• (disco) in reply to kupfernigk

    NEMSIS 2.1 dataset standard defines a series of "null codes" to be used to further clarify why a field was null:

    • -25 Not Applicable
    • -20 Not Recorded
    • -15 Not Reporting
    • -10 Not Known
    • -5 Not Available

    These were required to be sent in place of blank or null for most elements.

  • (disco) in reply to dkf
    dkf:
    Some auditors are pendantic douchbags from hell.

    Those that aren't pedantic douchebags aren't doing their job.

  • (disco) in reply to xaade
    xaade:
    This is what the "interpretation of art" has gotten us. No concern for what the author or artist intended.

    Lately I've read that it doesn't matter what the artist intended, the interpretation belongs to you.

    Subjective everything is just ruining our ability to understand, communicate, and discover truth in reality.

    Agreed.

    I recall years ago reading about a psychology experiment where kids were not allowed to be taught the meaning of words, because it could "interfere with their creativity" (or some such nonsense). They wanted to see how they interpreted things and if it was better in some way. Never did see any published results. Guess the pros couldn't tell that being creative and communicating that creativity were two different things. Or, if they "discovered" that, someone probably told them: "duh!"

    On a different note, this also made me think of this scenario (someone else originated the example): Someone says: "I like to box." Another person interprets this as that someone likes to "put things in containers." Expressing that interpretation to the originator of the statement would probably yield an amusing :wtf: expression. What was originally intended in the communication is actually important - if you don't get it, you miss the whole point of what's being communicated.

  • (disco) in reply to redwizard
    redwizard:
    Someone says: "I like to box." Another person interprets this as that someone likes to "put things in containers." Expressing that interpretation to the originator of the statement would probably yield an amusing :wtf: expression.

    Of course. What she really meant was, "I like to wrap objects around primitive data types."

  • (disco) in reply to Maciejasjmj
    Maciejasjmj:
    Yeah, because you can't get Catcher in the Rye anywhere. And they shoot you on sight if you're seen carrying it.

    Phonies

  • (disco) in reply to dkf

    It was more or less.

    There's this external evil demon army, and none of the kingdoms bother to unite against it.

    Just like global warming. All the nations are too busy bickering about less important things, like nuclear arms, poverty, terrorism, and hunger.

  • (disco) in reply to Maciejasjmj

    It was banned from school for quite a while.

  • (disco) in reply to xaade
    xaade:
    It was banned from school for quite a while.

    Yeah, like 50 years ago. Want me to remind you how censorship worked in the Eastern Bloc 50 years ago?

    Besides, it was "banned" from the assigned reading lists in some schools. I can't see any instance of anyone being in any trouble for simply reading it.

  • (disco) in reply to Maciejasjmj

    The argument is that people who think Orwell is about capitalistic greed, would suddenly become offended if they realized it was about socialism. But they aren't educated enough in the social and political structures they espouse and hate.

  • (disco) in reply to xaade
    xaade:
    The argument is that people who think Orwell is about capitalistic greed, would suddenly become offended if they realized it was about socialism

    It... is? Well that's one shitty argument you're making then. The amount of people who don't get 1984 is about "like, Soviets and stuff" is probably no bigger than the amount of people who don't know you shouldn't lick live wires.

    And why would they be offended? You keep using that word...

  • (disco) in reply to Maciejasjmj
    Maciejasjmj:
    And why would they be offended?

    YMBNOE

  • (disco) in reply to xaade
    xaade:
    YMBNonEarth

    "Orwell was totally criticizing capitalist greed!"

    "Um, no, actually, he was actually drawing a parallel to the oppresiveness of Soviet government, which was socialist..."

    "OH MI GOSH YOU INSULTED ME AND MY MOTHER MY SISTER MY BROTHER HOW DARE YOU"

    Stumped? Perhaps. In denial? Maybe. Angry? Happens. Offended?

  • (disco) in reply to Maciejasjmj

    You're spoiled by being around reasonable people.

