• Warren (unregistered)

    Surely, as he's claiming not to have any qualifications, either:

    • he can simply write the affidavit himself
    • he has to go to every college etc. getting an affidavit that he didn't graduate there
  • maxh (unregistered) in reply to Warren

    Well, he's not claiming that he doesn't have any qualifications; presumably he has a high school diploma. He could, therefore, get an affidavit from his high school.

  • Pista (unregistered)

    Bingo! Yet another HR moron with horses glasses! A zintillion of them so far and still counting...

  • ANON (unregistered)

    Can I have an affidavit that this comment is not "frist"?

  • RFoxmich (unregistered) in reply to ANON

    Our notary is on vacation sorry.

  • Cujo (unregistered)

    Does HR need an affadavit to certify they had a lobotomy before working in HR?

  • (cs)

    There must be a WTF in the business logic of the HR's brain.

  • Franky (unregistered)

    Maybe she simply doesn't know what an Affidavit exactly is (like me non-native speaker) and was just told "he needs to have one to verify his academic career", never mind he has none ;)

  • (cs)

    This reminds me of one encounter with a german students loans bureaucrat. You have meet some criteria to be eligible for the loan: the income of your parents must be low enough and your income and your fortune must also be small enough. I had a rather big fond before the house bubble burst and it was no problem to show them that the fond was small enough to be no problem. But then I deleted the fonds because the economy was not doing well. I provided the bureaucrat with a notification of the bank and he replied "well please prove me that you do not posess any other fond". I was a little flabbergasted - how can you essentially prove THAT? I explained him that the termination notice and my bank account are showing that I did not hide any money, but to no avail. I wrote him an oath, but h did not accept taht either. lastly, I called in his supervisor which said something like" he is stupid, here is my ok and you can ignore him in the future"....

  • Peter (unregistered) in reply to Cujo

    In my experience, HR is often populated by earnest (and often quite attractive) young things with liberal arts degrees from expensive universities. Being in HR, they have not a clue about what the company that employs them actually does. However, they're awfully diligent at looking for resumes containing keywords they've identified in the job postings they're given.

    Then, in a few years, they get married and have babies. They usually leave shortly afterwards. I have met only one HR person who actually made an attempt to know the business, and she was a very good person. The rest of my experience with HR people has been like talking to the lady at the coffee shop about what I do.

    Captcha: erat // sum es sunt eram erat eramus

  • Mike (unregistered)

    TRWTF is he passed on such a golden opportunity to really mess with a HR bot. I would never waste such a chance as this.

  • EvilSnack (unregistered)

    Not surprising, coming from the department that routinely fails to see a contradiction in an entry-level position that has a two-year experience requirement.

    Captcha 'consequat'; "As a consequat of the stupid HR practices, the position has been empty for quite a while."

  • F (unregistered)

    Advanced degree in nuclear engineering? Tenured professorship? Hah! Is that the best he can do?

    I don't have an honorary doctorate in theology, literature and interplanetary communication. (Of course, you'll have to take my word for it).

  • Mike (unregistered)

    @EvilSnack I agree. I saw "entry level" positions that wanted people with 10+ years of all the above (being things like SQL Server, C#, C++) in a production environment through several complete ship cycles. I mean come on. There are some experienced people that don't have that and their are good experienced people that might never have shipped (or been involved in the full cycle). Say you worked at MS from 2003-2007 or so. You wrote thousands of lines of code leading up to Vista (the good bits) but left a week early ... sorry your not qualified.

    Another funny one I saw in ~2008 a company that wanted someone with at least 10 years experience with .Net technologies. I mean come on at least check to see if that new shiny technology even existed that long ago.

  • (cs)

    Dear HR Drone,

    This is to confirm that Mr. X. has a degree in Y. This paragraph is false.

    Sincerely, Mr. X's Philosophy Instructor

  • Mr. A N Mouse (unregistered) in reply to F

    Funnily enough I do have one of those, and I'm a rocket scientist! There was no way I was going to tell the droid about that though!

  • Mr. A N Mouse (unregistered) in reply to F

    Funnily enough I do have one of those, and I'm a rocket scientist! There was no way I was going to tell the droid about that though!

  • Dave H (unregistered)

    "So why did you withdraw your application?" "Well, given that HR weren't even listening to me in the INTERVIEW, I didn't hold out much hope for the job itself."

