompous ass because someone uses a word/phrase correctly but not to your satisfaction:

    1. Nowhere
    I would recommend zero-based indexing for that last 'list'. (intended with all due humour. or humor)
  • Finibus Bonorum (unregistered) in reply to Walleye
    Walleye:
    Random832:
    When you're coding such a system how do you justify putting in an exception for the guy who's only off by 17 cents?

    The IRS now has just this exception coded. Any amount less than a dollar is not charged or refunded.

    Ah, Revenue Canada goes one better [literally]. Any amount less than 2 dollars is not charged or refunded.

  • Finibus Bonorum (unregistered) in reply to Whaddayacare
    Whaddayacare:
    You sued them for a cent? Looks to me like you need to get laid!

    Aha! Here's the connection between the main thread and the "mission-critical" sub-thread: Having sex is mission-critical.

  • dev null (unregistered) in reply to snoofle
    snoofle:
    fanguad:
    Who really cares if you're $1 short on your $10,000 bill?
    Chase Manhattan.

    When I was in school, I had student loans totalling about $10K (thirty years ago). ....

    I know it was only for one cent, but they pissed me off so much that it was the principal of the thing.

    The principal, or the interest?

  • (cs) in reply to tRENT
    tRENT:
    I also got multiple invoice from the government once for $0, I called and called to try to get this problem fixed, but could never. So I finally wrote a check for $0 dollars and that corrected the problem.

    Sounds like an urban legend ;-)

    http://forum2.breakthechain.org/exclusives/zerobill.html

    (Well if your $0.00 cheque crashed the banking system then it would be TRWTF)

  • (cs)

    Well, I guess that's better than one of mine... I got a reminder bill that was empty. That's right, not even 0,00 or 0,01, just an empty field where the amount should have been.

  • N Morrison (unregistered) in reply to fanguad
    fanguad:
    Here's a surprising non-WTF. I worked at the bursar's office at my university. Every semester, all outstanding student bills less than a dollar were just set to zero. This policy wasn't published anywhere, presumably to prevent students from cheating the school out of $12 or so.

    Still, that's totally how these things should be run. Who really cares if you're $1 short on your $10,000 bill?

    My aunt used to work for the patients' property office in a hospital. When she started there, if they were out by a penny they would stay on overtime until they found the error. After a few years reality set in. If they were within $5 of balanced, they went home.

  • N Morrison (unregistered) in reply to Franz Kafka
    Franz Kafka:
    This reminds me of an actual smart behavior that Amex has: when you pay your balance, you don't get another statement until you owe them money; no $0.50 envelope to say that you're even.
    But if they owe you $0.35 they send a bill every month to tell you that!
  • (cs)

    OK so here's where you can help: Next time you're working on an invoicing/billing/demands system, suggest they build in a) minimum cost threshold (i.e. don't send bill for $0.1), b) "account needs attention" flag, so that you can get a human to look at unpaid accounts worth $0.1, and c) manual adjustments, so they can clear accounts owing said $0.1. There, fixed that for you.

  • (cs) in reply to snoofle
    snoofle:
    fanguad:
    Who really cares if you're $1 short on your $10,000 bill?
    Chase Manhattan.

    I know it was only for one cent, but they pissed me off so much that it was the principal of the thing.

    Ya gotta love corporations and the drones that work for their billing departments.

    well, if this is true, I'm not sure if "the corporations" are the only retards in this story. take a chill pill, man.

    you know what they say: "it takes two to tango"

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