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Admin
Some of the managers I've worked for frequently make ridiculous demands like that. I usually just chalk it up to a brain-fart from a manager who takes on too much and can't keep track of anything.
If, on the other hand, the manager tries to hold/blame me on their own stupidity, I just yes-them to death while making finding a new position job-one.
-- Never argue with an idiot - people might not know who is who
Admin
If you think smart people can't be sloppy typists, you haven't worked around engineers much.
Admin
My question for the manager:
If I give you the results on Friday, why do we bother sending out the email next week at all?
Admin
I was never a member of MENSA, but for about a year I was a member of an even higher-IQ society. There are three or for of them. Depending on the society, you have to be in the top .1% or .01% or four or five standard deviations above the norm. Usually the name reflects that requirement in some obscure way. They look down on MENSA as a place for people who had to take 17 or 18 different IQ tests until they got in. The society I belonged to had a monthly journal. The typical journal article was written by someone with no background in whatever he was writing about (but SMART! so he could see things experts couldn't!) suggesting a new line of inquiry the experts should investigate thoroughly and then thank him for. (What if the universe really were a finite sphere but it appeared infinite because the farther away you get from the center, the smaller you get? So that the edge of the sphere is actually the limit? You probably don't understand limits so I'll explain them to you in the next fourteen paragraphs. So you see, you'd never actually reach the edge because you keep getting smaller so you think it's infinite. I have all the math in my head but I don't feel like writing it down, but it's all in what I just said so I freely give it to whatever physicist wants to be the next Einstein. Fame and fortune aren't for me.) Every society needs a constitution, so the leaders solicited sample constitutions from the membership. Many readers wrote up constitutions. An article on "anomalies in voting systems" had just appeared in Scientific American (for example, Fred, Dave and Bill are running; 60% would rather have Dave or Bill than Fred but Fred wins 40 to 30 to 30), so each constitution had three or four paragraphs of the usual constitution stuff followed by a voting procedure several pages long. For the rest of the year until my membership lapsed, the letters to the editor were arguments about voting systems.
Admin
Actually its Proverbs 26:4-5...
Admin
I agree with your premise that communication is the responsibility of both parties; however, that responsibility doesn't need to be shared evenly and in some cases one party may so confound the other that communication is impossible.
Case in point: I once generated some online graphs showing all of our various data in different levels of detail. All was great with daily, monthly, and yearly graphs. When it came time to dealing with quarterly graphs, we had a massive miscommunication that I must sadly admit I was unable to overcome.
My customer insisted that the graphs were exactly what she wanted, except the quarterly graphs were wrong because (in this particular case) I was dividing yearly data by four and not five.
For hours I tried to explain there are four quarters in a year in much the same way there are four quarters in a dollar. In hopes of trying to find some common ground, I asked her to show me the five quarters. She began that January 1st was the beginning of a quarter, April 1st was the beginning of the second quarter, July 1st was the beginning of the 3rd quarter, October 1st was the beginning of the 4th quarter, and because you had to end it, December 31 was then end of the quarter. Logically, since she clearly pointed out five (not four) dates, then the data must be divided by five.
At some point I yielded saying I would generate a graph that divides the data by five, but I refuse to label it "Quarterly" because that simply is not correct.
At this point I believe she started yelling and I think there was some crying involved.
I accept the issue is my fault because I was unable to communicate reality in a clear and understandable manner. So what do you do when logic, reason, analogy, pictures, and math fail?
Admin
Admin
Hmmm, but wouldn't the denominator also be 0? And 0/0 is indeterminate, so it'd be more like Option A - NaN% Option B - NaN% Option C - NaN% Option D - NaN%
which would be befittinfly WTFish anyway...
Admin
Wow, GOOGLE needs you! Better head on over to translate (Spanish to English), type in "mensa", and watch the result, stupid.
Not you. The result is "stupid". Maybe many Google employees have an issue with MENSA - probably taken in by AMWAY/QUIXTAR as well?
Admin
Enough with the polluting of the threads with "what does ____ mean?" Jeez, it's called Google people, if you don't know, look it up.... Be self-sufficient for a change.
This story is either complete crap, or we're reading a very one-sided opinion of it. My seven year old can clearly understand you can't have answers before you ask questions. If the PM couldn't understand this, then the Boss should have, and....
So this guy just accepts this crap? Ok, so we're in bizarro world where the PM and the boss don't understand you get answers only after the questions are asked; so you work up the food chain people. The boss' boss, or that boss' boss will understand, and if not then clearly Martin is not in sufficient command of the spoken language to convey his thoughts on the matter....
And now back to your regularly scheduled "is this Java or C#?" subject matter....
-Me
Admin
That's better.