  • (cs) in reply to Mr. A N Mouse
    Mr. A N Mouse:
    Funnily enough I do have one of those, and I'm a rocket scientist! There was no way I was going to tell the droid about that though!

    Was it the droid you were looking for?

  • QJo (unregistered)

    I'm somewhat bewildered by this. Where I come from, an educational establishment provides its graduates with a certificate: a piece of hard-to-forge paper on which it is indicated that a person has successfully undertaken a course of study. Doesn't this procedure hold everywhere in the world?

  • Kevin (unregistered) in reply to QJo

    Makes sense, doesn't it? I've also applied to places that ask for your transcript mailed to them directly from the university. Can't forge it if you never handled it.

  • thnurg (unregistered)

    I'm disappointed that Dave didn't gasp in horror and exclaim "You changed the résumé!!"

  • (cs) in reply to QJo
    QJo:
    I'm somewhat bewildered by this. Where I come from, an educational establishment provides its graduates with a certificate: a piece of hard-to-forge paper on which it is indicated that a person has successfully undertaken a course of study. Doesn't this procedure hold everywhere in the world?

    Yes of course it does.

    But what use is a non-existent certificate when you're trying to prove that you didn't complete a course?

    Also, someone with 25 years experience, may very well not have any fucking clue where that certificate has ended up. Especially if it doesn't exist.

  • ceiswyn (unregistered) in reply to QJo
    QJo:
    I'm somewhat bewildered by this. Where I come from, an educational establishment provides its graduates with a certificate: a piece of hard-to-forge paper on which it is indicated that a person has successfully undertaken a course of study. Doesn't this procedure hold everywhere in the world?

    Setting aside the point that institutions tend not to provide people with hard-to-forge pieces of paper saying that they dropped out...

    It's not as universal as you might think. The university I went to didn't graduate you automatically on completion of your course; you had to actually organise and book graduation on one of the available dates in order to get the shiny certificate (and until such time as you did you were technically a 'graduand').

    I was technically a graduand for ten years, and that's nowhere near the record. But it would have been easy enough for anyone who employed me to check with my college; assuming any of them actually did their due diligence. Which most didn't.

  • (cs) in reply to QJo
    QJo:
    I'm somewhat bewildered by this. Where I come from, an educational establishment provides its graduates with a certificate: a piece of hard-to-forge paper on which it is indicated that a person has successfully undertaken a course of study. Doesn't this procedure hold everywhere in the world?
    I don't think it would be at all difficult to forge my degree certificates. (And as an aside, they don't say anything about having undertaken a course of study. They just say that on such-and-such a date I was admitted to the specified degree).
  • Dessimus (unregistered)

    HR Drone: You know, also, your resume doesn't state you didn't work for any Fortune500 companies. We're gonna need affidavit from each of them stating you didn't work for them, too. Thanks!

  • CoderHero (unregistered) in reply to ceiswyn
    ceiswyn:
    QJo:
    I'm somewhat bewildered by this. Where I come from, an educational establishment provides its graduates with a certificate: a piece of hard-to-forge paper on which it is indicated that a person has successfully undertaken a course of study. Doesn't this procedure hold everywhere in the world?

    Setting aside the point that institutions tend not to provide people with hard-to-forge pieces of paper saying that they dropped out...

    It's not as universal as you might think. The university I went to didn't graduate you automatically on completion of your course; you had to actually organise and book graduation on one of the available dates in order to get the shiny certificate (and until such time as you did you were technically a 'graduand').

    I was technically a graduand for ten years, and that's nowhere near the record. But it would have been easy enough for anyone who employed me to check with my college; assuming any of them actually did their due diligence. Which most didn't.

    I'm hoping that this piece of paper could be used by people who actually CLAIM to have graduated.

  • katastrofa (unregistered) in reply to Peter
    Peter:
    In my experience, HR is often populated by earnest (and often quite attractive) young things with liberal arts degrees from expensive universities.

    They only deal with hiring. Those in charge of firing people are quite shrewd and professional.

    Captcha: causa - fired for a cause?

  • Anonymous Bob (unregistered)

    The real WTF is that a "startup" already has such a dismal HR department. In most small companies I've seen, the HR department is one person who is personally known by the founders. They would certainly rubber stamp anyone the company was actively courting. It usually takes years of "success" and growth for HR to become filled with this sort of mental concrete.