  • (disco) in reply to xaade

    People are crazy, but they're mostly predictably crazy. Which is why I can see "angry" or "in denial", but "offended" is straight into non sequitur TDEMSYR territory.

  • (disco) in reply to Maciejasjmj

    Did you hear. Mental health conditions are natural if they don't harm anyone else.

  • (disco) in reply to xaade
    xaade:
    It was banned from school for quite a while.

    Which schools? How long is a while? I remember reading it in...err...11th grade? I mean, I know that various districts decide not to use it occasionally, and that's news for whatever reason.

    EDIT: Wait...you replied to stuff talking about Catcher in the Rye, but then started talking about Orwell.

  • (disco) in reply to boomzilla

    Never mind.... just forget I said anything.

    Maybe I should have just said...

    Orwell? I'm surprised that's still allowed in school.

  • (disco) in reply to xaade
    xaade:
    Orwell

    1984 was about control. The social ideology in force in the book or in your environment does not matter. The point was the average person was constantly under surveillance and could be punished by 'Big Brother' for stepping out of the accepted norm.

    Again, stressing the fact: 'Big Brother' existing and enforcing the rule of the day is the point.

    Kind of like what seems to be happening in various parts of the world today. I'm sure many of you could come up with examples - if you're allowed to post them. ;-)

  • (disco) in reply to The_Bytemaster
    The_Bytemaster:
    NEMSIS 2.1 dataset standard defines a series of "null codes" to be used to further clarify why a field was null:

    I am pleased to read this. In a lot of the data collecting activities for which I've provided schemas, people have wanted boolean fields which have actually turned out to have at least 5 values and sometimes more, such as Yes No Not applicable (your -25) Not yet checked Could not read Also (and this reminded me of Willard van Orman Quine's definitions of bleen and grue*) some fields require a date on which the value will expire or change.

    *WvOQ was arguing about the limits of knowledge and postulated the colors bleen and grue. Bleen is blue but at some future unknown date will change to green, and grue is the opposite. From a purely observational standpoint you now can't tell if a color is green or grue (though science will give you the answer, if you have enough of it.)

  • (disco) in reply to Maciejasjmj
    Maciejasjmj:
    "Um, no, actually, he was actually drawing a parallel to the oppresiveness of Soviet government, which was socialist..."

    Orwell was a socialist, as I recall a member of the Independent Labour Party. Animal Farm is about how revolutionaries turn into oppressors. It was about how Stalin's Soviet Union was taken over by the pigs/Stalinists and eventually aligned itself with right wing states (the Soviet Union helped Hitler prepare for war - perhaps Stalin's biggest mistake.) The precise point about Stalin's Soviet Union was that it wasn't, in fact, socialist - though there were a lot of genuinely idealistic socialists and communists in it.

    Orwell was recycling Yeats:

    Hurrah for revolution and more cannon shot! A beggar on horseback lashes a beggar on foot. Hurrah for revolution and cannon come again The beggars have changed places, but the lash goes on.

    (Management methods follow a similar cycle.)

  • (disco)

    AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH

    What's with the jellypotato here? I keep trying to navigate to a suggested topic, and getting fired 50 posts north!

  • (disco)

    If you only can read one Orwell book, make it "down and out in London and Paris". I can guarantee, you'll never want to eat in a restaurant again.

  • (disco) in reply to Magus

    The topic 'I'm Not Married to the Idea' still hates me, and continues to pelt me with jellypotato.

  • (disco) in reply to Magus
    Magus:
    The topic 'I'm Not Married to the Idea' still hates me, and continues to pelt me with jellypotato.

    NO_REPRO :P

  • (disco) in reply to abarker

    I once tried to enter it in the win10 thread, and it threw me over 300 posts. If I was willing to enter the likes thread, I bet it would send me to post -1000 and crash the whole forum.

    But using a new tab, as always, works.

  • (disco) in reply to Magus

    Maybe that's why I can't repro. I always do the tabbed browsing thing.