Admin
I think this result is what management was after in this case. It reminds me of when I was in college and working at a grocery store. Most of the employees were poverty-level income (~$5.00/hour) and either single mothers, or supplementing the paycheck of a low-income spouse. Hours of work were all-important. Whenever someone got sideways with the manager, he would cut back their hours for a few weeks. And when he decided to get rid of someone he didn't like, he didn't fire them. He cut them back to something like 13 hours per week, forcing them to find work somewhere else, where they could make more than fifty bucks a week.
Sounds like Martin got sideways with his management, and they jockeyed him into position to quit in a very similar manner. Not so stupid, after all.
Admin
Start taking LSD?
Admin
Depends on the country. Everyone in the world has not seen the "Easy" button commercials. Perhaps they have an "Easy" sledge hammer?
Admin
Why not just fire them? They'll get unemployment anyway.
Admin
Someone would have been happy with fabricated results
Someone was doing CYA at the programmers expense (so what is new about that). Probably the requester got confused about which Friday the survey results were promised, and was too much of a coward to step up and take the blame.
Deliberate attempt to set up the programmer.
I incline toward #2, though #3 is certainly possible. So is #1, but least likely.
Admin
Admin
I believe it. I've had similar requests for the impossible come by.
Back when I was working as a technician at a mechanical testing lab, we once had three large testing jobs come in at the same time. Each job would take the full capacity of the lab for five days, each job was rush priority, and each job had a deadline of five days in the future. When the engineer in charge of the jobs was asked which job was most important so we could prioritize, he said "all of them".
As requested, we did all three jobs at the same time, with all three jobs having top priority. The results for all three jobs landed on the engineer's desk twelve days after the deadline. There was a great deal of shit kicked up over that stunt, but since the entire department was in on it, and the department was indirectly responsible for 40% of the company's income, there wasn't much anyone could do.
Admin
It's not when they fail... it's when they've fallen sloppy dead.
Slick, yet Graceful.
Admin
Same thing you do to resolve a difficult programming problem: when one approach is failing take a new approach.
Also LISTEN, what is the other person saying to you (something we don't get at all in this WTF). In your case the other person is hung up on the five dates (four starting dates, and one end date), but you could have pointed out there are actually eight dates, the four starting dates, and the four ending dates. Then draw out those dates on a map of the year, block out the sections, label them 1, 2, 3, 4 and ask her where the "fifth" quarter is....
Would that specific example work? Who knows, but it would have prompted her to say more about what she thinks, then you turn that around again....
This is why technical degrees should include more time in English (or whatever language) courses. I don't really care if you can code an OS from scratch with a rusty nail, if you can't explain to a non-technical person why it's worth doing then there's no point in doing it, and you certainly won't get funding for it.
Being an uber-geek is all fine, but it will only take you so far. Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos, Larry Page and Sergey Brin all were techies, but they also could convey their ideas in way that was understandable to a layman. Technical prowess without that is the true WTF....
-Me
Admin
Ok, it's not uncommon,
Not understanding the linearity of time IS uncommon, and here we have at least two people who don't ...
Admin
Admin
This reminds me of a minor WTF I had once. Paraphrased as follows:
invitation: project kickoff meeting today 11am kickoff meeting: welcome yada yada awesome project you're all great, here's the schedule, lets get going! me: Is this schedule current? her: Yes, updated it today me: This shows here I started my first task January 1st her: (looking) yes that's correct. me: That's a holiday her: well I just used that as my starting day. Project adjusts for holidays. me: Ok, but do you realize that is also over 2 weeks in the PAST? That that means I'm already 2 weeks behind? her: ... me: Please either adjust the schedule or let me know so I can file a change control showing I'm already 2 weeks late.
I can procrastinate on my own, thank you very much.
Admin
Could we have a few more comments, stating that the word 'mensa /menso' does exist in the Spanish language, please? I am almost believing it does.
Admin
As a side comment, for everyone talking about English courses, they do little to teach Communication skills. IMHO everybody, from Management to Technology should probably go to a "how to communicate" course. Not that it'll ever happen.
Admin
yeah, sure. You can look on a dictionary http://rae2.es/menso
Admin
And therefore, more of them!
Admin
He must be using a base 13 Bible.
Admin
Hmm, is it possible that what was really going on here was that they wanted Martin to falsify the results in a way that the client would find favorable, all without asking him to do so? Sort of like "Who will rid me of this turbulent priest!?" as a means of giving the guards orders without actually doing so.
Just a stab in the dark here... I am more inclined to think the people he worked for were just plain stupid, MENSA or not.
Admin
I could answer that in three words. "It will fail."
captcha: pirates... yeah that pretty much sums up management types
Admin
From http://www.wordreference.com/es/en/translation.asp?spen=mensa
menso,-a m,f LAm fam pey dummy, jerk
Yeah, that fits...