  • It's Pat (unregistered) in reply to Mike
    Mike:
    Another funny one I saw in ~2008 a company that wanted someone with at least 10 years experience with .Net technologies. I mean come on at least check to see if that new shiny technology even existed that long ago.
    5 years of experience with Windows 2000. Job posted in 2001.
  • QJo (unregistered) in reply to ceiswyn
    ceiswyn:
    QJo:
    I'm somewhat bewildered by this. Where I come from, an educational establishment provides its graduates with a certificate: a piece of hard-to-forge paper on which it is indicated that a person has successfully undertaken a course of study. Doesn't this procedure hold everywhere in the world?

    Setting aside the point that institutions tend not to provide people with hard-to-forge pieces of paper saying that they dropped out...

    It's not as universal as you might think. The university I went to didn't graduate you automatically on completion of your course; you had to actually organise and book graduation on one of the available dates in order to get the shiny certificate (and until such time as you did you were technically a 'graduand').

    I was technically a graduand for ten years, and that's nowhere near the record. But it would have been easy enough for anyone who employed me to check with my college; assuming any of them actually did their due diligence. Which most didn't.

    So there's the WTF. I have never bothered to attend a graduation ceremony (even more stupid a pointless waste of time than going to church) but have received my certificates in the mail. To insist that a course of study is somehow not complete without a ridiculous session of pointless pageantry suggests an inability to emerge from the middle-ages.

    But the point I was making is this. The accepted method of demonstrating that one has achieved a course of study is the simple and obvious one of presenting your certificates. If you have been careless or unlucky enough to have lost them in the last 25 years, then the usual procedure would be to approach your alma mater and get replacements (although having been neither careless nor unlucky in this department I have not been able to determine how straightforward such a course of action is). At the point of second interview, or whenever else you are so asked, you present your certs.

    The real WTF in this story is of course the HR drone expecting you to produce the evidence of the fact that you have had no formal further academic education, yes, I accept that. It's on a par with the recent story of the atheist who is trying to get into the US but needs a certificate from her church that she's a pacifist.

  • @Deprecated (unregistered)

    I am willing to bet that eyebrows thought "We really dodged a bullet there! Phew!"

  • JAPH (unregistered)

    In 2000 I saw a job asking for 10 years of Java experience.

  • myanus (unregistered) in reply to thnurg

    Security by insanity - keeps résumés safe!

  • trtrwtf (unregistered)

    The WTF is that a notarized affidavit of "no education" would be the easiest thing in the world to provide. Just write down something like "I have no academic credentials beyond a high school diploma" and have it notarized.

    The real WTF is the idea that having something "notarized" makes it more reliable in some fashion. All a notary provides is evidence that the person who signed a certain document did so in their presence and provided some proof of their identity.

  • C-Derb (unregistered) in reply to katastrofa
    katastrofa:
    Peter:
    In my experience, HR is often populated by earnest (and often quite attractive) young things with liberal arts degrees from expensive universities.

    They only deal with hiring. Those in charge of firing people are quite shrewd and professional.

    Captcha: causa - fired for a cause?

    Interesting concept right there. If the shrewd and professional HR people did a little more work in the hiring phase, they wouldn't be needed for the firing phase.

  • (cs) in reply to C-Derb

    Maybe that is the point.

    Some people (shrewd and professional, or otherwise) enjoy the power they get from being in charge of their own company. If they hired HR who did a good job, they'd get to exercise their power to fire people less.

  • ceiswyn (unregistered) in reply to CoderHero
    CoderHero:
    ceiswyn:
    It's not as universal as you might think. The university I went to didn't graduate you automatically on completion of your course; you had to actually organise and book graduation on one of the available dates in order to get the shiny certificate (and until such time as you did you were technically a 'graduand').

    I'm hoping that this piece of paper could be used by people who actually CLAIM to have graduated.

    Who ever claims to have graduated? I don't know about you, but my CV just lists my degree class, nothing about my graduation status :) I even had a piece of paper somewhere with my results on it. I just didn't have an official certificate.

    (And for anyone commenting about how that sounds like it comes from the middle ages... yes, yes it does. Along with the oath not to bring into the Library or kindle therein any fire or flame. The point is, however, that there may well be very well qualified people kicking around who, for various reasons, don't have an official certificate to prove it.)