  • (disco) in reply to Magus

    Which browser are you using?

  • (disco) in reply to boomzilla

    Sleipnir. And it randomly started working right again...

    Who even knows?

  • (disco) in reply to kupfernigk
    Maciejasjmj:
    "Um, no, actually, he was actually drawing a parallel to the oppresiveness of Soviet government, which was socialist..."
    kupfernigk:
    Orwell was a socialist, as I recall a member of the Independent Labour Party. Animal Farm is about how revolutionaries turn into oppressors.

    Point for kupfernigk. Orwell's specific target seemed to be increasing British sympathy for Stalin, who misappropriate revolutionary power for his own narcissistic purposes. Most communist/socialists speak wishfully as if Stalin were an aberration, although nothing in the system has prevented other leaders from doing exactly the same thing.

    kupfernig:
    Orwell was recycling Yeats:

    Hurrah for revolution and more cannon shot! A beggar on horseback lashes a beggar on foot. Hurrah for revolution and cannon come again The beggars have changed places, but the lash goes on.

    The Who summarized it much more succinctly. "Meet the new boss. Same as the old boss."

  • (disco) in reply to kupfernigk
    kupfernigk:
    Implementing ISO9001 properly in a software environment isn't actually difficult because all the standard toolchains adhere to it. If you follow a methodology of reviews, walkthroughs, good discipline on checking in and out and merging, test and QA - that *is* ISO9000.

    ISO 900x is fine for manufacturing, because I think it can be proven objectively that applying a consistent process to make a bunch of copies of the same thing, with the objective of improving quality, will result in higher quality.

    It is debatable whether application of a "consistent process" will raise or lower the quality of the first copy of something new. The higher quality exists as a subjective generalization in the minds of a vocal customer base -- predominantly found in the old world, speaking languages with germanic roots.

    kupfernigk:
    My own perception over the years is that a lot of American engineers and managements resent something that has NIH written all over it

    Of course, everyone resents NIH, but I think there is more to it.

    With the original "classic" ISO 9000, the standards for manufacturing were defined by an international standards body. With the modern ISO 9001, the standards are defined by individual manufacturers' senior management.

    The common thread, from a software manufacturing perspective, is that the "consistent processes" are defined by the people with the least practical experience creating new products.

    kupfernigk:
    what actually happened was that people like [Deming][1] got little traction in the US whereas their ideas were taken up in Europe and Japan, and then came back to the US again - after their application by the Japanese had led to the Japanese manufacturing boom.

    Like any other management fad.

    While the ISO 9000 (family) proponents will cherry-pick from Deming's ideas, the results seem radically different to me:

    • Deming: the bulk of the causes of low quality and low productivity belong to the system
    • ISO 9001 determines the requirements of a Quality Management System (QMS)
    • Deming: Drive out fear, so that everyone may work effectively for the company
    • ISO 9001 certification is maintained by Internal and External audits, with "Corrective Actions" required when compliance is lacking.
    • Deming: Create constancy of purpose toward improvement of product and service
    • ISO 9001: He meant consistency of process.

    Seems like another well-intentioned set of ideas which can work splendidly when applied conscientiously, but can easily end up in disaster when applied by more typical animals (like pigs).

  • (disco) in reply to Crunger

    Consistency of process can work well for manufacturing (or will consistently allow some competitor to do better than you). It is a lot more difficult for services as there are more variables involved, and can't really apply to development of new products as there's no standard process for that.

  • (disco) in reply to Crunger
    Crunger:
    Most communist/socialists speak wishfully as if Stalin were an aberration

    Well, Stalin wasn't the only one -- I just say that Stalin and company had Marx rolling over in his grave, screaming bloody murder about "communism abuse! communism abuse!" because I suspect that what Stalin and co. were doing was nothing like what Marx had in mind...

    (Marxism, itself, is simply utterly impractical to apply to large groups of humans -- I'd like to meet the space aliens who made it work for them on a large scale, though!)