Admin
The kind of people who think they can weasel their way out of explaining their stupidity by repeatedly pointing out "I'm in MENSA" are the main reason I don't go to the meetings... the other reason consists of people who think that having read and memorized "Robert's rules of order" is a substitute for actually having a point in a debate.
But the membership looks good on a resume.
Admin
The word is "yes" and it's about 1:30 PM in the Pacific time zone.
I'll take a certified cheque, money order, or PayPal. Thanks.
Admin
Unless it's an internal project, in which case you're an employee and can take the survey. Hopefully it's an employee satisfaction survey...
Admin
At least, the MENSA manager SURELY would have understood!
Admin
Option A - NULL% Option B - FALSE% Option C - TRUE% Option D - FILE_NOT_FOUND%
Admin
I hate to tell you, but pretty much most market research is actually done this way.
Failure to work like is the "industry standard" clearly is a reason to fire the guy (just kidding ,-)
Admin
What was that club? Congress?
Admin
He will build a time-machine, It will go back in time, He will be able to make everything turn out just right.
He just hasn't done it yet.
Admin
I'd suggest some role playing. Like so:
Programmer: Okay. I'm going to give you a question I want you to ask me. Before I do though, I want you to tell me what my answer will be. PS: How would I know that? Programmer: I don't know, but that is what you are asking of me. When you figure out how to do that, I'll be happy to implement it.
Chances are at that point the PM would explain what they are REALLY after, and it probably fitsd reasonably well within the bounds of possibility.
Admin
Wow.
I once made $15,000 on retainer as an on-call third-line support for a fault-tolerant system, the net result of which was that I was called three times for a total of about an hour. I thought that was good money. You've just beaten it.
What exactly is the problem here?
You only have two choices. (Well, three, if you count File Not Found.) Under the circumstances, it's statistically certain that the application will fail. That's a 19 to 1 on bet in itself. Furthermore, if you say "it will succeed," you have to make sure it succeeds.
The road to success is hard, painful and strewn with little pointy bits that get stuck between your toes. The road to failure is the road most chosen. Walt Whitman, I believe. Or was it Robert Frost?
Anyway, easiest $1000 you'll ever earn. Suck it up ...
Admin
"Sorry, this sounds like a basic miscommunication issue."
I disagree. I think the concept of asking for the results before the survey has been taken is pretty basic. This is a problem that elementary school students would be able to grasp.
Admin
BTW, what exactly is the point of the "reply" button?
Admin
you guys have seen the verizonmath stuff right? http://verizonmath.blogspot.com/
NEVER underestimate the stupidity of anyone.
Admin
Absolutely and amen! Often (not always, but often), when a PM (or manager, for that matter) asks for something and they get ANY kind of resistence (even if it's an effort to explain why they are asking for the impossible), they focus on the resistence not the content.
Admin
Unfortunately IQ score doesn't usually mean much.
I disagree. Your IQ score is a very accurate measure of your ability to perform an IQ test.
:)
Admin
Admin
Maybe there was a long, sad story behind this. Apparently, she had no clear notion of intervals and interval limits. Many people get confused when they notice it the first time. But fact is, even a single interval has two limits. Sticking intervals together (and therefore melting two limits into one), you will always end up with one limit more than the number of intervals (as long as you don't connect them in a cyclic manner so that also the last two limits melt into one). She might have had a cyclic picture of the year in her head, but I would argue that a spiral approach is the correct one here. She might also have had fruitless discussions and problems with other people on this special topic earlier.
Whereas this may be extremely trivial to most humans, there are always a few that don't get it. They didn't understand it in early childhood and continue to get stuck on it, for whatever reason. It may need some hours of concentrated work with her in a favourable environment for her to overcome this blockade.
There is also an amazingly high number of analphabets among us, don't forget this! And, of course, it doesn't mean that these people aren't perfectly reasonable, intelligent and full of common sense in many other aspects.
I believe that nothing is so trivial that there is not someone who just doesn't understand it.
Admin
Yea, it exist, and its somethink like that...
You can said: she is stupid -> "ella es una mensa", or he is stupid --> "el es un menso"
Admin
Start laughing at her while she's crying and merrily saunter off, having destroyed a stupid person's day?
See, what you may not realize is that regardless of how "correct" your perception of reality is, some people have this hard-headed streak about them that CANNOT - literally and in every sense of the word "CANNOT" - accept anyone else's well-described, very clear perception of reality.
My wife worked with this guy who would tell her what the "law" was on a particular subject, and when she would look it up for herself, take him THE latest law (not case law, actual statutes) he would nicely avoid the truth until she quit bugging him about it. Thankfully she didn't work FOR him, but we're talking about two lawyers here. You would think a lawyer that's been practicing a LONG time would be able to understand simple statutes, but alas, he only believed what he wanted to believe, and no book or person could prove to him otherwise.