  • mrfr0g (unregistered) in reply to Mike
    Mike:
    @EvilSnack I agree. I saw "entry level" positions that wanted people with 10+ years of all the above (being things like SQL Server, C#, C++) in a production environment through several complete ship cycles. I mean come on. There are some experienced people that don't have that and their are good experienced people that might never have shipped (or been involved in the full cycle). Say you worked at MS from 2003-2007 or so. You wrote thousands of lines of code leading up to Vista (the good bits) but left a week early ... sorry your not qualified.

    Another funny one I saw in ~2008 a company that wanted someone with at least 10 years experience with .Net technologies. I mean come on at least check to see if that new shiny technology even existed that long ago.

    I usually see something similar in my profession. Companies somehow want an expert in: PHP, ASP, ASP.NET, Ruby, Java, Perl and Python. Oh and don't forget Javascript, and CSS. It's like they find all of the current, "popular" languages and throw them up on a jobs board.

  • ¯\(°_o)/¯ I DUNNO LOL (unregistered)

    TRWTF is when people stopped being "personnel" and "employees" and started becoming some kind of fungible "resources" like salt in an underground mine. At least they still consider us to be "human"... more or less.

  • (cs) in reply to ceiswyn
    ceiswyn:
    Along with the oath not to bring into the Library or kindle therein any fire or flame.

    \o

    Ahoy-hoy fellow quasi-alumnus!! I didn't bother graduating either.

  • (cs) in reply to Cujo
    Cujo:
    Does HR need an affadavit to certify they had a lobotomy before working in HR?
    I wonder if Regina was allowed to work in HR without proving that she's human.
  • (cs) in reply to Kevin
    Kevin:
    Makes sense, doesn't it? I've also applied to places that ask for your transcript mailed to them directly from the university. Can't forge it if you never handled it.

    Forge it. Walk into the mail room. And put in the outbox.

    Mail room is public at a few places I've been to.

    At some point companies have to accept the risk in hiring someone. Rather get someone that appeals to honesty than someone with a beefed up resume.

  • Roby McAndrew (unregistered)

    I worked slightly hard for several years to get those pieces of paper, and no-one has ever asked to see them. Ever.

    I'm a bit upset about it, to tell the truth.

  • Cogo the Barbarian (unregistered) in reply to trtrwtf
    trtrwtf:
    The WTF is that a notarized affidavit of "no education" would be the easiest thing in the world to provide. Just write down something like "I have no academic credentials beyond a high school diploma"

    ... in crayon.

  • Chelloveck (unregistered) in reply to Anonymous Bob
    Anonymous Bob:
    The real WTF is that a "startup" already has such a dismal HR department. In most small companies I've seen, the HR department is one person who is personally known by the founders. They would certainly rubber stamp anyone the company was actively courting. It usually takes years of "success" and growth for HR to become filled with this sort of mental concrete.

    "They - specifically, their overlords at WTF Ventures, Inc. - prided themselves ..."

    Sounds like the startup was funded by some venture capital firm that wanted to keep tight reins on the companies they fund by vetting new hires through their own HR people. Not an entirely uncommon practice. It might (might) even help in cases where the startup's founders are technically bright but inexperienced in the whole messy "business" side of things that most engineers want to stay far away from.

    Captcha: "uxor", the Unsigned XOR instruction

  • ceiswyn (unregistered) in reply to eViLegion
    eViLegion:
    \o

    Ahoy-hoy fellow quasi-alumnus!! I didn't bother graduating either.

    We're in good company, as far as I can tell :)

    It just seems like unnecessary faff, and those annoying exam things waste enough of the punting season as it is!

  • noname (unregistered)

    She just want to be sure that he dropped out of high school instead of elementary.

  • foo (unregistered)

    Easy: http://vdownload.eu/watch/7615982-futurama-1acv11-quot-mars-university-quot.html (@4:00)

  • (cs)

    My best friend, bored to tears with high school, left after her junior year to enroll at the local college. The college admitted her on probation, and she completed her first year with honors. She then transferred to a much larger university. The fully-accredited university accepted her as a regular student, never questioning the lack of a high-school diploma. She graduated with a bachelor's degree in mathematics in 1984.

    Fast-forward about 25 years, to when my friend decided to take some computer classes at a for-profit vocational school. The vocational school refused to accept her as a student--because she didn't have a high-school diploma! The four-year college degree wouldn't suffice; by gum, V******a College doesn't make exceptions for anyone. She would just have to earn a GED if she wanted to attend their institution.

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