    Crunger:
    The Who summarized it much more succinctly. "Meet the new boss. Same as the old boss."
    Yep.
  • (disco) in reply to tarunik
    tarunik:

    (Marxism, itself, is simply utterly impractical to apply to large groups of humans -- I'd like to meet the space aliens who made it work for them on a large scale, though!)

    I suppose this depends on what you define ‘Marxism’ as. The way I see it, the ideology associated with Marxism, socialism, already existed before Karl Marx came along, that he picked up to use as fodder for the thing he actually invented: a system of ideological warfare.

    So when I read this comment, I automatically interpreted it as “[ideological warfare], is simply utterly impractical to apply to large groups of humans”, which made me lol.

    But yeah, socialism definitely seems to work better as a community-level thing than a government thing.

  • (disco) in reply to Crunger
    Crunger:
    It is debatable whether application of a "consistent process" will raise or lower the quality of the first copy of something new.

    It is well proven, though, that having a consistent process for releasing code once it's developed increases the likelihood of a successful release. And having a consistent process for testing code increases the efficiency of the testing. And having a consistent style of coding increases the maintainability of the codebase, leading to a reduced development time.

    There may be a large portion of creativity in dev, but we're not fucking snowflakes. We do a lot of the same things over and over, which can be standardized and practiced.

  • (disco) in reply to Buddy
    Buddy:
    But yeah, socialism definitely seems to work better as a community-level thing than a government thing.

    It actually works really well at the family level. It requires that you care about the others and have reasons to want to share stuff with them and sacrifice for them. That sort of thing is very hard to scale out.

  • (disco) in reply to boomzilla

    It can also work well in, for example, religious communities, where everyone shares common beliefs and goals. When the community is diverse enough that it includes a significant number of people with different goals, it ceases to be a community, and expecting behavior tied to the common good rather than individual good becomes more difficult to achieve.

  • (disco) in reply to boomzilla
    boomzilla:
    It actually works really well at the family level. It requires that you care about the others and have reasons to want to share stuff with them and sacrifice for them.

    Wow, you don't know my family at all.

  • (disco) in reply to blakeyrat

    Knowing you is probably enough, though.

  • (disco) in reply to boomzilla

    If you had family members like blakey then it probably wouldn't apply, so his questioning of your statement makes perfect sense to me.

  • (disco) in reply to locallunatic

    I had an appropriate qualifier that covers him.

  • (disco) in reply to boomzilla

    What? "It requires that you care about the others?" Yeah, that pretty much eliminates Blakey. (Or at least his public persona.)

  • (disco)

    Families are all relative, anyway.

  • (disco) in reply to Yamikuronue
    Yamikuronue:
    but we're not fucking snowflakes

    :snowflake: :giggity:

    :frowning:

    Buddy:
    Families are all relative, anyway.

    :rimshot:

    I'm in an emoji mood today. :confused:

  • (disco) in reply to redwizard
    redwizard:
    I'm in an emoji mood today.

    We need an :I_want_to_kill_you_for_that_terrible_pun: emoji.

  • (disco) in reply to HardwareGeek

    :@groaner:?

  • (disco) in reply to Maciejasjmj

    That conveys "terrible pun," but not the "so bad I want to kill you" aspect. Although it happens so often that @groaner might get so annoyed with all the @­mentions that he want's to kill the people responsible...

  • (disco) in reply to HardwareGeek

    It takes a lot more than that to send @Groaner on a homicidal rampage. Mention bombs a la Worst of the Worst, or being made to use the Discourse Mobile Experience might do the trick, however.

  • (disco) in reply to Groaner

    Dozens of mentions a day, like was done to @mikeTheLiar?

  • (disco) in reply to PleegWat
    PleegWat:
    Dozens of mentions a day, like was done to @mikeTheLiar?

    IIRC, that's a low estimate.

  • (disco) in reply to abarker

    I had like 200 emails from you dicks before I turned it off.

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